New player – what’s the best tradeskill for my race/class?
Old player – just take two gathering skills because tradeskills are a gold sink!
Stop saying that darn it!
Tradeskills are only a gold sink if you skill them up off of the AH or look at lost opportunity costs.
For those who aren’t business majors, the concept of lost opportunity costs is that if you use your raw materials to skill up a tradeskill then you are losing whatever gold you could have made by selling those mats on the AH.
In other words – I skin enough mobs to get my leather working to 375 – we’ll say that the raw mats, had I sold them on the AH instead, would have netted me 2000 gold profit (made up number – don’t care what the real cost is). As such, leveling up my LW to 375 has cost me 2000 gold (even though I didn’t actually spend a single gold out of pocket) due to the lost opportunity of selling those mats on the AH.
However, not everyone is looking to maximize their gold to play time ratio so for those looking to just play the game, here’re the deal.
Some tradeskills are good for character development only while others you can make money off of too.
Alchemy – the potions and transmutes you make are useful not only for your main, but also all of your alts, friends and guildies, plus, you can sell the potions themselves on the AH or the raw materials that you don’t need.
Blacksmithing – mainly useful only for plate classes but there’s some nice weapons you can make for your alts, friends and guildies – some stuff will sell on the AH for profit but for the most part you’ll be only earning gold by selling excess ore, gems and motes you get from mining.
Enchanting – the toon with enchanting will get more use out of it then your alts since you can only enchant BOE items for them. You can enchant for all of your friends and guildies though and the raw materials that you don’t need from disenchanting items fetch a good price on the AH. As an added bonus enchanting is a stand alone skill which means that you can either take tailoring or a gathering skill (mining, skinning, herbalism) to supplement your income by selling raw materials.
Engineering – useful for every class, this is a very self specific skill since non-engineers really can’t use 95% of what you can make and other engineers can also make anything you can make – you will earn very little gold selling finished goods on the AH but like blacksmithing, you can easily sell the extra stuff you get from mining. Engineering is almost no help to anyone but the character that has it.
Jewelcrafting – cut gems sell nicely and there is some demand for certain pieces of finished jewelry on the AH. The majority of stuff you can make will be useful to your other characters, friends and guildies and like the previous skills that require mining, the excess raw materials from mining can be sold for profit.
Leatherworking – excellent skill for leather and chain wearing classes, it will provide you with some income from selling armor patches on the AH at all levels, some specific pieces of gear and specialty bags at the higher levels (plus quivers and ammo pouches). Since you can only make leather and chain, this skill won’t be as helpful to alts, friends and guildies as some other skills, but will still be useful. Like other skills, you can still make some nice gold selling excess product from skinning on the AH.
Tailoring – another stand alone skill, this skill is usually taken with enchanting since the two compliment each other nicely. Like LW, tailoring has limited benefits for any character that isn’t a cloth wearing class, however, it is used to make bags and being able to equip alts, friends and guildies with all the bags you want is certainly nice. Like LW, only some of the finished goods have any real demand on the AH, but the bags always sell quite nicely. Since tailoring doesn’t require a gathering skill that means that you can take mining, skinning or herbalism to help augment your income selling raw mats on the AH or pick up enchanting (which is nice since you can disenchant anything you skill up on with tailoring and then use that to improve your enchanting, essentially getting two skill points for the price of one).
So what skills are best for what classes?
Alchemy – good for any class – everyone can use healing potions, about half the classes use mana potions and everyone can use attack and defense buff potions.
Blacksmithing – as noted, mainly only good for plate classes – there’s not much to offer for anyone else.
Enchanting – good for any class – everyone can use stat buffs on their gear and there are weapon buffs for every class out there.
Engineering – good for any class – the offensive and defensive gear can make up for different weaknesses of the various classes and the post-60 engineering hats are on par with T5.
Jewelcrafting – good for any class as everyone needs cut gems post 60, although the finished jewelry seems to lean a bit more heavily towards casters.
Leatherworking – only good for leather and chain wearing classes and even then, kind of weak for chain wearing classes during the 40-68 levels.
Tailoring – mostly good for cloth wearing classes as the bags really don’t make it worth while for someone who’s not going to wear the finished products.
As you can see, every tradeskill has a good use to the right class and every tradeskill can still earn you some gold, if only by selling un-needed raw materials from the gathering half of said skill.
So ignore the peeps saying “don’t take a trade, just do two gathering skills†and have fun being a professional tradeskiller!
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- Stop telling people to not do trade skills!
Stop telling people to not do trade skills!Follow
I'd just add that if you take your time, most anything you end up producing can sell for a profit IF you take some time to figure out what it is.
I started doing this with Alchemy the first day I got into WoW. I never power leveled it, just made enough each day to sell -- almost always at a profit. Same can be done with most other trade skills. Though, Blacksmithing will be a big money sink from 260 to 300 (and perhaps later). However, there are LOTS of profitable things in Blacksmithing before you ever hit 260. Sell a few of those items for profit, and you won't have to worry about losing all your cash on Thorium.
I started doing this with Alchemy the first day I got into WoW. I never power leveled it, just made enough each day to sell -- almost always at a profit. Same can be done with most other trade skills. Though, Blacksmithing will be a big money sink from 260 to 300 (and perhaps later). However, there are LOTS of profitable things in Blacksmithing before you ever hit 260. Sell a few of those items for profit, and you won't have to worry about losing all your cash on Thorium.
Tailoring, Engineering, Enchanting and Alchemy are all very useful trade skills, both while leveling and in end-game. A clothie can just tailor up a whole set the instant he hits 70 and jump into Kara. Everyone needs enchants, everyone needs consumables, and engineering gives you awesome goggles and a roflcopter.
That said, Blacksmithing's useless. I've leveled it to 360 and so far I have not sold or used one item that I crafted. I did it purely because I need a profession to keep me occupied and nothing else really sat well with the character.
What happens is people don't ask "what's the best tradeskill for my race/class" they ask "which tradeskill will make me the most money" and, of course, the answer to that is mining/skinning.
That said, Blacksmithing's useless. I've leveled it to 360 and so far I have not sold or used one item that I crafted. I did it purely because I need a profession to keep me occupied and nothing else really sat well with the character.
What happens is people don't ask "what's the best tradeskill for my race/class" they ask "which tradeskill will make me the most money" and, of course, the answer to that is mining/skinning.
