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Cop Shoots Unarmed Man in The BackFollow

#1 Jan 06 2009 at 11:41 PM Rating: Good
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Family Claims BART Victim's Civil Rights Violated

Updated: 8:10 pm PST January 6, 2009
OAKLAND, Calif. -- Family members of a Hayward man, who was shot and killed by a BART police officer early New Year's Day, allege in a $25 million claim Tuesday that officers violated his civil rights, illegally detained him and used excessive force.

The claim, filed by attorney John Burris on behalf of Wanda Johnson, Oscar Grant III's mother, and Sophina Mesa, the mother of Grant's 4-year-old daughter, also names the BART police officer who shot Grant as Johannes Mehserle.

Grant, who worked as a butcher at an Oakland grocery store, "was unarmed and offered no physical resistance to BART police officers" before being shot shortly after 2 a.m. on Jan. 1, according to the claim.

Grant was riding BART back to the East Bay "after a night of celebrating New Year's Eve in San Francisco" when an altercation erupted on his train, prompting BART police to meet the train at the Fruitvale station to quash the fight, the claim states.

Mehserle and other officers, whose names aren't mentioned in the claim, ordered Grant and other passengers to get off the train, according to the claim.

The claim states that Grant complied and stepped off the train, but that an unnamed "Latino officer" grabbed Grant's upper body, threw him against a nearby wall and kneed him in the face.

Grant then dropped to his knees and put his hands up "in an effort to demonstrate that he was submitting to the Latino officer's thuggish display of authority," according to the claim.

But the officer dug his knee into Grant's back, causing Grant to "yell out in agony," the claim states.

Grant feared for his life and "made a valiant effort to de-escalate the situation by appealing to the officer's sense of humanity by telling the officer that he had a 4-year-old daughter" and asking the officer not to use a Taser gun on him, according to the claim.

The claim alleges that Mehserle, who was standing nearby, kneeled down and restrained Grant's hands, then "inexplicably" stood up, drew his firearm and pointed it directly at Grant's back.

The claim states, "Without so much as flinching, Officer Mehserle stood over Mr. Grant and mercilessly fired his weapon, mortally wounding Mr. Grant with a single gunshot sound to the back."

Video footage of the shooting and witness statements indicate that after Grant was shot officers placed him in handcuffs "without any justification," the claim states.

BART spokesman Linton Johnson has not returned calls for comment today.

At a briefing at BART headquarters on Monday, Johnson told reporters that BART officials won't have much to say about the shooting until their investigation is completed, a process he said will take at least several weeks.

"We urge the public to be patient with us," Johnson said Monday. "It's frustrating to us because people are getting upset about what happened, but we owe it to the public, the family (of Grant) and the police officer to get all the facts."

"We want to investigate this quickly but we don't want to have a rush to judgment," he said.

Burris said that if BART rejects the claim, he will file a lawsuit after 45 days.

Burris said he believes Grant was cooperative during the incident and that BART police officers "escalated the situation."

Some police use-of-force experts who have looked at footage of the incident have said that Mehserle may have meant to fire a Taser at Grant but instead mistakenly shot him with a gun.

But Burris said, "I'm not sure if that's true" and pointed out that BART hasn't yet said one way or the other if Mehserle had a Taser during the incident.

Burris said he doesn't think Mehserle had any justification to use even a Taser on Grant.

He said that if Mehserle deliberately shot Grant with a gun, the officer should be prosecuted for second-degree murder.

Burris said if Mehserle had intended to use a Taser and mistakenly fired his gun, the officer should be prosecuted for involuntary manslaughter.

"It's negligence if you pick the wrong weapon," Burris said.

Mehserle is on paid administrative leave while the incident is investigated by BART and the Alameda County District Attorney's office.

District Attorney Tom Orloff, who has the power to file charges against Mehserle if the thinks they are warranted, said the investigation by his office may take several weeks because it will take time to complete the autopsy protocol and toxicology reports.

In addition, his office may need to re-interview witnesses, Orloff said.

A memorial service will be held for Grant at 11 a.m. Wednesday at Palma Ceia Baptist Church, located at 28605 Ruus Road in Hayward.


After watching the video, I do not think there was any malicious intent on the Cops behalf.

However, this in no way excuses the fact that for whatever reason (It's been tossed around in other articles that the cop may have gone for his taser and, I don't know, missed?) a police officer shot & killed (he died 7hours later) an unarmed man.

Ridiculousness.


*Edited cause it wasn't a white officer. He just looked white in the video

Edited, Jan 7th 2009 2:46am by Omegavegeta
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#2 Jan 07 2009 at 12:12 AM Rating: Decent
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#3 Jan 07 2009 at 5:37 AM Rating: Decent
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Boy, this article's author really want to drive home the point that the cop was Latino.
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#4 Jan 07 2009 at 5:47 AM Rating: Excellent
It is CA, so he's probably concerned about starting a race riot.

