Raise II and III Scrolls - Plea from a WHMFollow

I realized recently that there's lots of us in partial AFs running around on Shiva. {Congratulations!} I also started to see quite a few with the Healer's Pantalons. The WHM AF pants are lvl 56 equipment, which means all pants wearing WHMs can now learn Raise II.

....Then I realized that the Raise II prices have gone up termendously over the past week or so. Raise II on Shiva used to be on the low end of all server economies for a long time. (Some servers they go for 500K)

I guess lots of peeps thought, "Hey, there's lots of WHMs out there that needs this spell! Let's charge big bucks so I can get rich!!" While there's nothing wrong with doing BCNMs to get making money items, I personally feel a bit offended by the price hike for the Raise II and III scrolls.

These spells are something that we use *just* for the benefit of others...often times for the melee class that probably scored the scrolls in the first place. Raise spells are the only spells we can't cast on ourselves...

Unless we are uber fishermen that can make 10K a day, or have other jobs that can make money farming/BCNM-ing, most of us are incapable of farming anything profitable to come up with the money to buy scrolls that are over 200K+. It took me a while to make money to buy my Dark Staff, Light Staff and Erase.

You want us to have Raise II and IIIs in EXP PTs. You want us to come cast Raise II and IIIs if you die soloing, missioning, or Coffering in some god awful high aggro place... Then why do you make it so hard for us to purchase this spell? Why do you get upset when we ask you for a donation for these spells - we are only trying to make a bit back, warm our wallets a little.

Raise IIs and IIIs are not like {Erase} scrolls, something that is not necessary (nice to have, yes, but not a necessity) at the lvls we can use then. I know a few WHMs on other servers that went without Erase to lvl 60+. Some WHMs tend to think that Erase is a luxury item, just like Vermillion Cloak. But Raise II and III are not. We are almost *Required* to have it in EXP PTs. I get /tells asking if I have it before getting invited.

I'm sure there's more JPs out there scoring the the scrolls than us NAs - but if you are an NA, and if you are reading this, consider this...IF you can get the scroll, try passing it on to your LS WHM or a close friend WHM. Selling it at the pre-inflation prices are even appreciated... We will remember your kindness, and I'm sure your kindness will be returned in the best way we can. (Like invis/sneaking, risking our lives to come Raise II you in Monastic Cavern...)

I happen to have Raise II already, so this isn't for my own personal need. I just felt that I had to post it, cuz I've encountered WHMs here and there at lvl 56+ without the spell. And it hurts me to see my brothers and sisters without them tremendously...

If I've offended anybody by this post, I apologize.
{I'm sorry.}

Raise II & III are BCNM50 & 60 or a HNM drop

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?fitem=2001
http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?fitem=2112

...><...

Free Raise II's? Hah! Nice try joker, I've yet to find a whm who loves doing Raise II's for free. Same zone or not.

Yeah it sucks, if it makes you feel any better every class has a spell/equipment that prices are obscene for. Take Brown/Black belts for MNKs. Only MNKs can use them yet the still fetch obscene amounts of gil.

Of course the solution to all this is to get together a group of people to do the quests/fights/whatever to get the items with you. This requires that the other person in question is also willing to assist that person in obtaining an item, and not pulling a BobbyJai on them.

A side note all melee reading this board, farm as fast as possible, melee equipment is on the price wise.

Sniper rings are currently at 550-570k and moving steadily.
Merman's Gorgets 140-150k, with some overpricers at 170k.
Assault earring 150-160k. seems to stay around there, hopefully will.. but I already got mine ^^

I dont think its as much as 500K on Shiva server but... I think it might be close, anyone have an exact price for us ?



It may be one of the cheapest jobs to level (so far I have noticed that things have been relatively inexpensive) but it is also one of the most selfless jobs. 99% of what we do as a whm is designed to support other players. The point that was made above is that Raise II does not help the white mage themselves is completely true. As a matter of fact you could consider Raise II to be a huge hindrance to us because of the extreme cost. Because of this it is hard to get parties for anyone that is not a member of a large Link Shell that can help the Whm get that BCNM or for people that can afford 500k for one lousy spell. To put things in perspective, if you were to buy the gil to get Raise II... as per ebay IT WOULD COST 67$ TO PURCHASE IT LMAO I dont buy gil but I just thought that would kinda put things in perspective... for an item that doesnt help anyone but EVERYONE ELSE We are White Mages... appreciate us... we love to help you...

I apologize...I think I got ppl confused - on OTHER servers, Raise II is about 500K... For us, it went from 80K a few days ago to 250-280K over the weekend. Although it's not as bad as 500K, it is now become a very expensive spell and the deliberate inflation was infuriating. When I was lvl 40, the spell was around 30K. So again, while not a shocker like 500K, 90K->280K is out right disgusting as well.