Blacksmithing is hardly "useless". Many of the recipes before you hit the 250 sell, and sell decently. However, I will say that most of the stuff after 250 is largely useless. Of all the trades its probably the least profitable. If you wear plate, there are a whole bunch of BoPs that are worthwhile, especially if you're not into raiding.
Mining/Skinning is fine if you have a lot of time to kill. The problem with most gathering professions is that it takes a while to get a stack of whatever it is you're looking for.
An example use Herbs/Alchemy because I'm much more familiar with it.
20 Felweed and 40 Dreaming Glory will make 20 Super Mana potions. These are always in demand and generally sell at 120% of the value of the raw materials. How long does it take to gather the 60 ingredients needed? Let's call it half an hour.
Prices on my server:
20 Felweed 8G
20 Dreaming Glory 35G
Total Gold for 30 minutes worth of work: 78G (minus AH fees)
Gold per hour: 156
Now, I can take all those and make 20 Super Mana potions and mark them up by 20%. All in less than 5 minutes.
Profit for 20 Super Mana Potions: 15.6G
Gold per hour: 187.2
Now, I'm going to tell you right now that you simply won't be able to make that per hour. The market just won't bear that kind of flooding. Also, I didn't count the AH fees or other odds and ends that tend to cut profit.
The point is that, if you have a ton of extra time to gather, go ahead and do it. However, if you'd rather do other things than spend hours gathering, then you might want to look into making things instead. Its quicker and if done right, you'll be turning a nice profit.
On the other hand, unless you're willing to produce three, four, five, ten different things you'll actually get more money quicker by spending lots of extra time gathering. In that respect gathering is better, but its just too time consuming for me. :)
Edit: Completely botched the math.
Edited, Jul 6th 2008 9:11am by Caia
Mining/Skinning is fine if you have a lot of time to kill. The problem with most gathering professions is that it takes a while to get a stack of whatever it is you're looking for.
An example use Herbs/Alchemy because I'm much more familiar with it.
20 Felweed and 40 Dreaming Glory will make 20 Super Mana potions. These are always in demand and generally sell at 120% of the value of the raw materials. How long does it take to gather the 60 ingredients needed? Let's call it half an hour.
Prices on my server:
20 Felweed 8G
20 Dreaming Glory 35G
Total Gold for 30 minutes worth of work: 78G (minus AH fees)
Gold per hour: 156
Now, I can take all those and make 20 Super Mana potions and mark them up by 20%. All in less than 5 minutes.
Profit for 20 Super Mana Potions: 15.6G
Gold per hour: 187.2
Now, I'm going to tell you right now that you simply won't be able to make that per hour. The market just won't bear that kind of flooding. Also, I didn't count the AH fees or other odds and ends that tend to cut profit.
The point is that, if you have a ton of extra time to gather, go ahead and do it. However, if you'd rather do other things than spend hours gathering, then you might want to look into making things instead. Its quicker and if done right, you'll be turning a nice profit.
On the other hand, unless you're willing to produce three, four, five, ten different things you'll actually get more money quicker by spending lots of extra time gathering. In that respect gathering is better, but its just too time consuming for me. :)
Edit: Completely botched the math.
Edited, Jul 6th 2008 9:11am by Caia
I never tell someone that trade skills aren't worth it, heck I've leveled whole chars just so I had access to certain trade skills. However, if I were starting warcraft over back on my priest, I wish someone had told ME that my first char should run double gatherer instead of trying to level enchanting and tailoring. I was constantly broke. Telling someone new to go double gatherer on their first char is a GOOD thing, it's simple and can give them starter cash. Telling them NEVER to pick up trade skills, I'll agree with you, that is a bad thing.
I agree with Dil. For your first toon, it is good advice to take 2 gathering skills. Otherwise, you'll spend a lot of time farming slowly so that you can afford your mounts. You don't HAVE to follow this advice, but it really is the most efficient way to level your first toon (unless you enjoy running in circles farming mats...then, do whatever you want).
Once you have a main, then you should open the floodgates for crafting. Crafting is awesome, but just tough on a first toon.
Once you have a main, then you should open the floodgates for crafting. Crafting is awesome, but just tough on a first toon.
Which would you rather get from a friend:
a) a couple of potions,
b) an armor kit,
c) a weapon,
d) an enchant,
e) a big pile of gold.
Dual gathering professions are the simplest way to make gold, and they require very little initial investment. Other professions are great for making gold, particularly Jewelcrafting and (dis)Enchanting, but they take much more understanding of the AH and take time away from questing and levelling. That makes dual gathering more suitable for first time toons. And unlike, say, Alchemy, you can start making money off mining, skinning and herbing immediately, you don't have to wait until level 50.
And of course gold is universally negotiable. Whatever you could provide for your friends using a crafting skill, you can buy off the AH or the trade channel and give to them.
[Answer to the quiz is f) all of the above.]
a) a couple of potions,
b) an armor kit,
c) a weapon,
d) an enchant,
e) a big pile of gold.
Dual gathering professions are the simplest way to make gold, and they require very little initial investment. Other professions are great for making gold, particularly Jewelcrafting and (dis)Enchanting, but they take much more understanding of the AH and take time away from questing and levelling. That makes dual gathering more suitable for first time toons. And unlike, say, Alchemy, you can start making money off mining, skinning and herbing immediately, you don't have to wait until level 50.
And of course gold is universally negotiable. Whatever you could provide for your friends using a crafting skill, you can buy off the AH or the trade channel and give to them.
[Answer to the quiz is f) all of the above.]
PS: At endgame, Engineering/Mining is possibly the most profitable gathering combo thanks to the Zapthrottle. I have that on my main and a Jewelcrafting/Enchanting bank alt. Between the two of them my other alts are rolling in cash, which is a good thing since I'll need a Inscription bank alt by wintertime.
Quote:
I agree with Dil. For your first toon, it is good advice to take 2 gathering skills. Otherwise, you'll spend a lot of time farming slowly so that you can afford your mounts.
Not true. I started a toon on a new server and took engineering/mining for the first character. I had 150g when I hit level 40, and that took a week. You don't need 2 gathering profs to have lots of money, you just need to know when you need to buy and when you need to sell.
It's all about economics, opportunity costs, risk/benefit analysis, yadda yadda yadda. I hated my econ classes (even though I slept through them) and hate that the stuff I learned there is useful.
The reason people tell new players NOT to take a skill is because they are easier to level once you hit 70 and people spend a lot of money trying to do it while leveling. Thus wasting time/effort/money.
Example: My main is a 70 Mage – Tailor/Miner
Since day 1, mining has netted me a profit at no gain to my abilities or gear.
