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When you text and drive...Follow

#52 Sep 03 2009 at 7:02 AM Rating: Decent
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Admiral LockeColeMA wrote:
Samira wrote:
It's a different brain space.


I'm not disagreeing with you, but do you have some sort of evidence of this? I think it would be interesting to see some studies on how our brains work differently when we talk with someone in person as opposed to on the phone. I imagine it would be something to do with a lack of nonverbal clues on the phone being instead imagined in one's mind, but I don't know for sure.
Take a look at the study I linked about 4 posts up. Research at the University of Utah used driving simulators to measure reaction times on different driving tasks. The variables were driving with no conversation, driving with a friend sitting next to you and chatting, and driving while conversing over a phone.

It pretty much supports what Sami says.





Edited, Sep 3rd 2009 5:03pm by Elinda
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#53 Sep 03 2009 at 3:54 PM Rating: Good
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I would agree that talking on the phone is more distracting than talking to a passenger, but still maintain that using a headset offers a marginally small enough advantage as to make the headset laws absurd.

#54 Sep 03 2009 at 4:06 PM Rating: Good
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Having a regular face to face conversation (with a passenger by your side) can be a tad distracting.

The issue with phone calls is that you only have verbal communication. To compensate for your inability to enhance the conversation with facial expressions, gestures and body language, you have to concentrate really hard. That is very distracting.

If I see anyone texting while driving, I flash my headlamps, hammer the horn and try to convey my willingness to take them on in hand to hand combat.

Also, gbaji's post was possibly the pinnacle of his "Wall of Words beats rational logic" philosophy and makes about as much sense as this inflatable Egyptian perfume that I have balanced on my niece's frown.
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#55 Sep 03 2009 at 8:20 PM Rating: Decent
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#56 Sep 04 2009 at 1:47 AM Rating: Good
Is it still ok to get a ******* while driving, or is that also considered "distracting" nowadays?
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#57 Sep 04 2009 at 2:59 AM Rating: Good
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RedPhoenixxx wrote:
Is it still ok to get a ******* while driving, or is that also considered "distracting" nowadays?


As long as there's no phone involved, I'd say you're ok.
#58 Sep 04 2009 at 12:08 PM Rating: Good
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Mistress Nadenu wrote:
RedPhoenixxx wrote:
Is it still ok to get a ******* while driving, or is that also considered "distracting" nowadays?


As long as there's no phone conversation involved, I'd say you're ok.
#59 Sep 08 2009 at 6:09 AM Rating: Decent
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there was an article with pics of a tow truck driver who was talking on one phone and texting on another.

he bounced off a house and landed in a pool.

pics are gone :( http://www.startribune.com/lifestyle/odd/52179462.html

Edited, Sep 8th 2009 10:14am by axhed
#60 Sep 08 2009 at 4:46 PM Rating: Default
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Elinda wrote:
Take a look at the study I linked about 4 posts up. Research at the University of Utah used driving simulators to measure reaction times on different driving tasks. The variables were driving with no conversation, driving with a friend sitting next to you and chatting, and driving while conversing over a phone.


Yup. That's one of the tests which I was talking about earlier. They constructed a test designed to maximize the amount of distraction a cell phone conversation might generate and should not be surprised at all that they saw it reflected in the data. They programmed the simulator to require that the driver make regular lane changes, and instructed the partners to engage in a specific conversation style designed to maximize the amount of participation the driver would have to engage in. They also allowed conversation with a passenger to drift into a talk about the drive itself. Which, while reasonable in "real" driving conditions, is unfair given that they set the simulator to prevent what a cell phone user would do under similarly "real" driving conditions (stay in one lane while talking on the phone).

They made note of the frequency with which conversation drifted, but if all you do is look at the tables, you won't realize this factor, or how important it is. This study obtained different results than most. Usually, the driver talking on the cell phone slowed down. In their tests, the drivers sped up. Presumably, they realized that the constraints of the test (active conversation while actively driving) was difficult and attempted to end the task as quickly as possible. In a real situation, the driver would either slow down and stay in one lane, or end the call if the conditions got a bit too tricky.


This test is a particularly bad one exactly because they made it impossible for the driver talking on the cell phone to reduce the degree of distraction caused by the conversation, but allowed exactly that to occur when they were talking with a passenger. If the objective is simply to determine that increased distraction will reduce driving capacity, they succeeded. But then, we already knew that. If they wanted to test if just having a conversation on a cell phone is inherently more dangerous than having a conversation with someone in the car, they should have enforced the same rules for both. They didn't.


