Upcoming Updates

The following future updates have been posted on the EQ Live site. ------------------------------ Upcoming for June 11th, 2003 It's been a fun month for the EverQuest team. With the recent completion of Veksar and the redesigns of Veeshan's Peak and the Plane of Hate receiving such a nice reaction from the folks that have visited those zones, it's a pleasure for us to be able to work on Droga and Nurga in the same way. Seeing so many new faces on the Test server recently has been a great. There's no doubt that we need as many eyes on the complicated changes we make to the game as we can get. We wanted to thank those of you that have taken the time to help us out by logging into the Test server recently; you've been of great assistance to us. And as players of EverQuest, one of the most enjoyable things about working on the game is the opportunity to add game features that we've always wanted to see. Many of them are listed below. We think you'll like them as much as we do. 1) Droga and Nurga revamp coming to Legends. The mines of Nurga have been inhabited by crafty Goblins and stolid Burynai for many long years, digging and slaving away under the earth. It's time to shake them up! The redesign for these zones will be on the Legends server, Stormhammer, with our next update. The mines of Nurga will be a fun zone for characters of levels about 40 to 50. The Temple of Droga will accommodate characters around 50th to 60th level. Both zones will have some new events and quest, while retaining the distinct feel of zones. 2) Veksar moving to all Live servers. Since the rediscovery of the lands of Kunark, there have been rumors springing from the ancient lore of the Iksar. Most of those rumors remain unfounded, as gaining access to the lore of the insular Iksar is no easy task. One of the most persistent legends is about a city that lies buried under the Lake of Ill Omen. That city was called Veksar, and it is up to you to discover the tale of its fate. 3) Group experience bonus increasing dramatically. We've been testing this on the Test server for a few weeks, and some final tuning may be needed before it is released. The goal is to dramatically improve the experience gained by groups. The old group experience bonus ranged from 2% to 20% for a 6 person group. The new bonus will range from 20% to 80%. In addition, the 6th person added to a group will not count when experience is divided. This means that in a group of 5 the total experience is divided by 5 then distributed to each member. A group of 6 will also only have the total experience divided by 5 before it is distributed to each member. Due to this large increase in group experience, we will be reducing the experience modifier given in Planes of Power zones. Those zones had a dramatic experience bonus. These zone-specific experience changes are more than offset by the increased group bonus. 4) Experience range increase for characters above 60th level. This is another change that we are testing and anticipate moving to the Live servers. It will open up many of the "old world" zones to players previously restricted to Planes of Power zones for experience gain. The range of NPCs that will be "blue" to a level 65 character has increased as far as level 50, with the "light blue" range extending to level 45. The best experience gains, however, are still going to be for fighting things around and above your level. This will open up areas for high level characters in groups and solo. 5) Shared bank vault will be added. There are times when a player wants to trade items from one character to another. In the past making such a trade may have included dropping items on the ground or asking a friend to hold them for you. To make such trades more convenient, we are adding two shared bank slots to the interface. Any character on the same account and server can access these extra bank slots. No-Drop items can't be placed in these bank slots, and only one of any specific Lore item can exist in the shared bank at any time. 6) Planes of Power access changes will be implemented. Planes of Power has provided us with valuable insight into the group and guild dynamics that are involved in large scale games. The way that we had expected guilds to advance through the story of Planes of Power has become a problem for some guilds as some members have fallen behind and found it difficult to catch up. Obviously this was not our intention. We want people to play with their friends and guild mates. To correct this issue, we will be allowing characters to enter the following Planes of Power zones by meeting a simple level requirement: Level 55 and over Plane of Storms Plane of Torment Plane of Valor Crypt of Decay Level 62 and over Bastion of Thunder Halls of Honor Characters that don't meet the level requirement may still enter these zones using the existing flags, and raids may still bring additional unflagged or lower level characters with them. All other planes with flag or story requirements for entry will still require those flags, and those flags can still be obtained as they always have. This will make the majority of Planes of Power zones available to characters over the minimum level, and will allow their guilds to travel and adventure together in the planes. We understand that those that have already earned the entry flags for these zones have put some effort into that accomplishment. We will be giving a reward to those that have done so, though you'll have to wait to see what that reward is. 7) Enhanced Spell Descriptions added. Spell casters spend hours studying their trade. It takes great mental effort to understand and master the complicated arcana needed to cast even the simplest of spells. We have added new information to the spell descriptions displayed in game. An additional line of text explains what the spell does in general and includes information such as damage and duration when appropriate. 8) A new method for memorizing spells. There was a day when casters only needed 32 pages in their spell books, with only 5 spells per page. These days spell books have 50 pages and 8 spells per page. Frankly, that's a lot of spells. We've come up with a new method for finding and memorizing spells that will make things easier for the overburdened spell caster. Right-clicking an empty spell gem will open a list of spell categories. Pointing your mouse at a category will display a list of spells. Selecting a spell from that list will make your character sit down, memorize the spell and stand back up. We know that many people are happy with the existing spellbook system. Rest assured that the spellbook isn't going anywhere. This new memorization system is an optional convenience for those who wish to try out a new method of managing their spells. The spellbook remains the only way to scribe new spells. 9) Spell Favorites. Spell favorites are an easy way to memorize a full set of eight spells without the tedious book searching. Right-clicking on the spellbook icon in your spell window will open up the spell favorites menu. You will be able to save your current spell lineup as a favorite, delete a favorite or memorize all the spells in one of your already saved spell sets. As with the new spell context menus mentioned above, this will not replace the spellbook, it is meant to make memorizing large numbers of spells more convenient. 10) Damage Over Time spell messages. Damage over Time (DoT) spells cause a certain amount of damage to the target at intervals. Currently, the caster of the spell is only told about the damage done the first time the spell does damage. All the other intervals were a mystery. What certainly sounds like an easy feature to add required a bit of work, but after the next update DoT spells will report their damage to the caster each time damage is done. If the new messages get to be too much for you, you can disable them in the Options window, much like any other type of damage reporting. 11) Improvements to the game for new players. New players can be overwhelmed by all of the items they find in the game (heck, so do those of us who have been playing for a few years). To help reduce that confusion, we are adding a Tradeskill tag to items that are used as components in trade skill recipes. To help guide new characters, Guildmasters will take a more active role in helping out new recruits by directing them to some starting points for quests. There will be even more quests in the newbie zones, most of them revolving around the pests that seem to inhabit even the grandest cities. In addition, NPC merchants as well as other notable folks will have a title that will explain what their jobs are. For example, a baking supply merchant can be recognized as such by the description beneath his name. Also, as a heads up to players that have created their own user interfaces for EverQuest, these are the interface files that we expect to change next week. EQUI_Optionswnd.xml EQUIhelpwnd.xml Bankwnd.xml BigBankwnd.xml Help.html