Since day 1, Tailoring has cost me money and only marginally helped me. MOST of the gear you can make is useless to you and the gear you can make that is of use – is often prohibitively expensive and often just on par with 5man drops.
Example: I found the formula for ‘Robe of Power’ (12 INT, 8 SPR, 14 Damage) and at lvl 33 – that’s great. Of course you need 2 of every elemental… Where am I gonna get that?
Example: Boots of the Enchanter. I got this one and Again – “Yeah, nice set!†Lvl 30 – 8 SPR, 5 INT… Oh yeah – I need 2x Thick Spider Web. That drops rarely in Dustwallow, but honestly – it’s a 40+ lvl drop. So – effectively – I need to buy it off the AH.
Looking back (hindsight is 20/20) I would have been better served by getting to 70 with Mining and any other non-crafting skill. Even enchanting for the D/E ability. I can farm massive amounts of cloth. I run 1 daily and I have the money to buy vendor thread or AH mats. No big deal.
Yes – the bags are nice. But I need 24 NW Cloth to make 1 NW Bag. That bag sells for 6-7G at best. I could spend the same time farming primal earth (the easiest and least valuable) and make more money. Easy.
Frankly – yes – People should not be discouraged from picking up a crafting profession, but entering WoW as a totally new player. It’s wiser to take up a craft at 70. You will use very few of the crafted items. I’ve taken Eng. to 175ish and it was moderately helpful, but the gold I spent would have been more helpful elsewhere.
I only run the Shat. Sun dailies and I don’t do all of them – I think I do about 7 – they net me about 65G. In 2 days I could get the money to P.Lvl Tailoring to 300+ (assuming my mage collects his own cloth – which equates to about 5 runs through VC, 3 runs through SFK, 4 runs through SM, a few kills in the Hinterlands for MW cloth, then off to the plaguelands for Runecloth.) My mage could literally harvest the first 3 cloths in no time (though most of them sell for about 30S – so who cares…)
If a new player enters my guild – I tell them Mining and Herbalism or Skinning. If they want, test out Enchanting for the DE.
MrEnglish wrote:
Not true. I started a toon on a new server and took engineering/mining for the first character. I had 150g when I hit level 40, and that took a week. You don't need 2 gathering profs to have lots of money, you just need to know when you need to buy and when you need to sell.
It's all about economics, opportunity costs, risk/benefit analysis, yadda yadda yadda.
It's all about economics, opportunity costs, risk/benefit analysis, yadda yadda yadda.
And a new player knows this stuff? 99.99999% of the time, the answer is no. Of course, experienced WoW players can make money just fine. Heck, get enchanting, and you could have over 150g within a few hours from the moment you roll your toon. New players are the ones that need the guidance, and 2 gathering professions is a much easier way to make money than buying/selling. That is all I was saying.
You don't HAVE to go that route, but it's much easier for the average new WoW player.
rusttle wrote:
Tradeskills are only a gold sink if you skill them up off of the AH or look at lost opportunity costs.
Alchemy – the potions and transmutes you make are useful not only for your main, but also all of your alts, friends and guildies, plus, you can sell the potions themselves on the AH or the raw materials that you don’t need.
Blacksmithing – mainly useful only for plate classes but there’s some nice weapons you can make for your alts, friends and guildies – some stuff will sell on the AH for profit but for the most part you’ll be only earning gold by selling excess ore, gems and motes you get from mining.
Enchanting – the toon with enchanting will get more use out of it then your alts since you can only enchant BOE items for them. You can enchant for all of your friends and guildies though and the raw materials that you don’t need from disenchanting items fetch a good price on the AH. As an added bonus enchanting is a stand alone skill which means that you can either take tailoring or a gathering skill (mining, skinning, herbalism) to supplement your income by selling raw materials.
Engineering – useful for every class, this is a very self specific skill since non-engineers really can’t use 95% of what you can make and other engineers can also make anything you can make – you will earn very little gold selling finished goods on the AH but like blacksmithing, you can easily sell the extra stuff you get from mining. Engineering is almost no help to anyone but the character that has it.
Jewelcrafting – cut gems sell nicely and there is some demand for certain pieces of finished jewelry on the AH. The majority of stuff you can make will be useful to your other characters, friends and guildies and like the previous skills that require mining, the excess raw materials from mining can be sold for profit.
Leatherworking – excellent skill for leather and chain wearing classes, it will provide you with some income from selling armor patches on the AH at all levels, some specific pieces of gear and specialty bags at the higher levels (plus quivers and ammo pouches). Since you can only make leather and chain, this skill won’t be as helpful to alts, friends and guildies as some other skills, but will still be useful. Like other skills, you can still make some nice gold selling excess product from skinning on the AH.
Tailoring – another stand alone skill, this skill is usually taken with enchanting since the two compliment each other nicely. Like LW, tailoring has limited benefits for any character that isn’t a cloth wearing class, however, it is used to make bags and being able to equip alts, friends and guildies with all the bags you want is certainly nice. Like LW, only some of the finished goods have any real demand on the AH, but the bags always sell quite nicely. Since tailoring doesn’t require a gathering skill that means that you can take mining, skinning or herbalism to help augment your income selling raw mats on the AH or pick up enchanting (which is nice since you can disenchant anything you skill up on with tailoring and then use that to improve your enchanting, essentially getting two skill points for the price of one).
As you can see, every tradeskill has a good use to the right class and every tradeskill can still earn you some gold, if only by selling un-needed raw materials from the gathering half of said skill.
So ignore the peeps saying “don’t take a trade, just do two gathering skills†and have fun being a professional tradeskiller!
Alchemy – the potions and transmutes you make are useful not only for your main, but also all of your alts, friends and guildies, plus, you can sell the potions themselves on the AH or the raw materials that you don’t need.
Blacksmithing – mainly useful only for plate classes but there’s some nice weapons you can make for your alts, friends and guildies – some stuff will sell on the AH for profit but for the most part you’ll be only earning gold by selling excess ore, gems and motes you get from mining.
Enchanting – the toon with enchanting will get more use out of it then your alts since you can only enchant BOE items for them. You can enchant for all of your friends and guildies though and the raw materials that you don’t need from disenchanting items fetch a good price on the AH. As an added bonus enchanting is a stand alone skill which means that you can either take tailoring or a gathering skill (mining, skinning, herbalism) to supplement your income by selling raw materials.
