http://health.howstuffworks.com/vaccine.htm
There's also How Stuff Works, which offers a simplified explanation of how Vaccines work (**with pictures!), and their history.
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Toohotforu wrote:
Just punch her in the vag and tell her to @#$% off.
paulsol wrote:
I seem to have develooped a really nasty cold.
I fnd saline rinsing of the nasal passages helps a lot, so I'm going for a surf. If I'm not feeling better after that, I think I'll take a few days off work and allow my immune system to sort it out for me.
I fnd saline rinsing of the nasal passages helps a lot, so I'm going for a surf. If I'm not feeling better after that, I think I'll take a few days off work and allow my immune system to sort it out for me.
MURDER.. wait
Aww I'm just kidding. Enjoy the glass of
soulshaver wrote:
So no one offered any scientific information because we don't have much to offer as a scientific community, so you resort to conceding my point but tacking on an insult just for good measure. If you don't care about some random speculation from a random forum poster, don't bother posting.
because you are asking for scientific information on an untestable hypothetical. Science is built around repeatable, observable data which is impossible to ascertain for something as asinine as "WHAT IF TEH IMMUNE SISTUM DUN EVOLVED DIFRUNTLY"
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I expected more out of ya'll, and I'm still waiting for some evidence that proves we know "definitely how it works" since that was the suggestion made earlier.
We don't even know how gravity works, you dumb ****. Asking for 100% conclusive evidence that something works in a specific way is a stupid request, which is why everyone is laughing at you.
Everytime I see this thread's title, I think Dirty Sanchez. This thread would have been better had that been the topic.
Donate. One day it could be your family.
An invasion of armies can be resisted, but not an idea whose time has come. Victor Hugo
An invasion of armies can be resisted, but not an idea whose time has come. Victor Hugo
#131REDACTED,
Posted: Oct 24 2009 at 3:36 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) I rated you up for this, this is basically one of the major points I have been trying to make throughout this entire dialog, we don't know much about evolution. Thank you for pointing this out.
soulshaver wrote:
I ignored your earlier post because you didn't offer any evidence.
If everyone ignored posts without evidence, nobody would be answering your posts/questions.
#133REDACTED,
Posted: Oct 24 2009 at 4:25 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Except that I have presented scientific evidence in support of my point. Did you read the post above?
soulshaver wrote:
Quote:
If everyone ignored posts without evidence, nobody would be answering your posts/questions.
Except that I have presented scientific evidence in support of my point. Did you read the post above?
But how do you know that science is accurate?
You are trying to use science to base a claim that science isn't as good as we think it is.
#135REDACTED,
Posted: Oct 24 2009 at 5:08 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) I don't, and thats essentially the point I am making, that we don't have a full understanding yet.
soulshaver wrote:
blah blah blah
What the hell is your point, anyway? You seem to be dead set on arguing the general belief that nothing is absolute and our knowledge is always evolving. I don't suspect anyone would disagree with that.
However, what you don't seem to want to understand (or accept?) is that for science to be beneficial to us, we don't need to work in absolutes. 90% accuracy is perfectly acceptable in most scenarios. To argue that we don't have a working understanding of viruses, how they work, evolve, and how to defend ourselves against them is blatantly stupid. We may not know everything or how to predict the future, but functionally, we know enough to work with them, especially where medicine is concerned, because a vaccination or medical treatment doesn't have to be 100% effective to be beneficial to the majority of people.
#137REDACTED,
Posted: Oct 24 2009 at 5:41 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) My point is that our current level of understanding is not enough to make me feel comfortable taking the vaccine. There may be enough evidence (certainty) for you, but its not enough for me.
soulshaver wrote:
Quote:
But how do you know that science is accurate?
I don't, and thats essentially the point I am making, that we don't have a full understanding yet.
then you admit that your logic is flawed, fantastic.
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But I do think we should use the best scientific evidence we have at the time to make practical decisions about life.
we are
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Thats why I don't disagree that the vaccine does work in some way
it does
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and I'm not discouraging people from getting it (or that we understand the basic biology behind making the vaccine work effectively.)
nobody would listen to you anyway, especially after admitting you have absolutely no science or medical background.
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However, I don't think we know enough about it for me personally to feel safe taking the vaccine. Its not that I don't understand or believe the basic biology behind the vaccine, I just think we tend to get overconfident about our new technologies solving all of our problems and we don't take into account the potential long-term side effects that may not be easy to predict.
Then that's your prerogative to make uninformed decisions. You asked for scientific evidence but then said that because it isn't 100% it is invalid. Once again, nothing in science is 100%. As I already mentioned, we don't even fully understand how gravity works.