Raise III was 150K a few weeks ago, now going for 250K as well.

While most PS2 NAs won't be needing Raise III anytime soon, I'm predicting that by the time we hit lvl 70, I'm sure it'll go up tremendously.

So you see, while it is not outrageous like other servers, going from 30K to 280K is something that I HAD to point out. Like the poster said above me, people *dread* leveling.



Now I think there's something wrong with that. He/she is not talking about equipment, he/she is talking about a spell that doesn't do him/her no good! >< I think we should all, regardless of melee or a mage, enjoy getting stronger, wearing AFs, and all the other nice things that comes with leveling - we all earned it.

In WHMs case, we look forward to the day we can finally help people in a much appreciated way - Raise II & III. I think most of us grew up not only dreaming about the Red and White AFs, but also to the day when we can finally help all the people that helped us along the way, be it beating up lizzards for Telelport Yhoat or Shadows and Golems for Teleport Vazhl.



- I did too. I wanted to finally have the powers to help the melee class that protected me in PTs, farmed with me when I couldn't, got my RSE chest keys when I could hardly kill a Carnivouros Crawler. But when the prices of the very spell that we need to pay back our dues are intentionally inflated by a few that see it as a "marketing opportunity", it makes it that much harder for us to help, and in turn, a bit irritated when asked to perform the spell.



Yes, and we will have to start charging 10K a Raise 2 if this inflation keeps up.

On other servers, the same phenomenon is happening...on one particular server (I can't remember which one) some HNMLS has monoploized the BCNM / HNM, and have jacked up the prices to 500-600K. On Shiva, it is yet to happen, but I'm sure there's HNMLS' out there already thinking about it. Well, if you are, please don't. It just hurts the Raise II/III supply and makes us bitter. You will start seeing bitter WHMs that will refuse to Raise you, walk all over your corpse in full AF... no one wants that.

But on a good note, I saw the last Raise II scroll selling for 150K yesterday, yes, DOWN 100K... ^^b {Thank you} Keep on reducing {yes, please}. Perhaps it was some kind soul that read this, perhaps it's because my brothers and sisters decided to take a strong stance and decided not to buy it until prices came down. I don't know...but I really wish that people can understand that these spells are there for the benefit of *them* and not WHMs that purchase them.

Thank you.

EDIT: Grammar & Spelling ^^;

Edited, Wed Oct 13 11:10:13 2004 by uchipu

That is the simplest solution to increases in prices, do not buy the item.
It is my hunch that the price hikes started out, and continue to rise, due to 3 factors:
(1) People who get the spell and can not use it sell it as high as possible in order to get equipment they can use
(2) People see the AH with none listed and see the last price as 50k (as an example) and say I can put it as 55-60k since no one else is selling it. After several of these it will jump rather fast.
(3) The infamous Gil seller excuse (I don't know how valid it is) that gil sellers are intentionally raiseing the prices in order to make more profit for themselves.

There are solutions to each
(1) This is a symptom of a wider problem with people selling everything they can at an inflated price to get more out of it. People who do this to spells are probably trying to afford equipment that they can not hunt a NM for due to level or massive overcamping (leaping lizzie I'm looking your way). There are possible solutions many of which have been put forward before
(a) make some of the more popular NM drops Rare/Ex (i.e. Lizzie boots, Emporer Hairpen) Items that you don't have to level to long in order to be able to hunt for.
(b) Have square occasionally give an influx of items to lower prices (Yeah right like they would do this)
(2) This problem is tied hand in hand with problem one and is not all that seperate of a problem now that I think about it.
(3) This one is tricky but the best solution is to delete accounts of gil sellers. Sure they can always start over but if the deletion is sudden then they will have to really start over. It will be a little while before they can start camping NM or doing BCNMs to make enough gil to sell again. The problem will arise in finding the gil sellers but I think that could be done with just a little undercover work from Square. My guess is that these companies have mules that they have all sellers send gil too. You deleate several of these mules in a row after they get gil influxes and you will start to dent thier profits significantly.

/cheer uchipu

You are so right. I know I'm no where near getting RAISE II & III yet, but I agree with you 100%. At first I didn't charge for Raises, but when I noticed I noticed spells got much much more expensive as I went up in level I started asking for donations. And I do farm, everything I can actually just so no one thinks I'm lazy. I've even been giving free teleports! I'll just stick to my plan to farm for a week straight once I reach Lvl 50. :P

It's business people. As stated earlier, it's a BCNM drop...

Now, how can the price raise so much? Well, people must be buying it. That or some LS raised the price of it themselves (My LS has done such before =P)

I honestly don't think whm's should be crying about this. My gear that is "required" of me:

Emp hairpin - 400k
Leaping boots - 300k
Black Cotehardie - 200k
Life Belt - 70k

And I don't have them yet but I might get them soon:

2x sniper rings - 550k each

What do whm's normally wear?

hat - AF
body - AF
hands - AF
legs - AF
feet - AF
Electrum rings - um, 10k each at best?
light staff - 130k?
dark staff - 100-150k?