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me ranting
# Jun 11 2003 at 5:42 AM Rating: Default
wonder if the Firionia Vie server gets shared bank slots...lol

Also i think its a GREAT ideal to put a level cap on spells..i think it should be all spells not just kei and aego..it will stop alot of people begigng and help people play better..next thing they need to do is fix it so people will get rooted if they try to train...hah
bah
# Jun 11 2003 at 5:37 AM Rating: Default
wonder if the rp server gets shared bank slots...
shared bank system
# Jun 10 2003 at 3:11 AM Rating: Good
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183 posts
Went over to Test Server to see how it works...
1) cannot share coin;
2) cannot put no drop items in it, and I would make doubly sure that one toon was not picking up a LORE item that they already possess (but you already know that from experience)

The bazaar will become more interesting now that it is possible to transfer items easily (people who have dual computer/account setups have always had an advantage in this regard). Will have one character who does nothing but trade -- takes in the items to sell, and then has a pool of money which the others can use to purchase items. Can't tell you how many times I wish I could have taken some plat from two or more characters to get that really nice item that was 'on sale'.... And if one of my other toons wants to borrow a pricey, low-delay weapon to practice with, no problem in making the transfer.

This also opens up a whole new realm of possibilities when it comes to tradeskills. Instead of everyone having a mixing bowl, skinning knife, fletching kit, tackle box, etc. taking up valuable loot space, I can put them all on my bazaar toon, and s/he can hand them out as is needed. No more trying to figure out who has what in terms of pots and pans if they can all draw from the same pool of equipment.

Now I will have even MORE bank space to collect crap!
RE: shared bank system
# Jun 10 2003 at 12:04 PM Rating: Decent
It would be nice if they made it possible to put money to be shared. After all there are many times that one character may have just enough money to let another buy that item that's for sale that you really want, but that character's halfway around the world (or on another plane even).

I will probably keep these shared slots empty or filled with a couple giant capacity empty containers, to avoid any duplicate lore issues.
Nerfing buffs?
# Jun 08 2003 at 6:03 AM Rating: Default
I just heard someone in the game talking about the patch. He said that Sony is restricting people that don't meet spell minimum level requirements from being able to get buffs...like if you have to be lvl 46 to get a certen buff...you could get it anyway by having it in a MGB or if it was a group buff?...is this true?
RE: Nerfing buffs?
# Jun 09 2003 at 8:21 AM Rating: Decent
Well, I don't think that is going to be in the update they are putting out on Wed., but it could definately happen in the near future... that will suck for my necro :(
although...
# Jun 07 2003 at 9:10 AM Rating: Decent
there ARE 8 spell slots per page... and you CAN move the spells in your book... lol (i still like the new spell memming system though!)
RE: although...
# Jun 10 2003 at 12:09 PM Rating: Decent
Quote:

8) A new method for memorizing spells. There was a day when casters only needed 32 pages in their spell books, with only 5 spells per page. These days spell books have 50 pages and 8 spells per page. Frankly, that's a lot of spells. We've come up with a new method for finding and memorizing spells that will make things easier for the overburdened spell caster. Right-clicking an empty spell gem will open a list of spell categories. Pointing your mouse at a category will display a list of spells. Selecting a spell from that list will make your character sit down, memorize the spell and stand back up.


They didn't say they were adding slots to pages. They were comparing between launch and now. In the beginning spellbooks were 32 pages, 5 spells per page. Allowing any one caster a maximum of 160 spells. Now, with several expansions and many additional spells, you couldn't fit all of the spells of many (if any) classes into the old spellbook. They expanded the spellbook a long time ago.

They also were simply confirming that there USED TO BE a time that you couldn't move or delete spells.

They used this to lead up to the latest improvements. Category lists of spells and favorite spell lists. (I for one, often have trouble remembering what my spell list was when I have some specialty adventure I died in the middle of)

For me, this will be a welcome addition.
i dont like the "newbie" things they are adding
# Jun 06 2003 at 2:26 PM Rating: Decent
Adding Newbie Quests and things to help out newbies is great. but, when you start putting "baker" and "Shadow Knight Trainer" underneath their names, it starts to get crowded looking i think. i know i logged onto test, and 1) i hated the UI, i couldnt move it and i couldnt put it like i have mine set up. to force it to be stuck like that kinda sucks. and 2) i didnt like the titles undernames of NPCs.

thats just my 2 coppers
RE: i dont like the
# Jun 06 2003 at 5:31 PM Rating: Decent
are they messing with the UI?!?!?!? ACK!!! RUN!!!!!
Crying 101
# Jun 06 2003 at 1:11 PM Rating: Excellent
Ok....math time.

