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#102 Mar 02 2010 at 3:29 AM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:


Ok. But how do you get from that definition of God to an assumption that "conservatives are an evolutionary dead end"? I don't have an issue with you happening to hold both views, but I can't see how one leads one to the other.


Thats because your a conservative, sillySmiley: rolleyes

Its simple. If you dont allow yourself to continuously evolve and adapt to the ever changing reality we all live in, you will stagnate, and when your traditions become your reasons for existance, then evolution will leave you behind to become another example of a curiosity either verging on extinction, or in fact extinct.

And girls wont find you attractive either.
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#103 Mar 02 2010 at 5:37 AM Rating: Excellent
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paulsol wrote:
Its simple. If you dont allow yourself to continuously evolve and adapt to the ever changing reality we all live in, you will stagnate, and when your traditions become your reasons for existance, then evolution will leave you behind to become another example of a curiosity either verging on extinction, or in fact extinct.
Right, just like the Jewish. Everyone knows they're largely unsuccessful, stupid, mostly conservative, and nearly extinct. Smiley: rolleyes

Edited, Mar 2nd 2010 5:38am by Atomicflea
#104 Mar 02 2010 at 9:10 AM Rating: Good
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C'mon guys, that was a blatant troll.

I'm begining to lose faith.
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#105 Mar 02 2010 at 9:46 AM Rating: Excellent
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Why don't you? You're the one with the bizarre notion that engineers represent some gold standard in intellectual brilliance. When you have anything besides your usual blind Gbaji guesses and conjecture, we can talk. But we both know that'll never happen.


It's because he's an engineer. And he really needs for his job to give him some kind of intellectual validation. Because it's the only thing he's got.

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Smart people who want to make money aren't going to be going into the sciences, period.
Finance is kind of like science.

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In the real world, there are orders of magnitude more equally smart people in most fields who work by applying their knowledge to actually build things that people will pay for (I even used this definition earlier). Useful things. Not things that happen to meet the on paper requirements set up in a grant. That's why the people in my field produce things like better cell phones and make a profit doing it, and the people in your field spend millions of dollars of taxpayer money to produce things like research showing that men like sex.


Seems silly to single out that as an example, when we by and large we spend our research dollars on things like nanoengineering, regenerative technologies, metamaterial science, Superconductancebiofuel, quantum dynamics and the like.
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#106 Mar 02 2010 at 10:11 AM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
Guenny wrote:
I think agnosticism is used to often to define people who believe in the Christian god, but are just not too keen on his strict rules. People who default and think "god" is a big old man in the sky who fights the devil are ignorant. People who need the "truth" before they can make a "decision" are too left-brained to care about spirituality. My definition stands as valid.


If you scoff at the thought of a man in the clouds running the universe, and make fun of everyone who believes in such things, you are an Atheist. Please don't drag us Agnostics into your silly arguments by calling yourself an Agnostic.


I haven't read much of your ********* but I can see you didn't read any of mine either, because I've never claimed to be agnostic. I also never said I was atheist, either. I was mocking your interpretation of it, which is jumbled and weird at best. Because I don't believe in the Christian god I am an atheist? Gotta love unfounded conservative stereotyping.
#107 Mar 02 2010 at 10:36 AM Rating: Good
"In the real world, there are orders of magnitude more equally smart people in most fields who work by applying their knowledge to actually build things that people will pay for (I even used this definition earlier). Useful things. Not things that happen to meet the on paper requirements set up in a grant."

To get funded, generally your requirements are to find something no one knows yet.

"That's why the people in my field produce things like better cell phones and make a profit doing it,"

Incremental improvements? Ya, there is incremental science, too. You'll never get funded for that.

Also, gbaji has been pretty clear about what he does for a living. It is in no way what he describes here.

"and the people in your field spend millions of dollars of taxpayer money to produce things like research showing that men like sex. "

So this is a complete delusion. Let me put it in simple terms: there are many, many people competing for very small amounts of grant money. Particularly in the social sciences, where very little money is invested.

Lastly, I find it ironic that gbaji is suggesting we take a poll for a policy. Worldwide, universal health care has overwhelming support. Worldwide, US conservatives are a fringe movement - far more conservative then the conservatives other vote for. Now of course we know gbaji doesn't travel much so perhaps he can get away with thinking all the "people...who work by applying their knowledge" mostly reside in the USA. Reality, of course, suggests the opposite.
#108 Mar 02 2010 at 10:51 AM Rating: Good
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To get funded, generally your requirements are to find something no one knows yet.

