Many enchanters I've talked to on the Gnomer server seem to have the same problem I do. Many people expect us to: (1)travel to them, use our mats, and want to pay us 3/4 of what the mats are worth or (2) expect us to travel to them, use their mats, and either don't tip at all or tip only a few silver. I've added the statement "travel fee may apply" to my macro. Some don't mind paying it as I usually don't charge that much and it's not applicable on tips over two gold or they don't want the hassle of going to the city I'm in and are willing to pay for me comming to them. I don't require payment for enchants done with their mats and if they come to me and I don't get a tip, I don't complain. I've had people see my macro and flame me in trade for it. I usually just ignore them. I'm at level 360 and while I don't have a lot of rare enchants, I do seem to have some that are hard to find.
I was just wondering if enchanters on other servers experience this and for the non-enchanters if you think I have a fair practice.
Thanks in advance for your post and opinions.
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I usually don't have a problem. Although I don't really sell any enchants at the moment. But if people are too lazy to come to me, I don't even bother. Your macro for the travel fee is a good idea though.
If people are doing the former in your "people expect us to:" list, they're not worth your time. Period. The time it takes for you to travel all the way to them, and then argue about using your mats and their crappy pay, you could probably have done two of the same enchant for others.
At that time, that's when you have a set charge for the enchant you're doing. If you're using your mats, you should say up front how much you're charging.
If people are doing the former in your "people expect us to:" list, they're not worth your time. Period. The time it takes for you to travel all the way to them, and then argue about using your mats and their crappy pay, you could probably have done two of the same enchant for others.
At that time, that's when you have a set charge for the enchant you're doing. If you're using your mats, you should say up front how much you're charging.
Enchanting doesn't make money, it never has. The only way to make money is by selling mats to others.
xNocturnalSunx wrote:
I usually don't have a problem. Although I don't really sell any enchants at the moment. But if people are too lazy to come to me, I don't even bother. Your macro for the travel fee is a good idea though.
If people are doing the former in your "people expect us to:" list, they're not worth your time. Period. The time it takes for you to travel all the way to them, and then argue about using your mats and their crappy pay, you could probably have done two of the same enchant for others.
At that time, that's when you have a set charge for the enchant you're doing. If you're using your mats, you should say up front how much you're charging.
If people are doing the former in your "people expect us to:" list, they're not worth your time. Period. The time it takes for you to travel all the way to them, and then argue about using your mats and their crappy pay, you could probably have done two of the same enchant for others.
At that time, that's when you have a set charge for the enchant you're doing. If you're using your mats, you should say up front how much you're charging.
QFT
Do not ever, ever, ever call it a tip. A "tip" is an optional gratuity that you may or may not get depending on the customer's opinion on your services. Call it a service fee, or whatever, but make sure you set it out as a mandatory fee they must pay for you enchant and screen-shot it.
cpcjlc wrote:
I was just wondering if enchanters on other servers experience this and for the non-enchanters if you think I have a fair practice.
I don't charge anything for my enchants, so I don't have the problem. I don't use any of my mats unless they have been purchased from me at the AH. Since selling mats at the AH gives me a very good profit margin, I don't mind doing it for free. Every single one of my mats goes to the AH. Keeping them on me is just asking for trouble.
I would not even offer to travel to someone, if I were you. You're advertising a service; if they want it, they come to you. Get rid of the "travel fee may apply" in your macro. If someone wants you to come them, just tell them no.
Quote:
don't charge anything for my enchants, so I don't have the problem. I don't use any of my mats unless they have been purchased from me at the AH. Since selling mats at the AH gives me a very good profit margin, I don't mind doing it for free. Every single one of my mats goes to the AH. Keeping them on me is just asking for trouble.
Have to agree, keeping mats on you is just pointless. You're essentially losing money that can be easily made.
As far as the "tip" or service fee that some people have mentioned, I have to agree with mike, I don't ask for a "tip" or service fee. If people want to donate a few gold (usually 5g) then I'm more than happy to take it from them. Oh and I don't ever travel to them, always have them travel to me if they really want an enchant that I can do
azwing wrote:
I would not even offer to travel to someone, if I were you. You're advertising a service; if they want it, they come to you. Get rid of the "travel fee may apply" in your macro. If someone wants you to come them, just tell them no.