Lets assume a mob used to give 110 units of exp after zone bonus.

Now the mob gives 100 units of exp after zone bonus. This is less than 10% reduction, just over 9% actually. (An assumption on how much they reduced it, I know, but work with me here.)


Lets go over the two cases for new and old for solo and a grp of 6.

Before
-----------------
Solo: you get 110 units of exp (assuming no use of a charmed pet).

Grp of six: (110 + 20%) / 6 = 22 units of exp per person.

Solo gains 454% more exp than the individual in the grp of six. (/boggle)


New system
-----------------
Solo: you get 100 units of exp (assuming no use of a charmed pet).

Grp of six: (100 + 80%) / 5 = 36 units of exp per person.

Solo exp decreased by 9.1% (/huh, that's it?)

Solo gains 277% more exp than the individual in the grp of six. (/reasonable)

Grp of six now gains 163% more exp than they did before. (/cheer)


Summary
-----------------

Solo you go down by 10% but still gain 277% more exp than those in a grp of six. Important point is that you still gain huge exp. compared to the grp of six. Using my assumption of less than a 10% reduction in PoP zone bonus (remember, it's only PoP they are reducing) a solo player would now have to kill 11 mobs to get the same exp you used to get out of 10. So they are adding about 10 minutes of game time to do it. As a comparison, the grp of six will have to kill 31 mobs to get the same amount of exp you will with the 11 mobs.

I ask those solo people concerned, can you really say they have screwed you over and totally nerfed it? And now given that you will be able to go into the higher lvl planes with out flags now, you should easily be able to find mobs that more than make up for the small over all decrease in bonus.

Disclaimer
----------------
Of course this is all based upon a reduction of less than 10% in the PoP zone bonus. It may be more, but I doubt it. That same reduction affects everyone, not just the solo. If they were to reduce it too far, the gain to the groups would not be as dramatic as they wished. As well, if they go too far, then they will begin to infringe on the solo player. If they do that, then you have every reason to cry. In case you are wondering, the lowest reasonable reduction would be down to 61 units of exp per mob. At this point a grp of six would still get 22 units. The solo would now get 61. But in this case all you would do is affect solo players.

Feel free to rip this apart. I for one think it's a good thing to encourage groups while at the same time I don't feel they have hindered the solo artist to any great degree. Especially since this is a PoP issue only. There are still good places to go outside of PoP that will give great exp/AA to those solo. Bottom line is solo still gets the greatest amount of exp per kill, by far, and always will.
Crying 101 : Update
# Jun 12 2003 at 2:07 PM Rating: Decent
In case anyone is still looking at this thread I am copying a comment from the thread from patch day:

quote: "Two druids said they did notice they had to kill about one or two mobs extra per yellow, one said 3 (he was level 55). The 55 later hailed me to say he was on the newly unflagged plane (I forget which one) and that the XP up there was excellent and still soloable."

So it seems that my assumtions were most likely even higher than what was rolled out in game. That makes the argument I presented even stronger.

/cheer Sony
RE: Crying 101
# Jun 09 2003 at 2:54 AM Rating: Default
groups may have to split xp, but a group can kill more mobs faster then a soloer can. Taking into consideration med/heal time. I'm currently a lvl 52 druid who both solos and groups. Say i can kill 25 mobs in an hour, counting med time. A group can kill the same 25 mobs in prolly half an hour.

They should try to find a balance where soloers and groups get around the same amount of xp on a said time scale. Then everyone happy. Find a group, get X amount of xp in a said time frame. Go solo, get X amount of xp in a said time frame. Then if ppl like to group over solo there wouldn't be much of a difference. Like wise for soloers. Both gaming types are happy.

I do like the fact of the group bonus. I think in order to really learn ones character, they should group and solo both. That requires someone to use all their skills. This is all just IMO, and it prolly would be a huge pain in the a$$ to find and workout a balance like that, but that's what i think they should shoot for.
RE: Crying 101
# Jun 11 2003 at 3:35 AM Rating: Default
For the 52 Druid,

I think in order to really learn ones character, they should group and solo both.

As a 51 warrior, what's your best strategy for how i could have quad kited my way to 50 in 3 days?
Or maybe you have a suggestion for how i could better "learn how to play my class by soloing"?

Without dropping 60-80K on a fungal tunic or 2-boxin a wis caster, not to functional. Until they add a warrior "meditate", there's absolutely no way for a post 40ish warrior to solo for any reasonable amount of xp. (note i said reasonable, i could still go solo light blues for peanuts i guess).
/rant off
RE: Crying 101
# Jun 09 2003 at 6:43 PM Rating: Decent
Well in your example and using my assumtions from above, in that 1 hour time frame you would still gain more exp. If you can kill 25 mobs in an hour, the group will have to kill 70 mobs in that same hour for each person to get the same. (BTW, as it stands now the group has to kill 114 mobs!!)

To put it in a simpler term, when the changes are made, the group of 6 will have to kill about 3 times more mobs than the solo'er does. As it stands now they have to kill 4.5 times more.

I suspect that when the changes are made that the experience gain for solo players and grouped players will be fairly close to the balance you suggest. I guess we will know in a few days. I for one am interested in knowing how this will really play out as I both group (kinda have to with warrior and cleric) and solo (druid, mage and SK).
RE: Crying 101
# Jun 07 2003 at 4:32 PM Rating: Default
wow.......u confussed me....im good at math but come on.......
RE: Crying 101
# Jun 07 2003 at 12:17 AM Rating: Decent
Well done. And who said "when am I ever gonna have to use this?" during their algebra class in high school? Guess they are going to let everyone play as they desire to play, and I, for one, am glad for this group bonus. Finally SOE gets one right.
RE: Crying 101
# Jun 06 2003 at 5:32 PM Rating: Decent
I couldn't have said it better myself...

