Forum Settings
       
« Previous 1 2 3 4 5
Reply To Thread

GA Gov race just got interestingFollow

#1 Sep 17 2010 at 9:12 AM Rating: Excellent
The Republican candidate Nathan Deal, who narrowly defeated the Palin endorsed Karen Handel, turns out to be a little over five million dollars in debt.


Quote:
Deal’s troubles center on a failed business venture by his daughter and son-in-law. Deal and his wife, Sandra, invested about $2 million, but lost their entire stake when the business failed. The Deals also guaranteed a series of bank loans to the business as its debt doubled and then quadrupled.

Finally, the daughter and her husband declared bankruptcy, leaving the Deals solely responsible for an obligation that exceeds the net value of everything they own.

Officials with Deal’s campaign confirmed that the candidate is in a precarious financial position. They described the debt as a sensitive matter for Deal and his wife and their three grown daughters.

“There’s some financial sacrifice, and there’s some financial heartburn there,” said Chris Riley, Deal’s campaign manager.

In a statement late Tuesday, the campaign said: “Like most Americans, Nathan Deal has suffered financial losses over the last four years. He has obligations, and he will meet them.”

Nevertheless, the looming repayment deadline presents a set of unattractive options for Deal, a Republican from Gainesville: He could declare bankruptcy and ask a judge to void the debt. He could sell as many assets as possible and ask the bank to write off the loan’s balance. Or he could default on the loan, forcing the bank to seize property he used as collateral and possibly sue him for the remainder.

Any scenario could leave Deal effectively insolvent.

Deal has publicly addressed the loan’s effect on his financial standing just once: in his written response to an ethics investigation that began before he resigned from the U.S. House of Representatives in March.


If a poor person goes bankrupt, they're irresponsible.

If a rich person goes bankrupt, they're unlucky.

I do feel a teensy bit sorry for Deal - he cosigned on a loan for his daughter's business. His daughter and her husband then ran the business into the ground. Their default on the loan caused the bank that wrote them the check to go under.

Then again, no I don't. He declares an income of $150K a year on his auto salvaging business, and owes over $2 million dollars on his two homes. I'm sorry, isn't the recommended maximum of home value for an income of a grand and a half around $375-400K? And this is GA we're talking about, where $400K is enough to get you a really nice, really big house in a really good neighborhood.

Since the loan was cosigned using his overpriced, overvalued homes as collateral, and he lied on the loan forms about the amount of equity he had in them, he dug himself into this hole.
#2REDACTED, Posted: Sep 17 2010 at 9:15 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) The key to this story;
#3 Sep 17 2010 at 9:16 AM Rating: Decent
I hope Chuck Donovan stomps them both in the ***.


-NW
#4 Sep 17 2010 at 9:19 AM Rating: Good
Yeah, the war over the heart and soul of the Republican party in GA was waged in this governor's race.

The good ol' boy won, but barely. He claims a pro-life, anti-gay stance, but he was so corrupt that even the Tea Party didn't want to touch him. I'm sure the Rs have a lot of buyer's remorse with him right now.

Then again, he could still beat Roy Barnes, the conservative Democrat who insulted the Confederate flag and lost his job to Republican Sonny Purdue, who promptly ran the state into the ground.
#5 Sep 17 2010 at 9:37 AM Rating: Good
Soulless Internet Tiger
******
35,474 posts
Wow. Interesting. Or not.
____________________________
Donate. One day it could be your family.


An invasion of armies can be resisted, but not an idea whose time has come. Victor Hugo

#6 Sep 17 2010 at 9:46 AM Rating: Good
Avatar
*****
13,007 posts
varusword75 wrote:
The key to this story;

Not endorsed by Palin.

So Palin is suddenly the one rubberstamping GOP candidates, is she? She's the go-to guy for the Republican ideal?
#7 Sep 17 2010 at 9:57 AM Rating: Good
Official Shrubbery Waterer
*****
14,659 posts
What better way to connect with the American people than to declare bankruptcy, like so many Americans have been forced to do? He's just locked up the pity/empathy vote.
____________________________
Jophiel wrote:
I managed to be both retarded and entertaining.

#8 Sep 17 2010 at 12:10 PM Rating: Excellent
Liberal Conspiracy
*******
TILT
Illinois has more interesting governors.