Absolutely. The minute you put "travel fee may apply" in your Trade chat ad, even if I was never thinking of asking you to come to me, I will now. Why imply that you will travel? The time you spend traveling is time lost doing something else productive.
And as everyone else has said, don't use your own mats. It really cuts down on the grief you get. As Mike has said so many times, if they cannot afford the mats, they cannot afford the enchant. I can't tell you how many times I get "but the mats are too expensive on the AH." So, you expect me to subsidize your glowing sword? I always reply to that with "well, I don't have them and I'm not buying them for you."
Those last 15 points to 375 are real hard. Good Luck.
"the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
Thanks everyone for your input. I"m taking the travel fee out of my macro today and unless I'm REALLY bored I will not be traveling to anyone.
cynyck wrote:
Those last 15 points to 375 are real easy. Good Luck.
Fixed to make a true statement.
Enchant Ring: Spellpower (2 LPS, 2 Greater Planar, KoT Honored requirement) will take you from 360 to 375 no problem.
*add*
Honored with Keepers of Time is obtained through the process of getting Karazhan attuned, so it's not like it's impossible to get there.
Edited, Feb 12th 2008 3:03pm by soggymaster
Like everyone else i find it useless to try and sell most enchants. AH your mats and enchant free for skill ups.
I have been stuck between 370&373 now for a coupl of weeks. I just advertise the few enchants that will most likely give me skills ups as "Free with your mats ". Post the add 2 or 3 times a day at odd times.
sooner or later ill hit 375 and not spend anything on the points i need. You could speed this up alot by actual effort but i just cant spam trade more than 1 or 2 times before i get bored.
I have been stuck between 370&373 now for a coupl of weeks. I just advertise the few enchants that will most likely give me skills ups as "Free with your mats ". Post the add 2 or 3 times a day at odd times.
sooner or later ill hit 375 and not spend anything on the points i need. You could speed this up alot by actual effort but i just cant spam trade more than 1 or 2 times before i get bored.
1) Never use your mats
2) Never go to them
3) Charge a straight fee
Its that simple if you're trying to make money doing enchanting because otherwise, you're simply wasting your time when you could have been getting rep, gear, gold or XP.
People dont want to pay your fee - no problem - tell them to have someone else chant.
People dont want to provide mats - no problem - you're here to make money, not do charity.
People think you're a bad person for charging for "just clicking a button" - no problem - suggest they invest a few hundred gold and who knows how many play hours into leveling a chanter to your skill level then they can stand around Org all Saturday afternoon and do enchants for free.
Remember, you're a person who invested a lot of time and gold into your enchanter and you want to get that gold back and have fun - you are not a chant-bot for random idiots to score free chants off of.
2) Never go to them
3) Charge a straight fee
Its that simple if you're trying to make money doing enchanting because otherwise, you're simply wasting your time when you could have been getting rep, gear, gold or XP.
People dont want to pay your fee - no problem - tell them to have someone else chant.
People dont want to provide mats - no problem - you're here to make money, not do charity.
People think you're a bad person for charging for "just clicking a button" - no problem - suggest they invest a few hundred gold and who knows how many play hours into leveling a chanter to your skill level then they can stand around Org all Saturday afternoon and do enchants for free.
Remember, you're a person who invested a lot of time and gold into your enchanter and you want to get that gold back and have fun - you are not a chant-bot for random idiots to score free chants off of.
Yeah recently I have been getting.. a TON of really funny people with chanting. I say funny cause well I pretty much anymore just burst out laughing in people's faces!
I am missing Kara chants and +agi to boots but that is about it. I DO have Executioner (which threw people for a loop with my transfer but once word got around... no one seemed to mind the unguilded person doing it for them).
Recently I have been asked to go out and get the mats for both Executioner AND +Spell Dmg to gloves and then chant something for someone. Well ok.. first they asked me if I had the mats. Of corse! We all have Tons of Voids, LPS's and in the case of +Spell Dmg 8 primal fire's and 8 primal mana's (i think on the mana's.. or waters.. one of the blue ones!!).