/bow
group classes
# Jun 06 2003 at 10:44 AM Rating: Decent
When I first started in PoP, I was having a hard time getting groups... druids and shaman were preferred as they could do more than heal and everything else I had was useless. Stuns.. uh, nope... Pacification... nerfed... damage, uhh.. yeah, right... my dd spells are a joke. Looking around for a way to get exp and not be a charity case, I joined up with a necro friend in PoN... we rocked... when we added a ranger, a shadowknight and a bard, it was massive exp. And, we had a group that worked amazingly well. Necro's have spells that are very group friendly. Rangers can do fantastic damage, SK's... group spells, damage, agro holding... way nice! We had a good time kind of... educating people as to the benefit of having other classes in the group?
When you can't get a group and see other classes lfg, try making your own group... with a little thought and ingenuity, you'll see you've been missing out not having these "solo" classes in your group.



Edited, Fri Jun 6 11:06:52 2003
RE: group classes
# Jun 11 2003 at 10:01 AM Rating: Decent
44 posts


Edited, Wed Jun 11 10:21:34 2003
my 2 cp
# Jun 06 2003 at 9:20 AM Rating: Default
Basically I'll keep it short and simple..
Whiners suck - no one wants to hear you complain. Don't like the changes? Adapt and overcome.
Spellbook changes = awesome
Group xp bonus = totally awesome
Soloing = only affected in the Planes of Power for loss of xp bonus and only being lowered, not deleted... I like
Experience range for 60+ = will they be clearing out places like lower guk and other old world places even more than before? When I hit level 60 I hope I like it :p
Bank Vault = great. specially for all these soloers who got no friends to help them twink ;)
All other adds = no complaints. All thank yous to staff who work hard to try and make Everquest better.
Danath - Paladin of Maelin Starpyre
P.S. Now if someone could just suggest that they make a paladin epic worth questing for instead of just buying a better weapon for 5k in the bazaar... :p
RE: my 2 cp
# Jun 08 2003 at 3:10 PM Rating: Decent
/Quote Whiners suck - no one wants to hear you complain. Don't like the changes? Adapt and overcome /Unquote

Sound like you are whining about whiners to me? Hmmm... you must suck then? :p

Mitigation
# Jun 06 2003 at 9:07 AM Rating: Default
What about better wis caster mitigation? I have a 60 cleric on Terris Thule and I will tell you if ANYTHING hits me from behind I am stunned now...which never used to be the case until they revamped monk/pally mitigation...a lvl 1 mob can stun my *** and sit there missing me for awhile...and if I am just passing thru a zone, I could be stunned several times...taking practically no damage, but still....what the hell? Update the rest of the remaining classes mitigation tables, it's pathetic.
New XP system
# Jun 06 2003 at 7:17 AM Rating: Decent
Well I agree with an adjustment for group XP...but do they have to reduce XP modifiers, which will trully ***** the soloer...And for those who argue the game is meant for grouping...who made that determination...I like to group and I like to solo...Sometimes I can only play during really off hours...try finding a group at 4:00am EST not an easy task...It seems if they have to slightly nerf the XP in certain zones to implement this new XP system they could atleast give some sort of modifier to the SOLO character...atleast a % gain if soloing to counter the nerf...Just my thoughts...

54 Druid Innoruuk (solo class)
52 Paladin Innoruuk (group class)
RE: New XP system
# Jun 06 2003 at 9:13 AM Rating: Excellent
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64 posts
There's a whole nother thread on this in the news forums, but I will summarize.

The OVERALL XP modifiers in PLANES OF POWER only are being reduced. These were put in originally to draw people to the planes, not to give out mega AA. Now, mobs will just give out xp a little higher than appropriate for their level instead of a lot.

To compensate, soloers who do not wish to participate in the group process to get flagged will now have access to the formerly flagged planes as soloers once they hit the appropriate level. This increased access should more than offset any XP reduction.

If your Solo area of choice is not PoP, you are unaffected.
flaging
# Jun 05 2003 at 8:18 PM Rating: Default
flag implementations = horrible idea
/agree
# Jun 05 2003 at 7:10 PM Rating: Default
Yes, i have a druid and this is also going to be bad for me. Is it going to be better exp in a group now than soloing. If so this destroys a lot of classes, and the fun of playing them. If this is true i am sure you will see a major decrease in played druids.
RE: /agree
# Jun 05 2003 at 9:48 PM Rating: Excellent
Sorry buddy, but I've always thought the point of playing a game with thousands of other players was to be a bit more social and hang out with friends and make new ones. I've been playing a druid for over 2 years now, and while I know I am one of the best solo capable classes in the game, I always look for a group whenever possible. This is a game about grouping and I think this is a great change and will help other druids to join in the festivities a bit more. Good luck out there on your own.
RE: /agree
# Jun 05 2003 at 10:43 PM Rating: Default
I disagree completely. For YOU the game may have been about grouping when it comes to xp, but for some of the rest of us soloing is a favored choice to level up. Verant is really effing over the soloers here, now i'll be forced to group to gain xp at the same rate that some grouping people are playing at. How fair is that to somebody who plays casually? By the time i can usually get a group i need to get off the computer. If you're a solo class (druid) and want to 'join the festivities a bit more' go ahead i won't stop you, but now i'm gettin
@$%^ed over so you group and gain xp faster than i ever will. The whole group system is based on the idea that 2 players will kill things faster than 1 person will solo and 6 people will also kill 6 times faster. Now people can kill 6 times faster AND get at LEAST 1.2 to 1.8 MORE xp than they normally would. This new xp system BLOWS...
RE: /agree
# Jun 10 2003 at 11:51 AM Rating: Decent
First, let me explain how I take the Anonymous post "RE: /agree"

I don't think they are saying they are getting nerfed.