Engineering – useful for every class, this is a very self specific skill since non-engineers really can’t use 95% of what you can make and other engineers can also make anything you can make – you will earn very little gold selling finished goods on the AH but like blacksmithing, you can easily sell the extra stuff you get from mining. Engineering is almost no help to anyone but the character that has it.
Jewelcrafting – cut gems sell nicely and there is some demand for certain pieces of finished jewelry on the AH. The majority of stuff you can make will be useful to your other characters, friends and guildies and like the previous skills that require mining, the excess raw materials from mining can be sold for profit.
Leatherworking – excellent skill for leather and chain wearing classes, it will provide you with some income from selling armor patches on the AH at all levels, some specific pieces of gear and specialty bags at the higher levels (plus quivers and ammo pouches). Since you can only make leather and chain, this skill won’t be as helpful to alts, friends and guildies as some other skills, but will still be useful. Like other skills, you can still make some nice gold selling excess product from skinning on the AH.
Tailoring – another stand alone skill, this skill is usually taken with enchanting since the two compliment each other nicely. Like LW, tailoring has limited benefits for any character that isn’t a cloth wearing class, however, it is used to make bags and being able to equip alts, friends and guildies with all the bags you want is certainly nice. Like LW, only some of the finished goods have any real demand on the AH, but the bags always sell quite nicely. Since tailoring doesn’t require a gathering skill that means that you can take mining, skinning or herbalism to help augment your income selling raw mats on the AH or pick up enchanting (which is nice since you can disenchant anything you skill up on with tailoring and then use that to improve your enchanting, essentially getting two skill points for the price of one).
As you can see, every tradeskill has a good use to the right class and every tradeskill can still earn you some gold, if only by selling un-needed raw materials from the gathering half of said skill.
So ignore the peeps saying “don’t take a trade, just do two gathering skills†and have fun being a professional tradeskiller!
The italics are mine, of course. You make money by gathering and selling, and have fun by spending the money. You can also have fun by leveling a crafting profession, but you will never make the kind of money from it that you can from gathering.
My advice to people new to the game remains the same. If you want to have the money for a mount as soon as you are eligible to buy one, take two gathering professions. You can always powerlevel a crafting profession later, preferably much later. I just don't see how you can tell people that its only profitable if you take into account lost opportunity costs. That's like saying you will only die underwater if you take into account the inability to breathe. The two cannot be separated. And then when you try to explain your point by reviewing the crafting professions, you don't state it outright but you presume each will be coupled with a gathering profession. Of course that's important, but come right out and say it.
I don't begrudge you trying to provide the counter-argument, and you did a nice job doing so, just don't present it as the be-all and end-all.
Anyway, mining/herbalism will make you rich. Then you can roll a couple of alts and powerlevel every profession in the game. And you will still be rich. I did.
And I really should mention that I owe my vast virtual wealth to this board and especially to certain specific people like ohmikeghod, Anobix, emmetsvenson, and - oh heck, I shouldn't have started naming people because I know I'll forget someone.
Edit: to give credit where credit is due.
Edited, Jul 7th 2008 4:06pm by cynyck
"the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
cynyck wrote:
And I really should mention that I owe my vast virtual wealth to this board and especially to certain specific people like ohmikeghod, Anobix, emmetsvenson...
Send my cut to bank alt Hecubaa on Garithos thx.
emmitsvenson wrote:
cynyck wrote:
And I really should mention that I owe my vast virtual wealth to this board and especially to certain specific people like ohmikeghod, Anobix, emmetsvenson...
Send my cut to bank alt Hecubaa on Garithos thx.
I spelled your name wrong. I'm so embarrassed that I won't be able to send you that gold.
"the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
Quote:
Tailoring has cost me money and only marginally helped me. MOST of the gear you can make is useless to you and the gear you can make that is of use – is often prohibitively expensive and often just on par with 5man drops.
Problem is that with everyone going for the raid content now adays its getting harder and harder to do said 5-mans.
Think about how rough it is trying to put together a group for some of the lower level Outland content today - anyone want to run [instance]? - sure, I need badges! - actually I'm talking normal - oh, NM then. >_<
Now think of how much harder it is to run old world instances - when's the last time you had a Scholo or Strath run without a Outland character or two in the run?
Besides, how's about three end sets - my lock is still wearing his Shadoweave and not complaining?
Quote:
The italics are mine, of course. You make money by gathering and selling, and have fun by spending the money. You can also have fun by leveling a crafting profession, but you will never make the kind of money from it that you can from gathering.
I understand, however, believe it or not, people want to/like to do tradeskills for pure fun, so I gave an honest answer - you can still earn gold from just the gathering side of tradeskills that have minimal potential from the tradeskill half.
Think about it - if tradeskills were essentially useless aspects of a game then they wouldn't be included, but there are people who are dedicated tradeskills, who enjoy thier skill-ups as much as you enjoy a level-up. I had so much fun (and spent so much time) with tradeskills back when I played EQ that when my brother wanted to get me into WoW one of the first things I did was check to see if it had a workable tradeskill system that I'd enjoy - I rather doubt I'm the only one who thinks this way too.
I have to agree with the majority of posters here. Crafting skills are fun and useful, but not the best for the WoW newbie. I started my first toon with tailoring and skinning, but around lvl 20 or so switched to tailoring/enchanting. In retrospect, I wish I'd known an older, wiser player to 'splain me a few things.
But darn it I WANTED bigger bags, and I couldn't figure out how to get them without making them myself. (I sure couldn't afford the ones in the AH!) And of course, until I hit netherweave bags, my bags were never big enough anyway. (Heck, they're STILL not big enough! I'm hoping WotLK brings me the possibility of bigger bags!)
First of all, even with gathering mats, the cost of thread and dye was hard on my newbie lock. Heck, just paying for training was a strain. My alt, a herbalist/alchemist could barely sell her peacebloom or any of the potions she was making, so other than providing potions, she wasn't bringing in any bucks either.
Server economy is also a factor, I'm sure, and unfortunately the server I rolled on was very full, and huge numbers of folks could already gather or make anything I was trying to AH, so the prices for lowbie items were . . . really darn low.
Next is the problem that I should have stuck with skinning, but switched to enchanting at 20 or so. Which meant that I couldn't exactly level enchanting with the items I'd have gotten as I was leveling my character, because I was behind. (There was a long period of time where I couldn't de my own soulbound items.) As for de-ing every green I got my hands on, I couldn't afford to, as I had zero extra cash, and needed to sell everything I could on the AH. Nor could I afford to buy items from the AH to de them. Anything that would have helped me level enchanting wasn't affordable, and anything I could afford wasn't doing me any good. And since I could only afford to buy/de/sell the enchant mats with things that most often gave only strange dust, that wasn't working either. I tried farming lower-than-me levels, but that didn't work well, as green drops don't come nearly as often in low lvl areas.