But not this race though. I'm pretty sure that between the governor's race and the senate race, folks in IL would prefer to just stay in bed until it's over.
____________________________
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#9 Sep 17 2010 at 1:00 PM Rating: Good
******
27,272 posts
varusword75 wrote:
The key to this story;

Not endorsed by Palin.

Meaning that it could have been worse?
#10 Sep 17 2010 at 2:43 PM Rating: Good
Karen Handel was actually more moderate than Deal. She's probably really regretting not demanding a recount now.
#11 Sep 17 2010 at 5:58 PM Rating: Decent
Encyclopedia
******
35,568 posts
catwho wrote:
Then again, no I don't. He declares an income of $150K a year on his auto salvaging business, and owes over $2 million dollars on his two homes. I'm sorry, isn't the recommended maximum of home value for an income of a grand and a half around $375-400K? And this is GA we're talking about, where $400K is enough to get you a really nice, really big house in a really good neighborhood.


Don't know anything specifically about this guy, but:

$150k/year isn't a "grand and a half" (that would be $1.5k/year, but I'm going to assume you actually meant "150 grand". And the usual debt to income ratio allowed ranges from 5/1 to 10/1 depending on other financial factors. It's not uncommon or even unusual for someone making $50k/year to be able to qualify easily for a $250k mortgage loan. Someone making $150k/year could quite reasonably manage upwards of a million dollars in loan debt. 2 million does seem a bit high though.

Quote:
Since the loan was cosigned using his overpriced, overvalued homes as collateral, and he lied on the loan forms about the amount of equity he had in them, he dug himself into this hole.


Assuming he did lie, then that is true.
____________________________
King Nobby wrote:
More words please
#12 Sep 17 2010 at 6:04 PM Rating: Good
gbaji wrote:
catwho wrote:
Then again, no I don't. He declares an income of $150K a year on his auto salvaging business, and owes over $2 million dollars on his two homes. I'm sorry, isn't the recommended maximum of home value for an income of a grand and a half around $375-400K? And this is GA we're talking about, where $400K is enough to get you a really nice, really big house in a really good neighborhood.


Don't know anything specifically about this guy, but:

$150k/year isn't a "grand and a half" (that would be $1.5k/year, but I'm going to assume you actually meant "150 grand". And the usual debt to income ratio allowed ranges from 5/1 to 10/1 depending on other financial factors. It's not uncommon or even unusual for someone making $50k/year to be able to qualify easily for a $250k mortgage loan. Someone making $150k/year could quite reasonably manage upwards of a million dollars in loan debt. 2 million does seem a bit high though.

Quote:
Since the loan was cosigned using his overpriced, overvalued homes as collateral, and he lied on the loan forms about the amount of equity he had in them, he dug himself into this hole.


Assuming he did lie, then that is true.


Well, really, even if all he did was prop up a terrible business he still dug himself into this hole. It's understandable that his judgment would be impaired when dealing with his kid, but that's still entirely his deal.
#13 Sep 17 2010 at 6:26 PM Rating: Good
Yeah I meant 150 grand.

Apparently, he is now being pressured to step aside by the Handel faction of the GOP. The good ol' boys can't be very happy with him either.

Sad thing is, this is GA. He'll still probably be elected if he doesn't bow out now. But it's no longer a guaranteed thing - Roy Barnes has the backing of the entire education infrastructure in GA, which is not insignificant.
#14 Sep 17 2010 at 6:46 PM Rating: Default
Encyclopedia
******
35,568 posts
Kavekk the Ludicrous wrote:
Well, really, even if all he did was prop up a terrible business he still dug himself into this hole. It's understandable that his judgment would be impaired when dealing with his kid, but that's still entirely his deal.


Sure. I'm just not sure how this is super relevant though. I suppose you could argue that if he couldn't handle his own finances, how well will he handle the state's, but that wasn't really the implication most of you seemed to be going for. Maybe I misread it, but it seemed like some of the posters were trying to make it out like he'd done something illegal or underhanded here. Which I don't see at all.

He cosigned on a business loan for his daughter. As far as I can see from the facts, that's the only mistake he made. Honestly, the larger issue to me is the potential issues with campaign funding for a candidate who's in the middle of a bankruptcy process. It doesn't really tell us anything about his qualification to hold the office though.
____________________________
King Nobby wrote:
More words please
#15 Sep 17 2010 at 11:44 PM Rating: Good
Actually, the concern isn't the bankruptcy itself. It's the fact that he lied about it. He lied about the debts on his campaign application and campaign finance disclosure forms. He lied about his debts to the banks, even. He lied about the values of his property and the amount of equity he had in them. His son-in-law, it turns out, also failed to disclose a previous bankruptcy, which means the debts of that family are still possibly valid too.