In comparison to those who group, Soloers are losing some of the advantage they had.

WITHOUT EXP BONUSES:
Old Soloer gets 100xp

group of 2 gets 102xp / 2 = 51 xp each
group of 6 gets 120xp / 6 = 20 xp each

New Soloer still gets 100xp
group of 2 gets 120xp / 2 = 60 xp each
group of 6 gets 180xp / 5 = 36 xp each

So where a group of 2 used to get slightly more experience with 2 kills compared to the soloer's 1, they now get a little more.

The group of 6 used to need about 5 kills to get the same experience as the soloer, they now need just under 3 full kills.

This is assuming no experience modifiers have changed (i.e. non-POP zones)

The soloer now has to work harder to get the same level increase rate relative to grouping characters.

The above sentence, plus the particular player's preference in solo vs. grouping is where this complaint comes from.

If you know a couple of players who are always together, and occassionally you join them. You play solo when you're not with them, and they group whether you're there or not. If your play style allows you to level at the same rate solo as they do when grouped without you, then you can group with them any time you and they are on. But with changes to the experience for grouping, that may change. Now they are getting (from the above example) an extra 18% experience compared to what you're accustomed to. (Even more if there are 3 or more of them)

Personally, I solo part time, group part time. It all depends on my character, level and mood at the time. I currently have at least one of every class except shadowknight. (albeit between 2 accounts plus some scattered to other servers.)

I'm not taking either side, just offering the observations of what I see being the complaint.
RE: SHUT UP ALREADY
# Jun 06 2003 at 5:05 PM Rating: Decent
I don't know how many times it has to be explained before you get it.... YOU ARE NOT GETTING NERFED!!!

The SMALL exp reduction in POP ZONES )))ONLY((( are going to affect EVERYONE... I don't understand how you can be so STUPID!!! Even then, they are doing away with A LOT of flags, so you can go exp hunting THERE!!! OMG, you people P*** ME OFF....

Edited, Fri Jun 6 17:25:40 2003
RE: /agree
# Jun 06 2003 at 1:35 PM Rating: Decent
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94 posts
How are you getting nerfed as a solo class? they are NOT reducing the exp you get per mob kill because you solo, they are reducing the exp of pop zones weather grouped or not. You are still going to be able to get a lot more exp solo per kill then with a group.

This is a minor change to exp in pop zones, not a big deal. For those that group by preferance or class need it will be a large and needed change. instead of having to spend 8 hours grouped to get some decent exp they now should be able to do it in about 6 hours, a solo person about 3 hours for the same exp movement at same level.

What this does is make it much more possible for someone who plays casually to gain levels at a decent rate without having to play one of the better solo classes.

My main does solo 98% of the time, the exp reduction to all mobs regardless if your grouped or solo is not a nerf against my characters soloing ability, I will still get a LOT more exp solo then grouped, but I will be more willing to group as when I do I wont take as much of a drop in exp.

I really dont see what you are all complaining about!
While your at it....
# Jun 05 2003 at 6:51 PM Rating: Decent
I think a majority of the new patch sounds good, but come on! MORE and BETTER group exp? Keep that, that is good, we ALL need more exp, but what about those of us with chars that are not generaly wanted in a group?? Heck, Sony, why don't you just eliminate rangers completely. You obvisously consider em "red-headed step children anyways... At least give us a Normal fear spell BAH!
RE: While your at it....
# Jun 06 2003 at 12:05 PM Rating: Decent
Personally I love having rangers in the group. They have awesome DPS and definately up the damage output. Get them buffed with cleric and shammy HP and AC buffs and they are fantastic tanks able to hold agro.

I have never turned away a ranger from a group just because hes a ranger.

RE: While your at it....
# Jun 08 2003 at 3:20 PM Rating: Decent
Tanks? Are you sure? :) Ahhh level 51, I see. You won't find any Ranjors tanking at 65. They are only needed in PoP to show people where the Grave Yards are. :D

RE: While your at it....
# Jun 08 2003 at 7:47 PM Rating: Default
? are you nutz hehe lvl 65 ranger had over 4k hps Unbuffed in PoV yesterday he was tank for a named 66 lvl mob due to a dmg reduction Discipline he had when we where slowing him cause before he is slowed he tripple for over 900dmg fast after mobs was slowed my lowly 63 pally took over since i only got 3700 hps unbuffed man i need to finish ND and other AAs to get that Hp buffed up for me but it worked well ... and on the normal xp mobs in PoP ranger did OT while we didnt have a Chanter those mobs where 62+ so rangers can still tank but in long fights not recommended as theyr AC mitigation is not as good as Plate wearers... hehe but just wanted to mention that.
Spell level cap?
# Jun 05 2003 at 5:37 PM Rating: Default
I hope that VI and Sony aren't serious about this one. One thing about EQ that makes it a little more fun than other MMORPG's such as Anarchy Online and Dark Age of Camelot is the ability to buff low level characters in to near invincibility.

DAoC had the problem of level requirements on spells and if you cast high-level buffs on low level characters the spells "degraded" to a lesser version. Instead of the spell buffing strength for 20 it would only raise it by 6. That stunk since you used truckloads of mana to buff people and got bad returns. Also, you couldn't (in some cases) buff more than a couple individuals because you couldn't "concentrate" to buff more than a couple. That was sorta realistic, but still annoying. Nothing was worse than having to turn off someone's buffs because you joined a group and had to buff a teammate. The only thing worse was after buffing a half-dozen people, going on a quest and getting killed and having four or five people all lose buffs. Thanks, so far, EQ for not doing it this way.