Now for me travel isn't THAT much of a problem as my chanter is a mage. But honestly, it's a pain to deal with. Generaly if someone is asking for a chant they better be in the same city I am at. On top of that they better be ready because if you aren't ready and there by the time my AV box pop's well.. your just SoL buddy!
On my server it seems no matter what the chant, they want to pay you 5g for it. Sure some of the cheaper and easier to get ones thats fine and I don't mind. Truth be told, there is no way I am gonna go Executioner or evern +35 agi which seems to be well to rare since who run's Arc for fun?
I love the idea of a travel fee. It's YOUR time you are spending to do someone ELSE a favor. If they aren't willing to pay for that time well it's their problem not yours. In that time you travel to them and then travel back to where you want to be, you can probably make more $$ than their tip anyways. I think tips over 2g not haveing the fee is a really reasonable thing. The only problem is, you don't know what they are going to tip you before they do, then you have to risk looking like a jerk and asking for more $$. I would say make it a flat fee of 2g for the chant AND comming to them or something like that.
I am missing Kara chants and +agi to boots but that is about it. I DO have Executioner (which threw people for a loop with my transfer but once word got around... no one seemed to mind the unguilded person doing it for them).
Recently I have been asked to go out and get the mats for both Executioner AND +Spell Dmg to gloves and then chant something for someone. Well ok.. first they asked me if I had the mats. Of corse! We all have Tons of Voids, LPS's and in the case of +Spell Dmg 8 primal fire's and 8 primal mana's (i think on the mana's.. or waters.. one of the blue ones!!).
Now for me travel isn't THAT much of a problem as my chanter is a mage. But honestly, it's a pain to deal with. Generaly if someone is asking for a chant they better be in the same city I am at. On top of that they better be ready because if you aren't ready and there by the time my AV box pop's well.. your just SoL buddy!
On my server it seems no matter what the chant, they want to pay you 5g for it. Sure some of the cheaper and easier to get ones thats fine and I don't mind. Truth be told, there is no way I am gonna go Executioner or evern +35 agi which seems to be well to rare since who run's Arc for fun?
I love the idea of a travel fee. It's YOUR time you are spending to do someone ELSE a favor. If they aren't willing to pay for that time well it's their problem not yours. In that time you travel to them and then travel back to where you want to be, you can probably make more $$ than their tip anyways. I think tips over 2g not haveing the fee is a really reasonable thing. The only problem is, you don't know what they are going to tip you before they do, then you have to risk looking like a jerk and asking for more $$. I would say make it a flat fee of 2g for the chant AND comming to them or something like that.
I gave up on enchanting for the general public long, long ago. I trained my enchanting to 375 for the sake of training it to 375. Now, anywhere I go that might have an enchanting formula as a possible reward, I can use it. I can enchant all of my main's gear and put some nice enchants on BoE gear to send to alts. I can D/E until I'm blue in the face and reap the rewards a day or two later. I can do all of these things because I spent a good deal of time skilling up my enchanting.
I did not skill up my enchanting, however, to be the underpaid stat boosting ***** some would seem to want me to be. I don't advertise to do enchants. Ever. If someone is asking in trade about a particular enchant, I may or may not /w them with a link for mats. If it's one of the rare enchants I have (ie. they'd have a tough time finding someone to do it after I link the mats for them) I might consider doing it for them...if I feel like it. If they're in Ironforge and I just ported from Shatt to Darnassus, they'd best be willing to travel...and quickly, at that. Otherwise, they're SOL. I'll never blow my hearthstone CD or hop a gryphon for a lengthy ride to do an enchant for someone unless I consider them to be a friend. It's been proven to me time and time again that it's never worth it.
I did not skill up my enchanting, however, to be the underpaid stat boosting ***** some would seem to want me to be. I don't advertise to do enchants. Ever. If someone is asking in trade about a particular enchant, I may or may not /w them with a link for mats. If it's one of the rare enchants I have (ie. they'd have a tough time finding someone to do it after I link the mats for them) I might consider doing it for them...if I feel like it. If they're in Ironforge and I just ported from Shatt to Darnassus, they'd best be willing to travel...and quickly, at that. Otherwise, they're SOL. I'll never blow my hearthstone CD or hop a gryphon for a lengthy ride to do an enchant for someone unless I consider them to be a friend. It's been proven to me time and time again that it's never worth it.
calindc wrote:
xNocturnalSunx wrote:
I usually don't have a problem. Although I don't really sell any enchants at the moment. But if people are too lazy to come to me, I don't even bother. Your macro for the travel fee is a good idea though.