Especially with Rodney King's lawyer representing the victim's family.
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#5 Jan 07 2009 at 6:09 AM Rating: Excellent
It's pretty clear (to me) from the video that the cop pulled his weapon and aimed for a good 2-3 seconds before firing. He fired his pistol intently, and I don't see any real sense in the "he thought it was a taser!" defense. It's a pretty open and shut case of murder from what I saw. Hell the "victim" wasn't even on his knees when he was shot - he was laying flat on his stomach, completely defenseless. The cop blatantly drew his weapon, stood up, watched the other officer move out of the way and pulled the trigger.

#6 Jan 07 2009 at 6:35 AM Rating: Excellent
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The Great BrownDuck wrote:
It's pretty clear (to me) from the video that the cop pulled his weapon and aimed for a good 2-3 seconds before firing. He fired his pistol intently, and I don't see any real sense in the "he thought it was a taser!" defense. It's a pretty open and shut case of murder from what I saw. Hell the "victim" wasn't even on his knees when he was shot - he was laying flat on his stomach, completely defenseless. The cop blatantly drew his weapon, stood up, watched the other officer move out of the way and pulled the trigger.



Agreed.
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#7 Jan 07 2009 at 7:17 AM Rating: Good
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I wonder if charges will be brought against the other officer for not even trying to stop the shooting. Also I have to agree that if he didn't point out that it was a latino cop that there would have been an Al Sharpton sized racism uproar.
#8 Jan 07 2009 at 7:48 AM Rating: Good
I suppose he "could" have pulled the gun on the victim to enter the classic cop "Freeze!" position, the safety wasn't on, & it went off.

But it's still manslaughter though, just involuntary.

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#9 Jan 07 2009 at 7:53 AM Rating: Excellent
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According to the local news, they've moved the cop several times because of death threats.

This is going to get messy.

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#10 Jan 07 2009 at 7:58 AM Rating: Good
Samira wrote:
According to the local news, they've moved the cop several times because of death threats.

This is going to get messy.


Of course. It happened in Oakland. Smiley: laugh
#11 Jan 07 2009 at 1:29 PM Rating: Good
Omegavegeta wrote:
I suppose he "could" have pulled the gun on the victim to enter the classic cop "Freeze!" position, the safety wasn't on, & it went off.

But it's still manslaughter though, just involuntary.



Bad cop. Keep that booger hooker off the bang switch.
#12 Jan 07 2009 at 2:32 PM Rating: Excellent
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He fired his pistol intently, and I don't see any real sense in the "he thought it was a taser!" defense.


Not that it's ok to shoot someone in the back, but establishing intent from a videotape of a physical struggle is absurd. Having been stabbed, hit with actual genuine lead pipes, shot at, and held at gunpoint, I can testify that applying reason in any particular three second span while in adrenal response isn't as easy as judging someone sitting at home watching a video on your monitor.

It's perfectly plausible the guy made a mistake and accidentally shot him. Not forgivable, obviously, but not at all absurd.
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#13 Jan 07 2009 at 2:35 PM Rating: Good
Smasharoo wrote:

He fired his pistol intently, and I don't see any real sense in the "he thought it was a taser!" defense.


Not that it's ok to shoot someone in the back, but establishing intent from a videotape of a physical struggle is absurd. Having been stabbed, hit with actual genuine lead pipes, shot at, and held at gunpoint, I can testify that applying reason in any particular three second span while in adrenal response isn't as easy as judging someone sitting at home watching a video on your monitor.

It's perfectly plausible the guy made a mistake and accidentally shot him. Not forgivable, obviously, but not at all absurd.


IMO, it's absurd that he drew a weapon after the suspect(?) was already subdued in the first place. The fact that he followed through with the act of shooting merely adds to absurdity.

We're not talking about a blurry video at night, here. In the video, clear as day, you can see the man on the ground on his stomach with another officer's knee in his back before the officer in question ever drew his weapon.
#14 Jan 07 2009 at 2:38 PM Rating: Decent
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We're not talking about a blurry video at night, here. In the video, clear as day, you can see the man on the ground on his stomach with another officer's knee in his back before the officer in question ever drew his weapon.


Sure. Charge him with recklessly drawing his weapon. Saying the executed the guy because three seconds passed between drawing and discharging his weapon just doesn't hold water.

I'm not in any way claiming this was justifiable good police work. I'm simply saying it's not unlikely that a cop who almost certainly has never drawn his weapon on the job prior to this accidentally shot someone. That's all.
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#15 Jan 07 2009 at 2:42 PM Rating: Good
Smasharoo wrote:

We're not talking about a blurry video at night, here. In the video, clear as day, you can see the man on the ground on his stomach with another officer's knee in his back before the officer in question ever drew his weapon.


Sure. Charge him with recklessly drawing his weapon. Saying the executed the guy because three seconds passed between drawing and discharging his weapon just doesn't hold water.


Fair enough. He drew the weapon when he shouldn't have, and it's entirely possible that under stress, he accidentally squeezed the trigger. At the very least it should be charged as manslaughter though, don't you think?


Note: I said charged, not convicted. Obviously he reserves the right to a trial and a proper defense.

