AZ has another bill.Follow

That only applied to Federal income taxes. Depending on the location, people still pay state income taxes (important if we're discussing schools and hospitals), FICA, property taxes, sales taxes, licenses and fees on various things, etc. Some things such as sales taxes they'll usually pay either way. Other things would see an increase if they don't need to fear being discovered by the bureaucracy.

The irony here is that you have a population of people who came here explicitly to find work, work hard and earn enough money to support themselves here and send some home. But we won't let them access anything beyond the lowest tier of employment and then ***** that they're costing us money in services.

Dubya's a liberal now? WOW. The Republican party really is fracturing. Thank you tea party!

Jophed,

Or you could send them all back to mexico and create millions of jobs for the 10% of americans who are currently unemployeed.

Blatantly false, IMHO.... I live in So.Cal & pretty much everyone knows where they are.

I could point out hundreds on very short notice (the cliche Home Depot parking lot,etc etc)

Thats not the point though,opponents of the AZ law want to keep the focus on "Racism" but it might be interesting to some that in a lot of areas where illegals are seen as a problem, much of the political & law enforcement structure is overwhelmingly Hispanic.

Just one example of why many of them also support the law : Did you know its illegal to offer construction & labor services without a Contractors license ? Every year the CSLB & local law enforcement run stings where they arrest people offering these services IN HOME DEPOT !! but if we dont know who you are really, enforcement kinda breaks down after initial arrest.

Another : Penalties for Drunk Driving, Petty Theft,Sex crimes etc etc ALL get more severe with subsequent convictions...but if we dont know who you really are.... we had a case here last year where a 6 time DUI offender with a prior Manslaughter DUI & numerous deportation actions killed 3 more people.... drunk driving.

Unfortunately, victims of these types of crimes have to deal with an additional element: The perpetrator shouldnt have even been here. (& the authorities knew it & did nothing)

Another reason these types of laws (AZ's) garner support is the fact that people in the system know that the illegals themselves are more often victims & suffer inhumane treatment due to their inability to seek relief.

Every year there are several deaths (sometimes a whole family) from carbon monoxide poisoning due to trying to heat a garage with a hibachi & charcoal. They are often packed in houses WAY over capacity & paying way too much rent for it.

I had a discussion with a code enforcement officer just the other day (Hispanic) saying he wishes he could do something about it but the city policy is "Turn a Blind Eye" (we were on the roof of a house & the backyard of the house next door had 3 trailers & a camper in it, with extension cords running to all of them)

His thought was the only time it would be addressed is when the inevitable fire happens & the fire dept investigators have to deal with it.

Kidnapping, Home Invasion Robbery, Sex slavery, Lottery Fraud, Usury/Fiscal Fraud & drug smuggling to pay coyotes are all rampant in the Illegal underground.

(Just like in prior generations of Immigrant culture) nothing new here really, its just a different climate now Drugs, 9/11, the involvement of prison based criminal gangs..... It would not be unusal to see a Guatemalen or Salvadoran (whos never been here) with a street in Los Angeles tatto'd across the front of his neck in 4 inch high letters. (18th)

The really funny thing is there are probably more hispanic Reapublicans than Real Criminal aliens.

Terriyfing,

I agree with everything you just said.


I grew up in south texas and everyone knows where to look they just don't.

H*ll here in knoxville they'll pull an illegal over for speeding and he won't have a drivers license speak any english and the police will just let them go with a ticket.

We know where they are the thing is the Democrats rely on their votes and the introduction of another welfare class who will depend on govn and the wealthy Republicans use them for cheap labour. So the base of both parties have absolute no interest in enforcing the law and deporting people here illegally.

Well I suppose it's just difference in region then. I live in South Texas (and have lived here all my life), and as I said, it's virtually impossible to point out illegal immigrants from legal immigrants or even natural born citizens, unless you just happen to catch them crossing the river or something. Even the cliche areas (you mentioned Home Depot) in my area are the exceptions to the rule. I pass by home depot often and I have never seen people looking for work.

How do you know they're illegal without asking?

So do poverty level U.S. citizens. Take any run of the mill illegal immigrant and give him a green card. Do you think it will some how magically make him a productive member of society? Will he suddenly gain new skills and find a job that pays him sufficiently enough to contribute to society any more than a single mother working two jobs who can barely feed her kids? No. The only distinction between the two is that illegal immigrant wasn't born here. Hardly a crime, IMO.


Edited, May 14th 2010 4:33pm by BrownDuck

Well, for some it will. Or at least make them a more productive member. You've got people out there working well below their potential purely because they can't access better employment without some sort of legal status.

Note I'm not saying this applies to everyone but it certainly does to a select group of them.

I'm truly dissappointed that no one ran with the "duck bill" line I set up there. That was too perfect to pass up!

"Officer, I've just been mugged, he took my entire wallet."
"Identification, please."
"It was in my wallet."
"You have the right to remain silent... "

Many illegals do pay taxes. The ones who get jobs with bogus papers and SSN's will pay federal, SS, and medicare tax. Most don't push their luck and won't file for a return. So the truth is, we don't know whether they positively or negatively effect our coffers.

Useful and illegal seem so far distant to me, it's not even funny. If I feel like taking a walk and I don't want to bring my purse, wallet, or even my license in my pocket with me, I shouldn't be breaking the law to do so.

This society might be trending towards a cashless society, but that doesn't mean everyone is going there. Some people have no need for a driver's license, and if they don't want to bother getting any other form of ID, why should it be mandatory? Should they really be arrested for not needing it, and therefore not obtaining it?