If people are doing the former in your "people expect us to:" list, they're not worth your time. Period. The time it takes for you to travel all the way to them, and then argue about using your mats and their crappy pay, you could probably have done two of the same enchant for others.
At that time, that's when you have a set charge for the enchant you're doing. If you're using your mats, you should say up front how much you're charging.
If people are doing the former in your "people expect us to:" list, they're not worth your time. Period. The time it takes for you to travel all the way to them, and then argue about using your mats and their crappy pay, you could probably have done two of the same enchant for others.
At that time, that's when you have a set charge for the enchant you're doing. If you're using your mats, you should say up front how much you're charging.
QFT
Do not ever, ever, ever call it a tip. A "tip" is an optional gratuity that you may or may not get depending on the customer's opinion on your services. Call it a service fee, or whatever, but make sure you set it out as a mandatory fee they must pay for you enchant and screen-shot it.
Where in my post did I say TIP? I'm obviously missing it if you see it. I said a set charge, meaning if they're selling their enchants and using THEIR mats, they should say up front how much they're charging.
I know what a tip is. It irritates me when people say stuff like "WTE [Minor Beastslayer] your mats PLUS tip."
It's funny that I've bought vitality, subtlety, and a few other high end enchants this week. Nobody asked for any money (my mats). My standard tip for outland enchants which I gave them is 25g.
i dont charge for chants if im using thier mats, but every chant iv done in the last 2 weeks the custy has asked me how much do i want?
i simply reply, "anything will be accepted"
and usually end up being given 10G+ which is nice
i did end up paying 18g for executioner as i spent hours looking for a guy who could do it, and when i found him he didnt want a tip but i made him take it lol
i simply reply, "anything will be accepted"
and usually end up being given 10G+ which is nice
i did end up paying 18g for executioner as i spent hours looking for a guy who could do it, and when i found him he didnt want a tip but i made him take it lol
xNocturnalSunx wrote:
calindc wrote:
xNocturnalSunx wrote:
I usually don't have a problem. Although I don't really sell any enchants at the moment. But if people are too lazy to come to me, I don't even bother. Your macro for the travel fee is a good idea though.
If people are doing the former in your "people expect us to:" list, they're not worth your time. Period. The time it takes for you to travel all the way to them, and then argue about using your mats and their crappy pay, you could probably have done two of the same enchant for others.
At that time, that's when you have a set charge for the enchant you're doing. If you're using your mats, you should say up front how much you're charging.
If people are doing the former in your "people expect us to:" list, they're not worth your time. Period. The time it takes for you to travel all the way to them, and then argue about using your mats and their crappy pay, you could probably have done two of the same enchant for others.
At that time, that's when you have a set charge for the enchant you're doing. If you're using your mats, you should say up front how much you're charging.
QFT
Do not ever, ever, ever call it a tip. A "tip" is an optional gratuity that you may or may not get depending on the customer's opinion on your services. Call it a service fee, or whatever, but make sure you set it out as a mandatory fee they must pay for you enchant and screen-shot it.
Where in my post did I say TIP? I'm obviously missing it if you see it. I said a set charge, meaning if they're selling their enchants and using THEIR mats, they should say up front how much they're charging.
I know what a tip is. It irritates me when people say stuff like "WTE [Minor Beastslayer] your mats PLUS tip."
I shouldn't speak for someone else, but I read it as calindc agreeing with you, as he quoted you and followed with QFT. Although people differ on what the "F" stands for, I'm pretty sure its agreed that the "Q" stands for "quite" and the "T" for "true." At least, that's my understanding.
By the way, I agree with you both. A tip is something optional. If you want to be paid, say it up front and call it a fee or something else that makes it clear it is not an option.
"the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
cynyck wrote:
I shouldn't speak for someone else, but I read it as calindc agreeing with you, as he quoted you and followed with QFT. Although people differ on what the "F" stands for, I'm pretty sure its agreed that the "Q" stands for "quite" and the "T" for "true." At least, that's my understanding.