Anarchy Online on the other hand used "NCU Containment" which acted like computer memory and only allowed one to buff for as many NCUs as you had. New players started with about 8 NCUs which could only hold a handful of low level spells. Higher level characters had as many as a few hundred NCUs and were necessary since high level spells required far more NCUs to run. The problem here was that high level characters had to be extremely selective with buffs as to not "overload" a character. When I was PLing a friend, my doctor could overload my friend's NCUs with buffs without even trying which stopped him from being able to cast his own buffs. I had to use far inferior versions of spells that I had in order to give him an advantage. The NCU issue also stopped a lot of higher level players from being kind to low levels and giving them nice buffs to help them out for a while. Again, thanks EQ for not making a limit on buffs based on level.
RE: Spell level cap?
# Jun 10 2003 at 12:52 PM Rating: Good
I can't speak for everyone, but I enjoy being able to buff someone with the best buffs I have available, not to make them invincible, but to be generous. If it costs me just some mana, I'll usually do it (if I have to travel long distances for it, I may not). If I have KEI, that's fine. I enjoy it. But to those who speak of 2000 hp and infinite mana at lvl 23... I've never seen it. The highest I've had a 20-something character buffed to was about 1700 hp. I just didn't have the same buffs I'm sure.

As for mana, I can burn through full mana in short order even with KEI by the time I'm level 20 as a cleric, wizard or enchanter.

I learned to play casters long before I was ever granted clarity. This was in the time before KEI and Breeze existed.

If Sony wants to put a level limit on spells, they should make is somewhat universal. (I can feel the flames erupting as I type.) What I mean is, if there is going to be a level limit, of say, 20 levels on a buff. Make it apply to ALL buffs. (So any level 60 buff could go on a 40; any level 30 buff could go on a 10; etc.)

While KEI is a nice thing to have, I frequently operate my enchanter, wizard, mage, cleric and druid without it.

For those who complain about having to stop while the cleric (or whomever) goes for a new KEI: STOP PULLING THINGS THAT YOUR GROUP NEEDS KEI TO HANDLE!

If my lower (sub 35) cleric NEEDS KEI to keep up with the healing demands, either my skills result in me fizzling WAY too much (so I go off and practice), I've REALLY messed up on my attribute points (re-make the character or get equipment to compensate) or my group insists on taking on too much too fast, forcing me to heal entirely too rapidly. In this last case, either the group needs to accept that I'll need to get a new KEI; they need to find a new or additional healer; or the need to change their pulling.

I can successfully pull off burning with a level 20 wizard heavy enough to chew up all my mana even with KEI, but it takes a lot of skill to pull that off AND not burn to the point of overtaunting and dying (losing KEI in the process) If my wizard is having to burn *that* heavily then: I have too little mana for my level (re-make or get equipment), I am trying to solo something I shouldn't be touching, I'm fizzling way too much (I go off and practice to bring up skill) or I have a group that's in over their heads without KEI. Again, in the latter case, either they have to accept I'll need to replace it, or they need to change their pulling.

Of course in some cases it's beyond the group's ability to control (Can you say, TRAIN?) in which case, KEI can go from nice to lifesaver.

Just a thought here. At level 1 Breeze is awesome to have on you. (it's better than meditating during a fight.) After level 4 it becomes a nice thing to have. About the time Chanters get to cast breeze, it's only a minor convenience. At that point, everyone is looking for Clarity at least. Which is good to have up until the time chanters get clarity. Then everyone wants at least Clarity II.

The big problem is, so many people do behave like it's necessary, because once they got it, they stopped living without it. My enchanter at level 16-20 had people level 5 and under bemoaning the fact that they didn't have KEI, so I breezed them to try to shut them up. One went so far as to say "Breeze just ain't gonna cut it, ____." (the ____ is where he used less than favorable descriptive terms)

Now it's all well and good that KEI is so useful, but when you are a level 4 wizard/level 5 cleric, why do you HAVE to have KEI? I know there's the attribute boost, and the mana pool boost, but REALLY! A typical level 4 wizard (untwinked) will use about 40-60% of his mana to gate. that's a 70 mana spell. So his mana pool is about 116-175, and he thinks he needs better than 15 mana per tick? (assuming a normal mana regen of 1 per tick without meditating, breeze ups this to 3 for 300% regen of mana without meditating. If meditating gives just 1 more mana per tick, that's 4 mana per tick for a maximum downtime of 44 ticks.) Why should a level 4 wizard need KEI?

If I could cast the spell, I'd be happy to cast it for people. I'm not keen on the idea of burning 900 mana to give a level 1 a full tank of mana (about what, 30-50 mana?) every 18-24 seconds for at least an hour. Downtime is a price paid by casters. Live with it at low levels (take the mana regen buffs if you get them, but don't LIVE for them). At level 60, it takes a while to get that mana back, even with KEI and while medding. If you get used to zero down time at low levels, you *do* become useless without it at low levels, even moreso at higher levels, and eventually you can be out of mana at the most critical times at high levels.

I love having KEI. But I get by with what I have. I don't make a special trip for KEI. I look for it when I'm not on an adventure and about to camp (i.e. the nights activities are over). But when I'm in the field, I advise the group I'm with when it fades, let them know how my mana is. If there are mostly casters and EVERYONE (melees included) want the casters to go get it, then sure I'll take the time. But I'll also be eyeballing those incoming mobs, healthbars, and keep evac or invulnerability spells up. If they want us to all have KEI, they plan on pulling big, bad or just fast.

I've rambled enough, and I've roamed a bit from my original intent, so I'll draw to a close here.

Just keep in mind what I've said. If a level cap should apply to this buff, why should other buffs be overlooked?