Make tailored items to level my skill and then de them and sell the mats on the AH? Wow, now THAT would have been a good idea - if I'd figured it out way earlier. Instead I tried selling the darn stuff on the AH several times, and when that didn't work, I'd vendor them.
All of this may be bleeding obvious to you, and to me now, but at the time I was having enough trouble just trying to figure out the basics. When you're trying to understand how to fish, what your spells do and when to use them, how to get from Stormwind to Booty Bay, etc., the challenge of focusing on how to make money comes secondary. (At least for me.)
By contrast, I recently started 3 characters on another server. At this point, two are lvl 14, and the lowest is 11. The first two are miner/skinners and the third is an herbalist/alchemist, just so that she can provide healing potions to the others. Between the three of them, they presently have about 50 gold between them, with minimal effort. (And they already own decently big bags.) Contrast that with my lock, who probably didn't hit that kind of savings till she was about lvl 50 or so.
So yeah, crafting is fun, crafting is cool, all power to crafting. But as good advice for a first profession for a brand new player? Probably not. Mining, herbing and skinning are as simple as "see that node and click on it, sell what you get." Crafting, including de'ing as a is far easier for someone who's already used to the game, knows a bit about their server's economy and can plan out what items are worth making and which aren't.
But darn it I WANTED bigger bags, and I couldn't figure out how to get them without making them myself. (I sure couldn't afford the ones in the AH!) And of course, until I hit netherweave bags, my bags were never big enough anyway. (Heck, they're STILL not big enough! I'm hoping WotLK brings me the possibility of bigger bags!)
First of all, even with gathering mats, the cost of thread and dye was hard on my newbie lock. Heck, just paying for training was a strain. My alt, a herbalist/alchemist could barely sell her peacebloom or any of the potions she was making, so other than providing potions, she wasn't bringing in any bucks either.
Server economy is also a factor, I'm sure, and unfortunately the server I rolled on was very full, and huge numbers of folks could already gather or make anything I was trying to AH, so the prices for lowbie items were . . . really darn low.
Next is the problem that I should have stuck with skinning, but switched to enchanting at 20 or so. Which meant that I couldn't exactly level enchanting with the items I'd have gotten as I was leveling my character, because I was behind. (There was a long period of time where I couldn't de my own soulbound items.) As for de-ing every green I got my hands on, I couldn't afford to, as I had zero extra cash, and needed to sell everything I could on the AH. Nor could I afford to buy items from the AH to de them. Anything that would have helped me level enchanting wasn't affordable, and anything I could afford wasn't doing me any good. And since I could only afford to buy/de/sell the enchant mats with things that most often gave only strange dust, that wasn't working either. I tried farming lower-than-me levels, but that didn't work well, as green drops don't come nearly as often in low lvl areas.
Make tailored items to level my skill and then de them and sell the mats on the AH? Wow, now THAT would have been a good idea - if I'd figured it out way earlier. Instead I tried selling the darn stuff on the AH several times, and when that didn't work, I'd vendor them.
All of this may be bleeding obvious to you, and to me now, but at the time I was having enough trouble just trying to figure out the basics. When you're trying to understand how to fish, what your spells do and when to use them, how to get from Stormwind to Booty Bay, etc., the challenge of focusing on how to make money comes secondary. (At least for me.)
By contrast, I recently started 3 characters on another server. At this point, two are lvl 14, and the lowest is 11. The first two are miner/skinners and the third is an herbalist/alchemist, just so that she can provide healing potions to the others. Between the three of them, they presently have about 50 gold between them, with minimal effort. (And they already own decently big bags.) Contrast that with my lock, who probably didn't hit that kind of savings till she was about lvl 50 or so.
So yeah, crafting is fun, crafting is cool, all power to crafting. But as good advice for a first profession for a brand new player? Probably not. Mining, herbing and skinning are as simple as "see that node and click on it, sell what you get." Crafting, including de'ing as a is far easier for someone who's already used to the game, knows a bit about their server's economy and can plan out what items are worth making and which aren't.
Quote:
So yeah, crafting is fun, crafting is cool, all power to crafting. But as good advice for a first profession for a brand new player? Probably not. Mining, herbing and skinning are as simple as "see that node and click on it, sell what you get." Crafting, including de'ing as a is far easier for someone who's already used to the game, knows a bit about their server's economy and can plan out what items are worth making and which aren't.
IF and only IF this was their very first MMORPG would I ever really recommend that route. Anyone who's ever crafted on another game will find fairly quickly what the money making recipes are.
Honestly, how hard is it to answer a few questions?
1.) What is the total cost to make X.
2.) Can I sell whatever the end product is for more than X?
3.) Does it sell well? If so, how many should I make?
4.) Profit.
Admittedly, the first 20-30 levels of any given craft are a bit rough on the profit margins. Seriously, look at the recipes -- virtually none make any cash. After that it gets better. And by level 70 or so, they ALL have profitable recipes that sell well.
rusttle wrote:
New player – what’s the best tradeskill for my race/class?
Old player – just take two gathering skills because tradeskills are a gold sink!
Stop saying that darn it!
Tradeskills are only a gold sink if you skill them up off of the AH or look at lost opportunity costs.
Old player – just take two gathering skills because tradeskills are a gold sink!
Stop saying that darn it!
Tradeskills are only a gold sink if you skill them up off of the AH or look at lost opportunity costs.
Rusttle, you're completely wrong. Ignorance of the concepts or of the market does NOT make tradeskills any less of a gold sink. They are, by and large, inferior to gathering skills. At any given level, 1/4-1/8 of the items on the AH will be crafted items. The BoEs from the world, providing you have a decent population, will give you better choices on what to get. Why do you want to wear the + agility/spirit leather armor you made, when you could get "Of the tiger" with twice the DPS stats, and zero time spent leveling (and sinking money into worthless items) a tradeskill?
It is a gold sink and a time sink. The vast majority of items you make you won't use. Those you don't use you can sell, usually for less than the material cost. Those that you can't AH you vendor, definitely for less than the material cost. You also need to spend money on the recipes, and spend time running around cities, from AH, to mail, to crafting location, to profession trainers, to AH, etc. This is added onto the time spent out in the field farming for stuff... which you'd do anyway with gathering!