Edited, Jan 7th 2009 4:44pm by BrownDuck
#16 Jan 07 2009 at 2:44 PM Rating: Good
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I was just talking to a friend about this. The execution is abhorrant but that is not what we were focused on.

I remember when Rodney King was beaten by LA policemen and the results there. You would have thought the US police force would have learnt a lesson, a hard one. Now? In an age of video recorders in mobile phones, such acts are verging on insane. Trying to cover it up as the police clearly have?

For as horrible as this crime is, it is nice in a perverse way to know that a single phone camera can prevent such crimes going unpunished. I see no way for this local police force to do anything but charge this soon to be former police officer and work very hard at changing their culture and regaining any respect from the local population (and world at large).

BART police? Shame on you for an attempted cover up Smiley: oyvey
#17 Jan 07 2009 at 2:45 PM Rating: Default
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Well, at least he didn't shoot him with a taser.

It's hard to tell from that video, but the guy was clearly not laying calmly on the ground. He was struggling with the cops as they were trying to put handcuffs on him. You can see his legs and body bouncing up and down. From the look on the cop's face, it looks like his gun went off accidentally. He's not holding it in a manner I'd expect if he was preparing to shoot. It was in a "ready" position (held down and at his side from what I could see).

Most likely he didn't realize the safety was off and in the process of the struggle his gun went off. You can't see, but it's entirely possible the suspect kicked it with one of his legs (just guessing given the positions they were in). Still going to be negligent homicide (or whatever the equivalent is) on the part of the officer. He likely didn't need to have drawn his gun in that situation anyway, and certainly should have checked his safety.
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#18 Jan 07 2009 at 2:46 PM Rating: Decent
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Fair enough. He drew the weapon when he shouldn't have, and it's entirely possible that under stress, he accidentally squeezed the trigger. At the very least it should be charged as manslaughter though, don't you think


Sure, whatever the appropriate statue is. Maybe he should be charged with murder. There's evidence other than the video almost certainly.

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#19 Jan 07 2009 at 2:47 PM Rating: Decent
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He likely didn't need to have drawn his gun in that situation anyway


Likely? I'm struggling to think of a situation where you'd need to have your gun drawn when other people are wrestling an unarmed man to the ground.
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#20 Jan 07 2009 at 2:54 PM Rating: Excellent
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Yeah, I'm thinking it was a) negligent but unintended or b) totally stupid panic move. Both are bad. Neither rises to the level of "execution".

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#21 Jan 07 2009 at 3:11 PM Rating: Decent
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Smasharoo wrote:

He likely didn't need to have drawn his gun in that situation anyway


Likely? I'm struggling to think of a situation where you'd need to have your gun drawn when other people are wrestling an unarmed man to the ground.


He was one of those doing the wrestling though. Taking a second longer look. He was searching the guys pockets then the suspect began struggling (flailing his arms and legs and trying to get up). The other officer turned back from the other suspect (who's yammering at them the whole time) to assist him. Then you can see the officer standing up and drawing his weapon. We have no idea why. Our view is blocked by the officer in front of him when the shot goes off.

Without knowing what else was going on there, we can't know what caused him to draw his weapon. I said "likely" because I couldn't see anything specific. I'm leaving open the possibility that there's something the officer saw or heard that we didn't.
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#22 Jan 07 2009 at 3:35 PM Rating: Decent
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gbaji wrote:
Smasharoo wrote:

He likely didn't need to have drawn his gun in that situation anyway


Likely? I'm struggling to think of a situation where you'd need to have your gun drawn when other people are wrestling an unarmed man to the ground.


He was one of those doing the wrestling though. Taking a second longer look. He was searching the guys pockets then the suspect began struggling (flailing his arms and legs and trying to get up). The other officer turned back from the other suspect (who's yammering at them the whole time) to assist him. Then you can see the officer standing up and drawing his weapon. We have no idea why. Our view is blocked by the officer in front of him when the shot goes off.

Without knowing what else was going on there, we can't know what caused him to draw his weapon. I said "likely" because I couldn't see anything specific. I'm leaving open the possibility that there's something the officer saw or heard that we didn't.


Wrestling with a gun in your hand is not a good idea. Specially if you are not intending to have it go off, and are merely trying to use it's presence as a show of force.
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#23 Jan 07 2009 at 3:42 PM Rating: Decent
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TirithRR wrote:
Wrestling with a gun in your hand is not a good idea. Specially if you are not intending to have it go off, and are merely trying to use it's presence as a show of force.


Yeah. He was standing up and backing away as he drew. Hence why I'm going to go with the idea that his safety was off and the gun went off accidentally. Even the theory about it being kicked by the suspect is still viable IMO. Should he have made sure he was completely clear before drawing? Sure. I still see nothing that indicates this was an "execution". He clearly saw or heard something that made him suddenly stand up and back while drawing his gun. I have no clue what that might have been.


Again. The look on the guys face is IMO the strongest evidence that it was an accident. The guys eyes get really round and really big. Even on a crappy phone video, you can see it.
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