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A perfect example of this is cell phone use. The WHO will release a report later this year that links long-term cell phone use to "three types of brain tumour and a tumour of the salivary gland." Now that we have essentially integrated (and in some cases become dependent upon) cell phone use in our everyday lives, how many of you are going to give up your cell phone?
Breathing in O2 (molecular oxygen) introduces free radicals into your body which can also cause all sorts of chaos, including cancer.
soulshaver wrote:
This is why I brought up the cell phone example. We get so caught up in short term solutions that we lose sight of potential long term problems that could be much worse than any advantage gained with the short term solution.
Guess what the long term solution to this strain of flu is? It is an epidemic that would need to wipe across the entire earth and kill everyone who isn't naturally immune.
I prefer the short term solution.
#140REDACTED,
Posted: Oct 24 2009 at 5:46 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) By all means then, inject the drug up your nose.
soulshaver wrote:
Quote:
I prefer the short term solution.
By all means then, inject the drug up your nose.
way to completely ignore all the points I made in preference of using inflammatory words to rile up opposition.
Bardalicious wrote:
Guess what the long term solution to this strain of flu is? It is an epidemic that would need to wipe across the entire earth and kill everyone who isn't naturally immune.
Sounds like a very environmentally sound plan.....+1
"If you have selfish, ignorant citizens, you're gonna get selfish, ignorant leaders". Carlin.
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By all means then, inject the drug up your nose.
Way to even mangle the delivery process. It's an injection OR a vapor.
Just as Planned.
I just got the nasal seasonal flu vaccine today, so I won't be able to get the H1N1 mind control spray for another week.
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
bsphil wrote:
I just got the nasal seasonal flu vaccine today, so I won't be able to get the H1N1 mind control spray for another week.
Well, I went surfing, got my nasal passages fully rinsed with saline, lazed around on the sofa drinking hot lemon and honey and then killed some trolls in Middle Earth. My immune system seems to have managed to save my life yet again, and I will be reporting back to work on Tuesday to spend some time easing the suffering of the general public and their manifold health woes!
Panic over...Phew!
What's all this fuss about vaccinations again?
Edited, Oct 25th 2009 5:23am by paulsol
"If you have selfish, ignorant citizens, you're gonna get selfish, ignorant leaders". Carlin.
I don't think mine was a vapor. It was a couple of drops of liquid that was squirted into my sinus cavities. I was then warned not to blow my nose for 30 minutes.
soulshaver wrote:
My point is that our current level of understanding is not enough to make me feel comfortable taking the vaccine. There may be enough evidence (certainty) for you, but its not enough for me.
Vaccines are the best solution for the time - for the huge numbers of people living all together. Though certainly not for everyone. There could be some negative unforeseen future side effect. Maybe evolutionary in nature, or maybe biological, or maybe the vaccines will be spiked and used as a WMD, or maybe improper disposal will cause the creation of TMNT's. Who knows?
Would we have went with fossil fuels for our major energy producer if we'd have known about global warming? If we hadn't developed, and even exploited the technology would society have been better or worse off? Who knows.
I've never had a flu shot, nor do I ever get the flu. I don't hang around kids much, but also recognize exposure pathways and use general simple hygienic practices to guard against exposure.
Alma wrote:
I lost my post
My husband works with college students who work with kids, and who are themselves in the "at risk" group (under 24 years old) for the H1N1 variant. It made sense for him to go ahead and get the vaccine, because the entire school is probably going to be hit with it, and he only has 1 sick day built up so far XD
I don't have the time to get involved in the debate this week, but for those who are interested, here's a very interesting, well-written, and unbiased, article exploring questions regarding the efficacy of the flu vaccine:
http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200911/brownlee-h1n1
http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200911/brownlee-h1n1
catwho, pet mage of Jabober wrote:
and he only has 1 sick day built up so far
What? You have to build up sick days before you are allowed to get sick?
Thats seriously fucked!
Or do I misunderstand?
"If you have selfish, ignorant citizens, you're gonna get selfish, ignorant leaders". Carlin.
paulsol wrote:
catwho, pet mage of Jabober wrote:
and he only has 1 sick day built up so far
What? You have to build up sick days before you are allowed to get sick?
Thats seriously fucked!
Or do I misunderstand?
Nope, that's pretty much exactly it. Some companies will let you go in "debt" with your sick days--i.e. you can use them before you have actually earned them--but you are only allotted so many a year. Mr. Ambrya has 3. His two weeks of vacation don't do much good for sick time, because you have to apply for the days in advance. If he gets sick, or if I get sick and he needs to stay home to care for Tristan, we better make a speedy recovery.
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