Iranian war ships in the suezFollow

Of course the weather isn't real, Thunder is God bowling, and Rain is him crying, and Lighting is him creating Black folks.

It isn't false, Iraq claimed Iranian waters as their own, illegitimately. You even agreed that Iraq was the first one to push the buttons.


Iran invading contested Islands (contested because under Iraq's water claims the Islands became "Iraqi") was a secondary occurrence in response to an invasion of their territory. They were at a quasi state of war. In 1975 the "war" ended and the territorial waterways and Islands were returned to their rightful owners, the majority of which was Irans in the first place.

Then in 1980, Iraq invaded Iran.

Iran has not fired the first shot, nor dropped bombs on people to make them think pro Iranian.

Before you spout off about Iran assaulting ships in the waterways, bear in mind the international water way is less than 50 meters wide, It is highly likely that these ships did enter Iranian waterways and thus were subject to Iranian Coastal inspection, seizure and whatever else Iranian law dictates their coastal services can do.

You are wrong, deal with it, and move on.

I never said that the islands captures were in any way contested. You invented that yourself. Which is amusing given the full correct information.

here's a wiki for you to read


Ready to acknowledge that Iran did in fact invade another country and start a war of aggression?



Again. I *never* said that the islands were part of the contested area. I actually thought they were islands in that big bay south of Basra (still unrelated to the waterway itself, but strategic in terms of military position). I was wrong, and t turns out that they're several hundred miles away off on the other side of the Persian Gulf.

Funny how assumption gets you, doesn't it?



Um.. Yes they have.



Lol. You get that the international waterway is so narrow specifically so that Iran may do this? The major (only) port city Iraq has is connected to the gulf by that waterway. If you can't noodle out why Iran might have an interest in harassing shipping traveling to/from Basra, then I'm not sure if there's any hope for you.



Lol. Funny!

Edited, Feb 17th 2011 3:11pm by gbaji

Further more in 1971 the main Island in question was allowed to remain under UAE sovereignty but Iran was allowed to station troops there. It wasn't until the end of the Iraq-Iran War that Iran took claim of the island under its national sovereignty. This was done because the UAE sided with Iraq and lost any favor they had with Iran.

Dude, most of the middle east was Iranian if we go back far enough in history. That does not justify attacking and seizing what was at that time foreign soil.


Aren't you being ridiculous about this? You're also (as usual) misreading things. One of the islands was handed over amicably and by agreement. The other two were seized by force. The UAE has never given up its claim to those islands, Iraq made a big stink about the seizure when it happened, and Iraq again in 1980 made capturing those islands one of its military objectives. This bizarre notion that since Iran says it holds claim to the islands that it must be true and they were perfectly justified in taking military action to seize them from those who held them at the time only shows your bias. You're picking sides, not looking at the issue objectively.

I mean, but that argument the US has never invaded or occupied anyone either. After all, every single square inch of land we have was either sold to us by someone else, or we obtained as a result of a war in which we were the ones attacked. And the only other wars we've fought were to liberate people illegally occupied by their current rulers, so those don't count either. If you simply accept the claim of one nation over another, you can justify any foreign policy action, can't you?

I actually was not the one who said the US has invaded or claimed land. I am only arguing your claim Iran has attacked without provocation. The majority of that list the paul posted was in response to a provocation by that nation, be it directly against the US, against and ally, or a UN sanctioned occurrence.

I only disagree with your opinion that Iran has provoked evens by launching a first attack, when arguably history shows that they have not. They have not ever attacked another nation without provocation. Everyone of these Islands were Iranian before the British took control of the region and attempted to give land that was not theirs to give, to surrounding nations. Had you not mentioned anything that was incorrect I would not even be involved in this conversation, because I do not agree with pauls assessment of that list. I am only here to correct faulty information that you supplied, some you have retracted, and I am sure you will retract more.

Sigh... That was *not* my claim. My only claim was that this statement by Paulsol:

In the last hundred years, Iran has NEVER invaded another country and has NEVER started a war of aggression.

... is false.

Do you agree that this statement is false?

So have the Iranians invaded Cyprus yet?

Lol! That's a technicality large enough to allow for half the nations of the world to invade the other half. So you would also argue that Iraq didn't invade Kuwait?


Your rationalizations are amazing!

They totally have a rowboat on a trailer they can use!

and Elephants to cross the alps and pull the trailer I assume?

Ok honestly until you brush up on your world history I am done discussing things with you. Kuwait was founded in the early 1600's it held its first elections in 1759. In 1913 Kuwait was officially recognized by both the Ottomon empire and the British Empire in the Anglo-Ottomon Conventions. Post World War 1 the British formerly declared Kuwait a free nation as a principality under the protection of the British Government. (much like Canada and Australia were)

This is not even close to taking land from another country then turning around and giving it to someone else. Kuwait was always Kuwait. It was not an Island in a gulf that was stripped of its sovereignty and then years later given to another nation. Kuwait was never not Kuwait.

Once again you are wrong. Move on.

Edited, Feb 17th 2011 11:09pm by rdmcandie

Yeah. Pretty much. Um... But all the wiki-fact in the world doesn't eliminate the absurdity of arguing that an invasion isn't really an invasion simply because you don't want to admit you were wrong.


So, rdm? Did the Japanese "invade" the Philippines? Does the German attack on Danzig count as an "invasion" and/or "war of aggression"? Or was it a liberation? How about the whole War of 1812 thing? Does that really count as a war since the US was a former colony of England? And the Civil War wasn't really a war at all! Wow! You've clarified world history so much for us!

Lol...