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Incremental improvements? Ya, there is incremental science, too. You'll never get funded for that.

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Let me put it in simple terms: there are many, many people competing for very small amounts of grant money.

In a break from the norm, I'd like to make an out-of-character mocking post on a serious thread.

Might I point out the 300,000 pounds that the British Government spent to find out that ducks like water?

Granted, their public health system is so efficient that there is money to spare there. It's really not a fair comparison. We should have national health care too, so we can find out if pigs really do like mud.
#109 Mar 02 2010 at 11:06 AM Rating: Good
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His Excellency MoebiusLord wrote:
Quote:
To get funded, generally your requirements are to find something no one knows yet.

Quote:
Incremental improvements? Ya, there is incremental science, too. You'll never get funded for that.

Quote:
Let me put it in simple terms: there are many, many people competing for very small amounts of grant money.

In a break from the norm, I'd like to make an out-of-character mocking post on a serious thread.

Might I point out the 300,000 pounds that the British Government spent to find out that ducks like water?

Granted, their public health system is so efficient that there is money to spare there. It's really not a fair comparison. We should have national health care too, so we can find out if pigs really do like mud.


I'm torn, because on one hand, when I had pet ducks in 3rd grade I learned quickly how much more ducks like running/falling water than standing water. However, I don't blame the folks for wanting to get paid to play with ducks. Ducks are awesome.
#110 Mar 02 2010 at 11:09 AM Rating: Good
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Guenny wrote:
His Excellency MoebiusLord wrote:
Quote:
To get funded, generally your requirements are to find something no one knows yet.

Quote:
Incremental improvements? Ya, there is incremental science, too. You'll never get funded for that.

Quote:
Let me put it in simple terms: there are many, many people competing for very small amounts of grant money.

In a break from the norm, I'd like to make an out-of-character mocking post on a serious thread.

Might I point out the 300,000 pounds that the British Government spent to find out that ducks like water?

Granted, their public health system is so efficient that there is money to spare there. It's really not a fair comparison. We should have national health care too, so we can find out if pigs really do like mud.


I'm torn, because on one hand, when I had pet ducks in 3rd grade I learned quickly how much more ducks like running/falling water than standing water. However, I don't blame the folks for wanting to get paid to play with ducks. Ducks are awesome.
They **** all over.
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#111 Mar 02 2010 at 11:12 AM Rating: Excellent
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Guenny wrote:
Ducks are awesome.


You're just saying that because of Brown Duck.
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#112 Mar 02 2010 at 11:13 AM Rating: Good
I think the Duck people must have had a pretty good argument to get the $300K, so you must blame the stupid conservative who approved of them getting the $.

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#113 Mar 02 2010 at 11:13 AM Rating: Excellent
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That's not ****, that's guano.

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#114 Mar 02 2010 at 11:15 AM Rating: Good
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Whatever you say, Nexa.
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#115 Mar 02 2010 at 12:07 PM Rating: Good
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We don't need your recognition, we know we're better. Smiley: sly
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#116 Mar 02 2010 at 12:13 PM Rating: Good
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Samira wrote:
That's not ****, that's guano.



I specifically remember David (bloody) Attenborough wading around in guano in a giant cave full of bats in one of his wildlife duckumentaries. Now I'm pretty sure there wern't any ducks about, but I could be wrong because I'm at work, and I think theres some conservatives in the next room.

Duck shit. Bat guano.
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#117 Mar 02 2010 at 12:15 PM Rating: Decent
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paulsol wrote:
gbaji wrote:


Ok. But how do you get from that definition of God to an assumption that "conservatives are an evolutionary dead end"? I don't have an issue with you happening to hold both views, but I can't see how one leads one to the other.


Thats because your a conservative, sillySmiley: rolleyes

Its simple. If you dont allow yourself to continuously evolve and adapt to the ever changing reality we all live in, you will stagnate, and when your traditions become your reasons for existance, then evolution will leave you behind to become another example of a curiosity either verging on extinction, or in fact extinct.