They're also putting drivers in a simulator (which they're not familiar with), and under contrived driving conditions. Under those circumstances any physical activity will cause impairment. If they'd instructed the driver to change the radio station at least once every 30 seconds, they'd have gotten similarly skewed results. Put the same drivers in their own cars, give them an objective, but don't contrive the conditions. Allow the driver to adjust his driving to his current state of distraction. Just as you don't choose to fiddle with the radio right as you're passing between two semis, you adjust your conversation from listening to talking based on traffic conditions. They allowed this to occur when a passenger was in the car, but did not when they were on the phone. While this was meant to simulate the assumption that a passenger would modify his conversation to the driving conditions, but someone on the other end of a cell phone would not, that assumption skews their results. They should have simply instructed the driver to carry on a conversation as he saw fit, just as he would do if he were actually driving and talking in a real world situation.


It's a badly flawed study. Unfortunately, that's what seems to pass for studies in most universities these days. They start with an assumption, then contrive a test to show that their assumption happens. I can almost imagine the professor asking his students: "Ok. So, what conditions could we set which would most highlight the distraction talking on a cell phone would create...". That's the wrong way to approach such tests. You're biasing the results before you even start.


Quote:
It pretty much supports what Sami says.


Of course. She linked to an article which was written about the exact same study. What you'll find is that a whole lot of articles out there refer to just a handful of actual studies that have been done. And not one of them actually test real drivers in relatively real situations and allow them to moderate their own behavior based on driving conditions (which every driver would do).

If I require that you must light your cigarette whilst driving 100 mph on a one lane highway, I'll be able to show that lighting a cigarette is incredibly dangerous. Of course, if I allow you to adjust your speed to something that is safe while lighting said cigarette, the numbers will change, wont they? That's why the Utah study is flawed. That's why most of the studies are flawed. I haven't found one yet that really tested hands-free cell phone use against normal driving that didn't place similar requirements on the driver while talking on the cell phone.

The Utah study is actually one of the worst offenders. If you wanted to pick an example, there are better ones.
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#61 Sep 08 2009 at 11:11 PM Rating: Default
I seen this vid on a mom site I visit lol. Anyways I'm in the Army and I'm so glad you can't talk/text on your phone while driving on post. Although I agree all the other things mentioned (smoking, music, etc) is dangerous texting has to be the number one. Anyone remember that teen that killed someone a few years ago? She was on Oprah. I hope that episode changed a few people's minds.

I was amazed the polls on my mom site showed so many mothers also text while driving. It's a unbelievable risk you would take while your children are in the car!

We're not even allowed to walk and talk on our cells phones in the military. I'll admit I change the radio/cd player often. But it's no where as dangerous as texting. I hope people take this to heart.
#62 Sep 09 2009 at 5:38 AM Rating: Decent
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Sancha wrote:
Anyone remember that teen that killed someone a few years ago? She was on Oprah. I hope that episode changed a few people's minds.


I bet it did, wheeling out corpses will do that.
#63 Sep 09 2009 at 6:07 AM Rating: Decent
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gbaji wrote:


The Utah study is actually one of the worst offenders. If you wanted to pick an example, there are better ones.
Lol. Says you?

Listen it's a simple concept. There are many distractions while driving. Texting is a rather bad distraction as it requires most to actually look away from the road. Conversations with people NOT in the car with you are also very distracting, both because you may need to remove a hand from the wheel to hold and/or dial the phone but more importantly the possibility of a discussion that takes your mind off the road - possibly for an extended period of time.

There are studies that prove true this bit of common sense that you want to argue about. You chose not to believe the results for your own inexplicable reasons. I suspect it's simply your daily mind-exercise in futility.

Smiley: deadhorse
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#64 Sep 09 2009 at 6:09 AM Rating: Default
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Elinda wrote:
gbaji wrote:


The Utah study is actually one of the worst offenders. If you wanted to pick an example, there are better ones.
Lol. Says you?

Listen it's a simple concept. There are many distractions while driving. Texting is a rather bad distraction as it requires most to actually look away from the road. Conversations with people NOT in the car with you are also very distracting, both because you may need to remove a hand from the wheel to hold and/or dial the phone but more importantly the possibility of a discussion that takes your mind off the road - possibly for an extended period of time.

There are studies that prove true this bit of common sense that you want to argue about. You chose not to believe the results for your own inexplicable reasons. I suspect it's simply your daily mind-exercise in futility.

Smiley: deadhorse


Surely you have Bluetooth headset's over there?