Quote:
Such behavior is troubling, because Deal’s finances are pertinent to the job for which he is applying. There’s a reason that private companies run credit checks when hiring a CEO or other official in a financially sensitive post. And any job candidate who tried to conceal such information, as Deal has done, would be disqualified.


It's only now coming to light because some reporters at the AP decided to poke around and discovered that the numbers from public records didn't add up. When confronted about it, he called the missing 2.8 million dollars an "oversight." Yeah, right. (The numbers still don't add up. He claims his auto salvage business is worth $5 million dollars, but then only declares $150K income a year from it.)

If he had been honest about his debts during the primary, then it wouldn't have been as big a deal - except to the true fiscal conservatives, who would view what he did and the debts he accrued as possibly living beyond his means.

On the other hand, you're right about not wanting to have someone who cannot even handle his own finances running our state. GA isn't in as bad of shape as CA, but it's been running deficits and the budget has already been stripped down to the bone. We're terrified of getting another Sonny Purdue - who thinks it's fine to blow $15 million dollars on a horse arena in his home town, while at the same time firing hundreds of teachers around the state because "we can't afford them." His priorities were out of line.

And so, it seems, are former Congressman Deal's priorities. If your daughter declared bankruptcy and you're on the hook for the loan, it seems like a bad time to quit your job and go pounding the pavement for another one. Unless, of course, the first job is about to investigate you for ethics complaints and the second job comes with a nice house to live in once your own home is foreclosed...

Edited, Sep 18th 2010 1:44am by catwho
#16 Sep 18 2010 at 12:53 AM Rating: Decent
Prodigal Son
******
20,643 posts
catwho wrote:
It's only now coming to light because some reporters at the AP decided to poke around and discovered that the numbers from public records didn't add up. When confronted about it, he called the missing 2.8 million dollars an "oversight." Yeah, right. (The numbers still don't add up. He claims his auto salvage business is worth $5 million dollars, but then only declares $150K income a year from it.)

Well, at least he won't be affected by repealing the tax cuts!
____________________________
publiusvarus wrote:
we all know liberals are well adjusted american citizens who only want what's best for society. While conservatives are evil money grubbing scum who only want to sh*t on the little man and rob the world of its resources.
#17 Sep 18 2010 at 12:57 AM Rating: Good
Yep, with that much debt he probably qualifies for the Earned Income tax credits.
#18 Sep 19 2010 at 11:02 PM Rating: Good
Avatar
*****
13,240 posts
Quote:
It's only now coming to light because some reporters at the AP decided to poke around and discovered that the numbers from public records didn't add up. When confronted about it, he called the missing 2.8 million dollars an "oversight." Yeah, right. (The numbers still don't add up. He claims his auto salvage business is worth $5 million dollars, but then only declares $150K income a year from it.)


The business could very well be valued at $5 with all the salvage equipment, part stock, facilities etc, generating far upwards of 150k, but the 150k is his cut, which is reasonable.

Also, being a business owner doesn't preclude you from running for office too, as if you have decent second string management, they should be able to handle the actual operational stuff.

Now a 56% Debt to Asset ratio (And this is high-balling it since I'm totally discounting any portfolio, home and other assets), while certainly not good, is viable, and the 2.8 will probably be negotiated downward if the guy has any sense. He's doing much worse than he was previously when he was up 2M, but that's failed businesses for you. Selling his business, portfolio or other stuff could put him in the black.

Just to be fair.
____________________________
Just as Planned.
#19 Sep 19 2010 at 11:19 PM Rating: Good
Avatar
*****
13,240 posts
The least believable thing about this is that this guy didn't do some kind of stop-loss prior to the 3 mile island that was his kids business venture. I tentatively chalk that up to the kids attempting to cover up the finances, in order to try to turn the ship around without daddy knowing, which, since he co-signed is kinda illegal, but that probably would have put him in the ugly position of going to court against them or eating the loss. Either way, they are unlikely to see a nickel in the will.