The ONLY professions I really consider leveling while I level are engineering and alchemy. Both of them will always be helpful, and you'll use the items you make (mostly because they can't sell, but often because they are pretty darn useful). You'll have excess, but it's not nearly as useless at some of the other professions.
When you hit 70, you can make hundreds of gold an hour without the skills and your perspective shifts. Now you aren't investing 3000 gold in a primary profession in order to use it on the way up. It's the cost of the killer items you want. You want that tier 5 equivalent item? You realize it will cost you an arm and a leg... but you already have your epic flyer and any BoE item you want, so it's time for the best.
Telling people to not take trade skills, I'll agree, is stupid. Telling people that taking a trade skill is inefficient, in both gold-making and time, is the truth. And again, even if you ignore the arguments, it will still be true.
Just wanted to add:
The entire theory behind this centers on gold. Assuming that gold is not important to you, nor your time, I would still recommend taking gathering skills until 70, when you can more easily level primary crafts. Someone on this forum asked recently "Gold is not an issue, what should my character take up?" And I responded "Two primary skills, so you can get multiple awesome epics." They ended up taking a gathering skill and a primary skill. Apparently, "Gold is not an issue" is not a truth to all people.
If I had enough gold (say, around 12,000), and I'm approaching that mark on my main, I'd consider taking up two primary professions. Only problem is... there's nothing I really want out of primary professions! My weapon is better than anything from BS; my headgear decent enough that the engineering helm isn't a huge upgrade (and I like the passive bonuses on my trinkets better than those on the engineering ones). I don't need the items from leatherworking at all, considering I have PvP gear that outstrips them. I have enchanting already, so ring enchants are on the way. Gemcrafting, I don't know anything special about but it doesn't appeal to me so much. Nothing in tailoring for a Feral Druid.
So, if and when I hit my gold goal, I might give all that gold to my alt, and have him take up two primaries, so when he hits 70 he has multiple ilvl 140+ items ready for him. It would save weeks in the BGs for equivalents, or months raiding, so I consider it well spent.
Again, this assumes gold is not an option... but from what I've seen, it always is!
The entire theory behind this centers on gold. Assuming that gold is not important to you, nor your time, I would still recommend taking gathering skills until 70, when you can more easily level primary crafts. Someone on this forum asked recently "Gold is not an issue, what should my character take up?" And I responded "Two primary skills, so you can get multiple awesome epics." They ended up taking a gathering skill and a primary skill. Apparently, "Gold is not an issue" is not a truth to all people.
If I had enough gold (say, around 12,000), and I'm approaching that mark on my main, I'd consider taking up two primary professions. Only problem is... there's nothing I really want out of primary professions! My weapon is better than anything from BS; my headgear decent enough that the engineering helm isn't a huge upgrade (and I like the passive bonuses on my trinkets better than those on the engineering ones). I don't need the items from leatherworking at all, considering I have PvP gear that outstrips them. I have enchanting already, so ring enchants are on the way. Gemcrafting, I don't know anything special about but it doesn't appeal to me so much. Nothing in tailoring for a Feral Druid.
So, if and when I hit my gold goal, I might give all that gold to my alt, and have him take up two primaries, so when he hits 70 he has multiple ilvl 140+ items ready for him. It would save weeks in the BGs for equivalents, or months raiding, so I consider it well spent.
Again, this assumes gold is not an option... but from what I've seen, it always is!
Finally, out of all the things for a new player to have to master, they should have to spend their time figuring out which craftable items or dusts and essences are most valuable and can make up for the opportunity cost of not taking mining/skinning?
I think some of the pros on this forum forget what it's like to be a noob. A few noobs really enjoy the market-based aspect of wow, but they are few and far between. (Seems like OP was one of them.) Most get into the game to kill monsters (or gnomes). They will be far better served being told to take two gatherings on their main until 70 than stumbling into a crafting profession and not being able to afford a mount til 50 because it took them a while to figure out how to best price Dream Dust.
I think some of the pros on this forum forget what it's like to be a noob. A few noobs really enjoy the market-based aspect of wow, but they are few and far between. (Seems like OP was one of them.) Most get into the game to kill monsters (or gnomes). They will be far better served being told to take two gatherings on their main until 70 than stumbling into a crafting profession and not being able to afford a mount til 50 because it took them a while to figure out how to best price Dream Dust.
I would guess the main reason people take 2 gathering professions is to buy your lower lvl mounts as soon as possible. This is all well and good considering it took me a solid 5 hours to farm the mithril to buy my mount, but they are lowering the level requirement and the price of one's first mount. There is a huge difference between 100g and 35g, so it may be alot easier to get 35g by lvl 30. I am one of those that really enjoys crafting and I offer to do it for free for guildies and friends and those that have mats. I often watch trade chanel just so I can help supply stuff to whomever is looking because I enjoy it.
I guess it really depends on their goal for the game, If they just wanna kill monsters, then get 2 gathering professions. But if you really want to get into the game and get everything out of it (and time is not too much of an issue) then definitely get 2 paired professions that you enjoy doing.
I do think their is a huge lack of crafters on my server though because whenever I need anything from other crafting professions, it is near impossible to find someone to help me out, and I tip well.
I guess it really depends on their goal for the game, If they just wanna kill monsters, then get 2 gathering professions. But if you really want to get into the game and get everything out of it (and time is not too much of an issue) then definitely get 2 paired professions that you enjoy doing.
I do think their is a huge lack of crafters on my server though because whenever I need anything from other crafting professions, it is near impossible to find someone to help me out, and I tip well.
The knee-jerk response to take 2 gathering professions stems from our need for instant gratification, IMHO. Rather than just assuming that all new players want the maximum amount of gold in the minimum amount of time, perhaps we need to ask them what their goals for the game are. If they're only interested in earning gold as quickly as possible, then 2 gathering professions are the logical recommendation. If they're willing to forego easy money and are more interested in the full WoW experience, then a gathering and a crafting profession may give them more rounded gameplay. Ultimately I think established players do newbies a disservice by spouting dogma rather than engaging them in conversation to understand their interests and responding accordingly. After all, if everyone took 2 gathering professions, who would be left to sell all those mats to?
Of course, all of this assumes that you're dealing with a newbie who is sincerely asking for help and not a nOOb who you're just trying to get rid of.
Edited, Jul 8th 2008 2:25pm by katluvr
Of course, all of this assumes that you're dealing with a newbie who is sincerely asking for help and not a nOOb who you're just trying to get rid of.