Quoted For Truth
From my side, i have got enchant to 295. With some help from my gild, farmed the mob in BRD and i got fire enchant. Then got Unholy and finally the ice one.
Then started my Advertice in SW that i was enchanting "free with your mats" and in the end a "For low lvl enchant, a tip is welcome". The free ones were the ones i had orange-yellow. Any other were consider low lvl and a tip was welcome.
In 2 days, i had got to 325 enchanting, many ppl told me "i am adding you to my friend list for future enchant." and stuff like that. Ppl gave me good tips (3-5g). most of them had their mats. Few ppl asked me for prices since they were lazy ppl and had many gold to spend. SO i took the resolution to have at least mats to enchat each of the most wanted enchants and i asked for them something like 10% increased of AH prices. And they sold lol. Really nice business ;-)
What do i think was my key factor, i think it was my customer service: tryed to help each ppl that wanted an enchant to get the best result in gold vs utility for them. Even tho i asked "why do you need this... ahhh but i recomend better this one because ..."
but one thing i won't give it away... I stay in SW outside AH. I won't run to you, sorry i have better stuff to do. everytime i do my adverticing, i stay in the same place, so my customers know where to find me. And know what, they go there, pass by me and drop a nice "hey, how is bussines going" "hello there, did you get new enchants?" ... I love this.
Hope it help some.
Bye and GL.
PD: have saved MANY gold on those point from 295 to 325 ^_^
Then started my Advertice in SW that i was enchanting "free with your mats" and in the end a "For low lvl enchant, a tip is welcome". The free ones were the ones i had orange-yellow. Any other were consider low lvl and a tip was welcome.
In 2 days, i had got to 325 enchanting, many ppl told me "i am adding you to my friend list for future enchant." and stuff like that. Ppl gave me good tips (3-5g). most of them had their mats. Few ppl asked me for prices since they were lazy ppl and had many gold to spend. SO i took the resolution to have at least mats to enchat each of the most wanted enchants and i asked for them something like 10% increased of AH prices. And they sold lol. Really nice business ;-)
What do i think was my key factor, i think it was my customer service: tryed to help each ppl that wanted an enchant to get the best result in gold vs utility for them. Even tho i asked "why do you need this... ahhh but i recomend better this one because ..."
but one thing i won't give it away... I stay in SW outside AH. I won't run to you, sorry i have better stuff to do. everytime i do my adverticing, i stay in the same place, so my customers know where to find me. And know what, they go there, pass by me and drop a nice "hey, how is bussines going" "hello there, did you get new enchants?" ... I love this.
Hope it help some.
Bye and GL.
PD: have saved MANY gold on those point from 295 to 325 ^_^
selebrin of the Seven Seas wrote:
cynyck wrote:
I shouldn't speak for someone else, but I read it as calindc agreeing with you, as he quoted you and followed with QFT. Although people differ on what the "F" stands for, I'm pretty sure its agreed that the "Q" stands for "quite" and the "T" for "true." At least, that's my understanding.
Quoted For Truth
Ah... lol silly me. Yeah, I took it the wrong way. Sorry about that Calindc. =P
selebrin of the Seven Seas wrote:
Quoted For Truth
Yeah, Quite Frickin' True, I've seen it explained that way also. Not as colorful though, so it doesn't stick to my gray matter.
"the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
15g, flat rate for all my enchants.
If you don't want to pay that, I have no problem letting you find someone else to do the enchant.
And if you change your mind, its still 15g, provided I'm still available.
**Also, I don't spam macros selling my enchants, if someone needs an enchant they'll request it in trade, where I'll respond by telling them. I don't know of anyone seeing an enchanter's spam message and saying to themselves, "Oh, I think I would like to get 12 agility placed on my boots, that would be quite nice. If I hadn't seen that message I never would have known to enchant my boots."
If you don't want to pay that, I have no problem letting you find someone else to do the enchant.
And if you change your mind, its still 15g, provided I'm still available.
**Also, I don't spam macros selling my enchants, if someone needs an enchant they'll request it in trade, where I'll respond by telling them. I don't know of anyone seeing an enchanter's spam message and saying to themselves, "Oh, I think I would like to get 12 agility placed on my boots, that would be quite nice. If I hadn't seen that message I never would have known to enchant my boots."
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