Moebius wrote:
You're wrong, by the way. It's an idea that is over 2000 years old. And it does not preclude that God is a jealous god. Or that He punishes those that run afoul of His will.
Kelvyquayo wrote:
Allegory wrote:
The idea of god as being a primarily a benevolent entity is largely a new idea within Christianity, and a product of the Enlightenment and people like Martin Luther. Before that God was mostly a judgmental entity, bringing grace to those who pleased him and just punishment to those who displeased him.
This is totally wrong. It takes any form of studying of some New Testament books to see that. If you are talking about Old Testament then you are still wrong. I imagine most of what you are referring to is how the Jews were punished for dis-obeying God or the people of Sodom and Gomorrah? These things need to be understood from the context of the entire "story" But I'll not go on about those things as I'm sure what you'll say..
I think you've misunderstood. I'm not arguing that
I believe the Christian god to be benevolent or judgmental; I'm arguing that this is a change in how
others believed him to be. This isn't a theological argument; it's a historical one.
This was kind of at the heart of the protestant reformation. Martin Luther's core belief was that salvation is achieved through grace alone. God doesn't judge us by our actions, and our works do not determine whether we are burned in Hell or ascend to Heaven. Rather, it is God's grace that he sent his son to die for us and only through faith--and faith alone being sufficient--we are saved.
It's also notable that belief in
Hell is declining faster than belief in religion Moebius wrote:
Boy, you got that right, brother. The premise you start with is so off base it makes the rest of the argument topple before you get to the 4th sentence.
It's nice that you have an opinion, but it's a pretty sound statement to say that we should judge forces for the effects they cause and not the way they are marketed. A philosophy that is labeled peaceful--but incites violence--is violent just as a bottle labeled "lemonade"--but filled with poison--is poisonous rather than delicious.
Edited, May 25th 2011 5:53pm by Allegory