Edited, Jul 8th 2008 2:25pm by katluvr
The most common reason to tell new players (truly new, not just new to the server) to take any two gathering skills for easy gold is that it is one of the easiest & shortest reply to type out in game. Besides /ignore.
New Player: I needz golds! Should I take Blakcksmithgy and Lather werking?
Somewhat nice player who wants person to shut up: Take any two gathering professions for easy gold.
New Player: How do I do that? Really? Any two? My friend said JC/Enhancing is best for PVP? Where do I PVP? What does a skull mean on the player icon? How do I get the flight path from Thunderbluff to Ironforge?
Nice player who has just about had it: Try googling your questions or go to a fan site. Lots of good resources out there, easily searchable.
New player: Nah, takes too long. Can I join your guild? You help people level right? I need a few bags. Can you run me through WC? (whisper: do you have any spare 20 slot bags)(whisper: or a few 18 slot bags would really help)
Irritated Player: /Ignore
New Players ALT: /Whisper how do I ignore someone? I can't talk to you for some reason. 16 slot bags would be fine too.
New Player: I needz golds! Should I take Blakcksmithgy and Lather werking?
Somewhat nice player who wants person to shut up: Take any two gathering professions for easy gold.
New Player: How do I do that? Really? Any two? My friend said JC/Enhancing is best for PVP? Where do I PVP? What does a skull mean on the player icon? How do I get the flight path from Thunderbluff to Ironforge?
Nice player who has just about had it: Try googling your questions or go to a fan site. Lots of good resources out there, easily searchable.
New player: Nah, takes too long. Can I join your guild? You help people level right? I need a few bags. Can you run me through WC? (whisper: do you have any spare 20 slot bags)(whisper: or a few 18 slot bags would really help)
Irritated Player: /Ignore
New Players ALT: /Whisper how do I ignore someone? I can't talk to you for some reason. 16 slot bags would be fine too.
So perhaps the standard reply shouldnt be: Take two gathering skills, mining/herbing and skinning to make gold and power-level a crafting skill at 70 if you want one.
Now it'll be: Take two gathering skills, mining/herbing and skinning to make gold and power level a crafting skill at 70 if you want one -- UNLESS you are one of those rare players who really enjoys crafting and doesn't mind slowing down your progress and being poor in order to craft stuff while you level. Keep in mind that much of what you make will be useless to you, and you won't get your mount, epic mount, flying mount or epic flier at the same pace as someone with two gathering skills. You may even have a hard time affording training at low levels. There is the off chance that if you master your server economy and the AH you will make as much gold as if you simply went out and skinned what you killed questing and sold that on the AH to all the 70s power-leveling their crafting skills.
On second thought, I'm sticking with the more succint version. If people are passionate about crafting on their first toon, they'll craft regardless of what we tell them.
Now it'll be: Take two gathering skills, mining/herbing and skinning to make gold and power level a crafting skill at 70 if you want one -- UNLESS you are one of those rare players who really enjoys crafting and doesn't mind slowing down your progress and being poor in order to craft stuff while you level. Keep in mind that much of what you make will be useless to you, and you won't get your mount, epic mount, flying mount or epic flier at the same pace as someone with two gathering skills. You may even have a hard time affording training at low levels. There is the off chance that if you master your server economy and the AH you will make as much gold as if you simply went out and skinned what you killed questing and sold that on the AH to all the 70s power-leveling their crafting skills.
On second thought, I'm sticking with the more succint version. If people are passionate about crafting on their first toon, they'll craft regardless of what we tell them.
rusttle wrote:
Tradeskills are only a gold sink if you skill them up off of the AH or look at lost opportunity costs.
For those who aren’t business majors, the concept of lost opportunity costs is that if you use your raw materials to skill up a tradeskill then you are losing whatever gold you could have made by selling those mats on the AH.
In other words – I skin enough mobs to get my leather working to 375 – we’ll say that the raw mats, had I sold them on the AH instead, would have netted me 2000 gold profit (made up number – don’t care what the real cost is). As such, leveling up my LW to 375 has cost me 2000 gold (even though I didn’t actually spend a single gold out of pocket) due to the lost opportunity of selling those mats on the AH.
However, not everyone is looking to maximize their gold to play time ratio so for those looking to just play the game, here’re the deal.
For those who aren’t business majors, the concept of lost opportunity costs is that if you use your raw materials to skill up a tradeskill then you are losing whatever gold you could have made by selling those mats on the AH.
In other words – I skin enough mobs to get my leather working to 375 – we’ll say that the raw mats, had I sold them on the AH instead, would have netted me 2000 gold profit (made up number – don’t care what the real cost is). As such, leveling up my LW to 375 has cost me 2000 gold (even though I didn’t actually spend a single gold out of pocket) due to the lost opportunity of selling those mats on the AH.
However, not everyone is looking to maximize their gold to play time ratio so for those looking to just play the game, here’re the deal.
What you have said is absolute truth, lost opportunity makes lots more gold that crafting. However, you're forgetting the "flooded market" phenomena. When leveling a crafting skill, the crafter has to make so many of the same item (at the same time that other crafters are also making the same item), that the market price drops to a fraction of the cost to make it (based only on time spent, if you gather the mats yourself).
Quote:
Alchemy – the potions and transmutes you make are useful not only for your main, but also all of your alts, friends and guildies, plus, you can sell the potions themselves on the AH or the raw materials that you don’t need.
As an alchemist, I can tell you that the only potions that sell for more than the mats are the really high end ones. However, I do remain an alchemist because of guildies needs, not to make any gold at all from the craft. I make my gold by selling herbs instead of potions.
Quote:
Blacksmithing – mainly useful only for plate classes but there’s some nice weapons you can make for your alts, friends and guildies – some stuff will sell on the AH for profit but for the most part you’ll be only earning gold by selling excess ore, gems and motes you get from mining.
Absolute truth. No one should go into blacksmithing thinking that there's gold at the end of the hammer. You might be able to find some niche markets, but those tend to get populated - which drives the price down to the point where the niche becomes worthless after a few weeks. At that point, some of the crafters leave the niche, and a cycle begins anew. The niche problem occurs with most crafting professions.
Quote:
Enchanting – the toon with enchanting will get more use out of it then your alts since you can only enchant BOE items for them. You can enchant for all of your friends and guildies though and the raw materials that you don’t need from disenchanting items fetch a good price on the AH. As an added bonus enchanting is a stand alone skill which means that you can either take tailoring or a gathering skill (mining, skinning, herbalism) to supplement your income by selling raw materials.