Seriously, your equipment is cheap. Unless you go for that Nobles Tunic my gear costs more than your spells + gear combined. And don't say whm's can't make money, you can quest (ninja scroll quests can net you 2-300k) teleport for gil (there are many people that refuse to pay the gilfarmers and I will only accept a teleport from someone other than waitmagic/saitaiyang) and then farm weaker mobs. Whm's are also wanted for BCNM's too.

Raise II isn't helpful? It is one of the things a whm brings to a party. A rdm gets a good bit of whm spells, but whm gets status cures, cure V and Raise II/III. If you want to get parties above 60+ you need all of your spells.

Stop thinking you're special, every job costs money, the fact that you have a 250k scroll and erase simply isn't that special. Your AF is fine for you to wear until...relic gear, heh, I will only use any AF until lvl 70 I think, only ever use 2 pieces on exp pt...

I agree that there's classes out there that cost faaaaar more than WHMs, take NIN or RNG for example. RNGs use about 40K+ a night EASILY if they want to EXP PT.

My point was not the expense itself...we've all come to realize that everything costs, and we have to find ways to pay for our jobs, as in RL...Why do I go to work everyday? Why simple, to keep on livin' :)

My whole point was that to bring to attention the sudden inflation vs what people expect from us. 90K->250K in a weekend, and wonder why most WHMs that just dinged 56 don't have the spell.

NeighborhoodPT: My PT's WHM sucks, he's got no Raise II - can you come Raise II us? We got him cuz he was 56, but he don't have it - lol
Uchipu: ...I'm in middle of a battle and a chain. I can Raise you, but I'd like donation so that I can share with my PT for the loss of time.
NeighborhoodPT: STFU!! All it costs you is some little down time and your MP!! A$$hol3!!

...

So you see, we are expected to have Raise II, and if we don't have it we "suck". If we have it and ask something in exchange, we are "A$$hol3"s. :( And, it's not just my MP and time...the spell did cost money in the first place. Keep in mind, we don't need Raise II to EXP - just Cures and a few buff/enfeebs. Hence RDMs can replace us in PTs - However if you invite a WHM we are EXPECTED to have this spell that does nothing to us, so we MUST have it now to get into PTs to get EXP. Yes, it's a vicious cycle for all of us. But people do not expect a PLD to always have a Gluttony Sword, people do not expect all THFs to be wearing Leaping Boots, Emp Hairpin, etc...

How many times does a melee class get an invite tell that's goes something like: "Hey, we'd like you to come, but only if you have adaman armor!" I get tells like, "Hey, we'd like you to come, but only if you can invis/sneak the DRG that's coming with you and have Raise II"

Now I know all melee class equipment is expensive - but how would you like it if the Leaping Boots went from 300K to 2.5mil in a weekend? That's the kind of inflation rate we just experienced... So lots of us who were saving up 100K or so for the spell, now must go back to farming, gardening, or fishing all over again. Had the inflation continued, by the time we made another 100K, it would have been 300K...

We can't steal gold beastcoins like said above, and even if we had THF subbed, it's only TH1, and by doing this, we have now severly limited our attack power, cuz we can't sub BLM - which leads us to spending much longer time trying to make even 10K - things I can kill safely without my BLM sub rarely drop items that sell for more than 2K at a time...

Contarary to what ppl think, we aren't whiners complaining about our incapability to farm. I also think some of the elite high level fishermen are usually mages as well - we don't mind spendning hours doing nothing but hitting 1 key on the keyboard. We don't mind doing our share of money gathering activities - all classes have to do this.

I personally carft, garden, farm elementals, Bues in marshlands, Courels, Slimes, and whatever I can kill. I don't tele-taxi cuz I think WHMs in their 30s and 40s who still can't farm very well should be given the chance to do so (I know I did my share around then). Hell, I've even had my match with Stray Mary, Valkrum Empereor, Poruboros, and Spiny Spipi.

I don't mind making money and spending big bucks on spells or whatever...it's game within the game. I happen to be working for a long time for a Vermillion Cloak (2.7mil, lvl 59) but if that Vermillion Cloak suddenly became 5.4mil, and be dismissed as "business" ...><... It's the same thing - it will erk me all the same as Raise inflation ><

I love how you all act like there is a coalition of WHMS here who have each others backs...You found one thing to agree on, and use to vent and now its "We are the world" WHM style...truth is, you all prolly hate each other in game when competing for taxi service or seeking for PT hoping the other doesnt get invite before you...If the inflation of items your job (you know, the one that you choose when you started) requires is making u that upset, the solution is quit the game...Its prolly ruining your life anyway.