If this (or any) buff is a neccessity (at lower levels than a cap would permit), there's usually a problem with the player, the character, or the group/situation you're in.
RE: Spell level cap?
# Jun 10 2003 at 2:44 AM Rating: Good
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183 posts
If people want to power themselves through levels then that is their right since they have paid to play, but it gets annoying when their HOV, KEI, etc. wears off and then they revert to some non-functional state of pre-uberness (usually have to wait while they run off to beg for another dose).

Don't get me wrong, I'll take an MGB if there's one being offered at a convenient time and place (like 'here' and 'now'), but I won't waste my time looking for it. Nothing is more pathetic than seeing a bunch of toons milling around PoK like a gang of junkies trying to locate their next fix.

Frankly, I'd rather be baking...
RE: Spell level cap?
# Jun 06 2003 at 9:28 AM Rating: Good
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64 posts
As has been posted elsewhere, the cap on KEI is still in test and has not been published as in this update (note, this is an update, NOT a patch).

It's my understanding that they are looking at others ways to mitigate the influence of KEI/AEGO as opposed to a straight level cap.

That said, as much as my low level cleric likes it, she really should not have almost infinite mana and 2K HP when playing at level 23.

#Anonymous, Posted: Jun 05 2003 at 4:41 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) this sis so ausome i cant wait for the group exp bonus and i dont gotta work on flags muhahahahahahahahahahahahaha
RE: ausome
# Jun 08 2003 at 3:31 PM Rating: Decent
Should give you more time for school then, and the chance to learn to spell! :p

ausome
# Jun 05 2003 at 4:40 PM Rating: Default
Melee Upgrades?
# Jun 05 2003 at 3:14 PM Rating: Default
Ok, where the hell is the melee upgrades? Come on, warrior classes in particular is the most lacking class in the game as we speak. Most have keept quite and accepted that they will have to rely on proc'ing weapons to hold aggro, settle with the 50-60's dmg output.... PoP that doesn't cut it anymore, we are out-taunted by Paladins, Shadowknights, Rangers the list goes on. SoE, take your heads out of your asses and look at the damage mitigation both defensivly and offensivly and upgrade melees, christ, how clerly can we spell this out for you? Yeah, and for those who say melee's got an upgrade, you try using the /shield command, see how well that does when 4 POP mobs are beating the **** out of the chanter and cleric because you can't taunt em off...

Mothballed 59 warrior because they just flat out blow..
RE: Melee Upgrades?
# Jun 06 2003 at 12:17 PM Rating: Decent
I agree that if the warrior is MT and hes going for agro, he should be able to keep it with /taunt as long as the other classes arent /taunt'ing as well. Im not so sure its out of whack, however, since in PoI, there was myself (51 pally) and a 54 warrior and as long as I didnt taunt or get a mega-hit in too quick, the warrior kept agro just fine with dual wield.

Could I have gotten agro away from him if I wanted? Of course...a stun or two thrown the mobs way and the mob is mine. Should warriors be able to hold agro better, I cant really say since I've never played one but Im not opposed to upping the agro a warrior produces, just dont nerf mine. If Im the MT in the group, I want to still be able to regain agro on a mob that has targeted one of our casters with a quick stun.
RE: Melee Upgrades?
# Jun 08 2003 at 3:40 PM Rating: Decent
Why dosen't the Warrior just make sure he has good agro before he calls assist? /shrug

If Pally's/SK's/Ranjors/Casters can't wait for the assist... let them die a few times until they DO get the message. :D

As for peeling 4 PoP mobs off the Cleric/Chanter... all the taunt skills in the world won't help you do that. Get yourself a decent puller! :D

RE: Melee Upgrades?
# Jun 06 2003 at 9:17 AM Rating: Decent
I agree about the fact that Warriors can be out-taunted by the other Melee classes. The thing is, the others are supposed to Hold Back, let the Main Tank aquire agro and then help him keep it, not take it from him. Most casters have already learned this. Perhaps it is the adrenaline of getting up on the critter and beating it's face in? The only time the others should be agro'd is when they are peeling it off the 'Chanter, Cleric, etc. Then they and the toon that got the mob peeled off them need to back down and give the MT the chance to get agro back again.

This is called Strategy. This allows everyone to beat on the MoB intelligently. I have played a 52 Ranger and understand this concept very well. Just because I CAN outdamage the MT doesn't mean I SHOULD. I admit, warriors could use a few massive damage weapons. Perhaps an UberTaunt AA ability. But don't just whine here about how you get out-taunted, educate your fellow players in the game. Teach them by example and you'll be heard by far more than those that read these posts...

Domnall (used to be 52 Ranger)
Eevill 49 Necromancer
RE: Melee Upgrades?
# Jun 05 2003 at 10:15 PM Rating: Decent
I am in so much aggreement with you, I just hate the fact that puny little DE SHD can hold aggro better then my awesome all powerful Vah Shir Warrior. Everyday i see tells about how Pally's, Shadowknights, and Rangers can take aggro from Warrior's like taking candie from a baby. This is not right. Warrior's should be able to hold aggro better then all. That /shield ability is just plane crap. Warrior's have no spells to cast (unless u have an armor effect or weapon effect), A warrior's strength alone should be the taunter. The power of a hit from a Warrior should **** a mob off to the point that they want you and only you. I just hate hearing peeps saying that all a Warrior is good for is "a meat shield". Yea i know i will get flak for this posting but oh well. A puny little ShadowKnight and an arrow spitting Ranger should not hold better aggro. The only class i consider worthy other then a Warrior is a Paladin. Read the history books, the Greek Mythology's. Just like the Druid with that pathetic pet bear, it's a stuffed animal is all. In actuality, a Druid should have a Raven,Crow,Magpie, etc for a pet. Ok i just wanted to vent. I feel better now. I really don't care what any of you think about my comment so don't bother responding. Oh yea. i think the new patch will be nice
#Anonymous, Posted: Jun 07 2003 at 5:47 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) So let me get this straight someone who worships the god of HATE shouldnt know how to get a mob to HATE him more then a overgrow kitty with no litter box? Hello "GOD OF HATE" you understand now why we should have better agro control? or should you be able to hit harder, hold agro better, have more ac/hp. Woot i bet the SK would be fun to play if he was just a water down warrior. As far as the druid thing goes uh this is EQ we anit it greek mythology and if we are could someone tell me what zeus drops pls. This is my impression of soulspirit "I R GOD HEAR ME ROAR ROOOOOOOAAAARRR" :P
kei
# Jun 05 2003 at 3:13 PM Rating: Default
Sorry but recommended level is a very very idiotic way of handling their "no fun" policy. Many people just toss items into the junk heap that normally would have been useful to a level 1-50 but it's recommended higher and the stats it has is not of level 50 calibur more like level 50 calibur back in kunkark age. Putting recommended level on kei is retarded, either you get a god damn spell on you or you don't. I don't want anything halfway and I'd imaging others would agree unless they are total pussies ready to bend over and take anything sony like to shove up there...