When treated as a gathering profession, enchanting is the profession that has the potential to make the most gold in the game of any profession. Here's how to do it: Making Gold by Disenchanting - A Guide
Quote:
Engineering – useful for every class, this is a very self specific skill since non-engineers really can’t use 95% of what you can make and other engineers can also make anything you can make – you will earn very little gold selling finished goods on the AH but like blacksmithing, you can easily sell the extra stuff you get from mining. Engineering is almost no help to anyone but the character that has it.
Engineering is probably the most fun profession in the game, especially if you like blowing things up. You won't make money from it, but it's a great profession for an alt who can be financed by another character.
Quote:
Jewelcrafting – cut gems sell nicely and there is some demand for certain pieces of finished jewelry on the AH. The majority of stuff you can make will be useful to your other characters, friends and guildies and like the previous skills that require mining, the excess raw materials from mining can be sold for profit.
Cut gems do indeed sell well. However, the patterns that will net you the big bucks are very hard to come by.
Quote:
Leatherworking – excellent skill for leather and chain wearing classes, it will provide you with some income from selling armor patches on the AH at all levels, some specific pieces of gear and specialty bags at the higher levels (plus quivers and ammo pouches). Since you can only make leather and chain, this skill won’t be as helpful to alts, friends and guildies as some other skills, but will still be useful. Like other skills, you can still make some nice gold selling excess product from skinning on the AH.
Like Blacksmithing, LW suffers from the "flooded market" and "niche" problems. If you find a niche, profits will be cyclical. If you don't find a niche, you should sell the mats instead.
Quote:
Tailoring – another stand alone skill, this skill is usually taken with enchanting since the two compliment each other nicely. Like LW, tailoring has limited benefits for any character that isn’t a cloth wearing class, however, it is used to make bags and being able to equip alts, friends and guildies with all the bags you want is certainly nice. Like LW, only some of the finished goods have any real demand on the AH, but the bags always sell quite nicely. Since tailoring doesn’t require a gathering skill that means that you can take mining, skinning or herbalism to help augment your income selling raw mats on the AH or pick up enchanting (which is nice since you can disenchant anything you skill up on with tailoring and then use that to improve your enchanting, essentially getting two skill points for the price of one).
As much as I like tailoring (no clothie should be without the trade skill at L70), the problem with tailoring is that it cuts into First Aid (or vice-versa). You really have to make a decision: do you level First Aid sooner than Tailoring, or emphasize Tailoring over First Aid? When you couple in Enchanting, the problem gets even worse, because then you have to factor in that you can also get enchanting mats from disenchanting tailored items. This usually results in a clothie who doesn't have good First Aid skill.
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So ignore the peeps saying “don’t take a trade, just do two gathering skills†and have fun being a professional tradeskiller!
Emphasis is on fun. However, remember that anything that can be created throught tradeskills except a few (very few) high end BoP items, you can either buy the item on the AH or be able to find someone to make it for you. If you can get by without having lots of gold and have fun crafting, then it's really a good thing because this is a game and the emphasis should be on having a good time. If crafting is really your thing, far be it from me to keep you from it.
Yet another way to make gold...
Fishing - it's not only stand-alone, it's something that you can do to get gold that doesn't interfere with your main professions. You do have to select where you fish and get the right ones, though. My first fortune was made through fishing, as was my second fortune... until I discovered that disenchanting was easier and made more gold. The money fish are covered in the trade skills FAQ, and it's a good idea to look through it anyhow.
Edited, Jul 8th 2008 2:34pm by ohmikeghod
Time for me to throw in my 
.
Crafting professions can be fun and rewarding for the player, no doubt about it. I have not leveled engineering, blacksmithing, leatherworking, or jewelcrafting to any respectable level (fyi).
What I can say is for a newbie (as in new to the game) the easiest way for a new player to make money would be to do 3 things:
1) Do daily scans using auctioneer to get a decent idea of prices
2) Find out which gathering profession(s) make the most amount of money (normally mining at the lower levels)
3) Pick up that tradeskill and possibly the second one as well if they wish and go to town while leveling.
4) Don't forget to buy the next level of the gathering skill
5) Profit
It is far easier to explain a person to do this (difficult enough to tell them what an addon is or how to use one beyond pointing them online to google it or to look for ohmikegod's amazing enchanting money-making guide ;-)). Gather while you level, sell what you gather, buy things that you need or save for your mount. Easy as pie.
I am not going to
here as I believe most of the aspects have been covered.
To sum it up: is there potential profit in the crafting professions? Of course there is, for anyone who has played the game for a few months they can begin to see what sells or at least hopefully has gone online to find out about other game aspects. For someone who only gets online to level, spends their money on buying materials to level their professions (because they don't know any better and they want the instant gratification of seeing the skillup marker so that they can go run to the trainer to keep going --- Trust me, I did that when I started) it becomes painfully obvious to suggest just gathering and selling.
[edit: oh and cynyck, thanks for the kind words :-)]
Edited, Jul 8th 2008 8:13pm by Anobix
. Crafting professions can be fun and rewarding for the player, no doubt about it. I have not leveled engineering, blacksmithing, leatherworking, or jewelcrafting to any respectable level (fyi).
What I can say is for a newbie (as in new to the game) the easiest way for a new player to make money would be to do 3 things:
1) Do daily scans using auctioneer to get a decent idea of prices
2) Find out which gathering profession(s) make the most amount of money (normally mining at the lower levels)
3) Pick up that tradeskill and possibly the second one as well if they wish and go to town while leveling.
4) Don't forget to buy the next level of the gathering skill
5) Profit
It is far easier to explain a person to do this (difficult enough to tell them what an addon is or how to use one beyond pointing them online to google it or to look for ohmikegod's amazing enchanting money-making guide ;-)). Gather while you level, sell what you gather, buy things that you need or save for your mount. Easy as pie.
I am not going to
here as I believe most of the aspects have been covered. To sum it up: is there potential profit in the crafting professions? Of course there is, for anyone who has played the game for a few months they can begin to see what sells or at least hopefully has gone online to find out about other game aspects. For someone who only gets online to level, spends their money on buying materials to level their professions (because they don't know any better and they want the instant gratification of seeing the skillup marker so that they can go run to the trainer to keep going --- Trust me, I did that when I started) it becomes painfully obvious to suggest just gathering and selling.
[edit: oh and cynyck, thanks for the kind words :-)]
Edited, Jul 8th 2008 8:13pm by Anobix
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