Edited, Sep 9th 2009 2:09pm by Goggy
#65 Sep 09 2009 at 6:11 AM Rating: Decent
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Goggy wrote:
Elinda wrote:
gbaji wrote:


The Utah study is actually one of the worst offenders. If you wanted to pick an example, there are better ones.
Lol. Says you?

Listen it's a simple concept. There are many distractions while driving. Texting is a rather bad distraction as it requires most to actually look away from the road. Conversations with people NOT in the car with you are also very distracting, both because you may need to remove a hand from the wheel to hold and/or dial the phone but more importantly the possibility of a discussion that takes your mind off the road - possibly for an extended period of time.

There are studies that prove true this bit of common sense that you want to argue about. You chose not to believe the results for your own inexplicable reasons. I suspect it's simply your daily mind-exercise in futility.

Smiley: deadhorse


Surely you have Bluetooth headset's over there?

Edited, Sep 9th 2009 2:09pm by Goggy
So?
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#66 Sep 09 2009 at 6:21 AM Rating: Good
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Elinda wrote:
Admiral LockeColeMA wrote:
Samira wrote:
It's a different brain space.


I'm not disagreeing with you, but do you have some sort of evidence of this? I think it would be interesting to see some studies on how our brains work differently when we talk with someone in person as opposed to on the phone. I imagine it would be something to do with a lack of nonverbal clues on the phone being instead imagined in one's mind, but I don't know for sure.
Take a look at the study I linked about 4 posts up. Research at the University of Utah used driving simulators to measure reaction times on different driving tasks. The variables were driving with no conversation, driving with a friend sitting next to you and chatting, and driving while conversing over a phone.

It pretty much supports what Sami says.





Edited, Sep 3rd 2009 5:03pm by Elinda


I might have missed it (I only briefly looked through the study, though thank you for pointing out the link), but I had the impression that the study measured distraction, not brain activity. Samira was talking about how the brain actually reacts; that was what I was hoping to find. The idea being that since different areas of the brain are (possibly) utilized when talking to a person in person or on the phone. I guess the end result would be distraction, but I was interested in actually seeing how the brain function itself changed.

I was thinking of a study with those pretty pictures of brains lit up in separate areas Smiley: grin Not actually interested so much in distraction, as with the idea that we use different parts of our brain depending on whether we have people with us on hidden from us.
#67 Sep 09 2009 at 6:23 AM Rating: Default
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Elinda wrote:
Goggy wrote:
Elinda wrote:
gbaji wrote:


The Utah study is actually one of the worst offenders. If you wanted to pick an example, there are better ones.
Lol. Says you?

Listen it's a simple concept. There are many distractions while driving. Texting is a rather bad distraction as it requires most to actually look away from the road. Conversations with people NOT in the car with you are also very distracting, both because you may need to remove a hand from the wheel to hold and/or dial the phone but more importantly the possibility of a discussion that takes your mind off the road - possibly for an extended period of time.

There are studies that prove true this bit of common sense that you want to argue about. You chose not to believe the results for your own inexplicable reasons. I suspect it's simply your daily mind-exercise in futility.

Smiley: deadhorse


Surely you have Bluetooth headset's over there?

Edited, Sep 9th 2009 2:09pm by Goggy
So?


So? so?

So, why do you need to hold your phone then?
#68 Sep 09 2009 at 6:33 AM Rating: Decent
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Goggy wrote:
Elinda wrote:
Goggy wrote:
Elinda wrote:
gbaji wrote:


The Utah study is actually one of the worst offenders. If you wanted to pick an example, there are better ones.
Lol. Says you?

Listen it's a simple concept. There are many distractions while driving. Texting is a rather bad distraction as it requires most to actually look away from the road. Conversations with people NOT in the car with you are also very distracting, both because you may need to remove a hand from the wheel to hold and/or dial the phone but more importantly the possibility of a discussion that takes your mind off the road - possibly for an extended period of time.

There are studies that prove true this bit of common sense that you want to argue about. You chose not to believe the results for your own inexplicable reasons. I suspect it's simply your daily mind-exercise in futility.

Smiley: deadhorse


Surely you have Bluetooth headset's over there?

Edited, Sep 9th 2009 2:09pm by Goggy
So?


So? so?

So, why do you need to hold your phone then?
I've bolded the part of my post that addresses your confusion. A rate-down would have been so much easier than this response. 'sigh'
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#69 Sep 09 2009 at 6:55 AM Rating: Excellent
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Not to be obvious but if the issue is familiarity with the hardware involved, it should be easier to place a call while driving a simulator than to ***** with the radio/climate controls/etc. Presumably your phone doesn't change when you get a rental car unlike the need to look around for the treble dial.
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