Ok. But how does one derive this from your description of God? I wasn't taking issue with your two positions, only with your statement that one lead to the other.
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#118 Mar 02 2010 at 12:16 PM Rating: Excellent
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paulsol wrote:
Samira wrote:
That's not ****, that's guano.



I specifically remember David (bloody) Attenborough wading around in guano in a giant cave full of bats in one of his wildlife duckumentaries. Now I'm pretty sure there wern't any ducks about, but I could be wrong because I'm at work, and I think theres some conservatives in the next room.

Duck shit. Bat guano.


Guano (from the Quechua 'wanu', via Spanish) is the excrement (***** and urine) of seabirds, bats, and seals.

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#119 Mar 02 2010 at 12:18 PM Rating: Decent
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Guenny wrote:
gbaji wrote:
Guenny wrote:
I think agnosticism is used to often to define people who believe in the Christian god, but are just not too keen on his strict rules. People who default and think "god" is a big old man in the sky who fights the devil are ignorant. People who need the "truth" before they can make a "decision" are too left-brained to care about spirituality. My definition stands as valid.


If you scoff at the thought of a man in the clouds running the universe, and make fun of everyone who believes in such things, you are an Atheist. Please don't drag us Agnostics into your silly arguments by calling yourself an Agnostic.


I haven't read much of your bullsh*t, but I can see you didn't read any of mine either, because I've never claimed to be agnostic. I also never said I was atheist, either. I was mocking your interpretation of it, which is jumbled and weird at best. Because I don't believe in the Christian god I am an atheist? Gotta love unfounded conservative stereotyping.


Er? I didn't mention the "Christian God". You did. I spoke much more broadly about the "existence of the divine". Don't press your own assumptions on me... ;)
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#120 Mar 02 2010 at 12:20 PM Rating: Excellent
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If you scoff at the thought of a man in the clouds running the universe, and make fun of everyone who believes in such things, you are an Atheist.


Some people believe in a God or in gods that do not take that form. They are not atheists. I believe that was Guenny's point.
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#121 Mar 02 2010 at 12:20 PM Rating: Good
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The Glorious Atomicflea wrote:
Right, just like the Jewish. Everyone knows they're largely unsuccessful, stupid, mostly conservative, and nearly extinct. Smiley: rolleyes



To be fair tho, their current leadership in Israel is about as Conservative as you can get, and if they carry on being as stupid as they are atm, extinction is becoming a possibility.
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#122 Mar 02 2010 at 12:22 PM Rating: Excellent
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Samira wrote:
paulsol wrote:
Samira wrote:
That's not ****, that's guano.



I specifically remember David (bloody) Attenborough wading around in guano in a giant cave full of bats in one of his wildlife duckumentaries. Now I'm pretty sure there wern't any ducks about, but I could be wrong because I'm at work, and I think theres some conservatives in the next room.

Duck shit. Bat guano.


Guano (from the Quechua 'wanu', via Spanish) is the excrement (***** and urine) of seabirds, bats, and seals.



Ah. The spanish seal eating sea-duck! Why didnt you say so in the first place?
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#123 Mar 02 2010 at 12:33 PM Rating: Decent
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yossarian wrote:
"and the people in your field spend millions of dollars of taxpayer money to produce things like research showing that men like sex. "

So this is a complete delusion. Let me put it in simple terms: there are many, many people competing for very small amounts of grant money. Particularly in the social sciences, where very little money is invested.


And yet, every single year we are treated to examples of the kinds of silly things that do get funded. It's not a delusion when it happens, is it?

There's also some reasonable evidence that not only does publicly funded research not produce much in economic terms, but my actually produce negative effects by "crowding out" potentially more fruitful research by private industries in the same areas.
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#124 Mar 02 2010 at 12:50 PM Rating: Good
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Iamadam the Prohpet wrote:
Guenny wrote:
Ducks are awesome.


You're just saying that because of Brown Duck.


No, I'm saying that because of Baby, Ducky, Little Foot, and Mo, who were my pet ducks when I was little. I won a pet-show talent contest on just their cuteness.
#125 Mar 02 2010 at 12:53 PM Rating: Good
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Nice cherry picking there.
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#126 Mar 02 2010 at 1:00 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:


And yet, every single year we are treated to examples of the kinds of silly things that do get funded. It's not a delusion when it happens, is it?

Examples please.
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