It didn't help matters that the bank they used was full of magical thinkers, either.
____________________________
Just as Planned.
#20 Sep 20 2010 at 11:20 AM Rating: Good
The banks that made the loans have since failed. Oops.

Something that occurred to me: Deal was a Congress Critter at the time, so the banks probably consented to the loans when he was still pulling in over $300K a year ($150K from his salvage business, and then his congressional salary.) That nasty little ethics violation charge that caused him to quit his job as a Congressman before he was fired probably hurt him far more than he let on. A $15,000 a month loan payment isn't as horrible when you're making $25,000 a month. Depending on how bad the mortgage is, you can still live pretty decently.

Still, this is the Good Ol' Boy network. Someone with lots of money to throw around will coming riding to his rescue to buy out the property. (Or not, depending on how many people he pissed off.)

(Technically, as a white male graduate of UGA, my husband is now eligible to become a very very junior member of the Georgia Good Ol' Boy Network (tm), but since he's a flaming socialist liberal, that's not gonna happen.)
#21 Sep 20 2010 at 4:20 PM Rating: Default
Encyclopedia
******
35,568 posts
catwho wrote:
Actually, the concern isn't the bankruptcy itself. It's the fact that he lied about it.


None of which was in the posted article. Nor was anything else you've brought up. Do you actually have links for that stuff? Pretend that some of us live on the other side of the country and haven't seen or read any of the local coverage...
____________________________
King Nobby wrote:
More words please
#22 Sep 20 2010 at 4:30 PM Rating: Excellent
gbaji wrote:
None of which was in the posted article. Nor was anything else you've brought up. Do you actually have links for that stuff?


Oh, the irony hypocrisy.
#23 Sep 20 2010 at 5:59 PM Rating: Default
Encyclopedia
******
35,568 posts
Belkira the Tulip wrote:
gbaji wrote:
None of which was in the posted article. Nor was anything else you've brought up. Do you actually have links for that stuff?


Oh, the irony hypocrisy.


Two problems:

1. I'm not insisting that something *didn't* happen. I'd just like some sort of starting point for this. If someone's going to take the time to link an article about someone, but then include tons of allegations not contained at all in said article, I'm going to ask where they're getting that information.

2. If I make a claim that a specific person took a specific action, I'll back it up with a citation. What I'm not going to do is deal with someone who insists that nothing is true or valid unless someone they hold as an authority has blessed it as fact. People are entitled to opinions, which is kinda the whole point of debate.


I'm just asking where this information is coming from. It wasn't in the original link.
____________________________
King Nobby wrote:
More words please
#24 Sep 20 2010 at 7:10 PM Rating: Excellent
Prodigal Son
******
20,643 posts
gbaji wrote:
Belkira the Tulip wrote:
gbaji wrote:
None of which was in the posted article. Nor was anything else you've brought up. Do you actually have links for that stuff?


Oh, the irony hypocrisy.


Two problems:

1. I'm not insisting that something *didn't* happen. I'd just like some sort of starting point for this. If someone's going to take the time to link an article about someone, but then include tons of allegations not contained at all in said article, I'm going to ask where they're getting that information.

2. If I make a claim that a specific person took a specific action, I'll back it up with a citation. What I'm not going to do is deal with someone who insists that nothing is true or valid unless someone they hold as an authority has blessed it as fact. People are entitled to opinions, which is kinda the whole point of debate.


I'm just asking where this information is coming from. It wasn't in the original link.


Bookmarked for later reference
____________________________
publiusvarus wrote:
we all know liberals are well adjusted american citizens who only want what's best for society. While conservatives are evil money grubbing scum who only want to sh*t on the little man and rob the world of its resources.
#25 Sep 20 2010 at 7:53 PM Rating: Good
****
4,512 posts
Hey, does anyone remember when gbaji claimed medical professionals would move out of the US to get a higher salary, claimed it had something to do with some obscure article he read, and then didn't provide one cite at all of at least ONE person doing it?

No?

Well I do. :(
#26 Sep 20 2010 at 7:58 PM Rating: Good
Soulless Internet Tiger
******
35,474 posts
For fuck's sake, get over that already.
____________________________
Donate. One day it could be your family.


An invasion of armies can be resisted, but not an idea whose time has come. Victor Hugo

« Previous 1 2 3 4 5
Reply To Thread

Colors Smileys Quote OriginalQuote Checked Help

 

Recent Visitors: 350 All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (350)