Liveye (lvl 64 Wizard)
Trading and kei
# Jun 05 2003 at 2:51 PM Rating: Default
Trading items back and forth from my ranger and bard will help me alot reducing the channce it gets taken or pickep up off the ground. My opinion on kei would be a reccomended level instead of required. That way instead of being too good for the lower levels it would be rather useless for a level one to get it. After they gain more levels it would get better and better instead of being so great all the way up.

7th Hammer Server
Arnathin 40 Ranger
Changes
# Jun 05 2003 at 2:46 PM Rating: Default

All these changes were a great idea, espicially the group exp and dot damage...well and the shard bank slot are uber. Guess they finally accept that people are gonna twink..and they may as well make people happy by making that easier. All I can say to these changes are WTG!, I cant wait to experiance them

Hinastorm 58 Bst * I go my own way *
RE: Changes
# Jun 05 2003 at 2:47 PM Rating: Default
Shared* =(
The spell addons...
# Jun 05 2003 at 1:29 PM Rating: Default
SWEET........!!.... took them long enough to help us Casters out..

lvl 34 Shammy
Fudin Starfire
Csll if u need some buffs....
The Spell add ons....
# Jun 05 2003 at 1:27 PM Rating: Default
Group XP changes
# Jun 05 2003 at 12:10 PM Rating: Decent
WOOT WTG Finally the light of reason dawns, in a social game reward social activities ---- GROUP TO THE MAX
RE: Group XP changes
# Jun 05 2003 at 3:18 PM Rating: Good
****** the shot gun* Sigh, looks like he's close to death maw, he's crazy so best to put him out of his misery. They made classes that are to solo and have weak group roles, until PoP soloing was completely useless, then it was great, now they again treat soloing as something less than grouping even though they are not changing solo classes to have a stronger group role. Everyone should be forced to play a necro or wizard to level 50 before they are allowed to have a valid opinion...

Liveye (lvl 64 Wizard)
RE: Group XP changes
# Jun 05 2003 at 7:51 PM Rating: Decent
i agree with you 1000000% Code. Though I play a Druid and i mix well in grps I do love to solo and to me this is killing soloing almsot out right .. who they hell would want to solo when you get that kind of grp bouns. Of my 50 lvls I woul dhave to say that 35+ were gained by the hard work I did.. not by sitting on my butt healing a Tank ever so often... hell in some grp I would cast DS simply to feel like I actually killed something, or at elast hurt it. Don't get me wrong I like grping and socializeing but this is rediculous to offset the exp in such away
RE: Group XP changes
# Jun 06 2003 at 9:29 AM Rating: Default
You two should really quit your whining. The exp change is going to help even things out per se. Since day one the classes that are forced to find a group get the shaft while those soloable classes get mad exp. Is is fair that a druid can solo WWs in PoN for a few days and gain 4 levels whilst a warrior can spend the exact same time in a group and only get 1 level?

You have had it good too long - now it's time to suck it up and take it as it comes. Soloing will still lead to GOOD exp in PoP - just not AWESOME exp.
RE: Group XP changes
# Jun 08 2003 at 4:05 PM Rating: Decent
Oh, sorry Mr. Anonymous... we didn't realise you were FORCED to create a character that needed to group to get experience!

I had a choice. I created a Druid, then a Necro, and now, a Beastlord. See a pattern? I chose these classes because I DONT NEED to group.

However, I CAN play any of them in groups if needed and ALL THREE add a lot to group play. BUT... you so called "Forced to group" classes, don't want us in your groups, because we are not one of the "Perfect group" classes. I don't begrudge you your little extra slice of the xp pie. So, why do you force us to play solo then moan because we get more xp? Bah, hypocrite!

RE: Group XP changes
# Jun 08 2003 at 9:03 PM Rating: Default
I am a soloing class (wizard) and I cannot see how you are angry at these changes. Nothing in the patch nerfs soloing at all. All they did was improve grouping. The removal of PoP exp bonus slightly decreased the insane exp advantage of fighting in PoP. This reduction affects soloing and grouping equally. Pretty sad that people are so moany about every single thing. I for one will be grouping alot more often if the exp improvement is worth it.
Group XP?
# Jun 05 2003 at 11:34 AM Rating: Default
I think this is a good GUILD tool also as it will maybe pull some groups that are in need of a helping hand or even just some together time to reminisce about first Hunts together..... You make friends in this game,this might actually get a few more back that you don't see as often....and all i can say about the shared Bank Space is i hope the POWERGAMER/TRADESKILLER/KS'ers dont go Rampant!

TY,
A Message From MR.Runonsentence
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