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The most incredibly stupid ignorant hateful thing I've read Follow

#227 Nov 06 2008 at 8:47 AM Rating: Good
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Belkira the Tulip wrote:
There is nothing that says that heterosexuality is instinctual. It very well may be, but I can't see a way that one (heterosexuality) would be instinctual while the other (homosexuality) would not be. It makes no sense whatsoever.

It stands to reason that if one is an instinct, the other must be as well. If one is a choice, the other must be as well.
Except that it doesn't stand to reason. Why must there be a duality there at all?

Being flim-flammy on the subject may be obscuring things. Lets look at it logically from both standpoints:

1. Suppose I believe homosexuality must be a choice. It follows that if I believe this, I also believe that homosexuals that believe otherwise are either lying to themselves, or lying to everyone else, about it being an instinct for them. I know that as a heterosexual, there was never a conscious choice involved for me. Therefore, homosexuality=choice (based on what I deem as common sense and natural history) and heterosexuality=instinct (based on personal experience).

2. Suppose I believe homosexuality must be instinct. I then also believe that heterosexuality is an instinct. Simple one.

In either case (and I must say, I'm leaning towards #2, although part of me still wants to believe #1), heterosexuality is an instinct. There is no need for the duality that you're basing on nothing.
#228 Nov 06 2008 at 8:48 AM Rating: Good
Belkira the Tulip wrote:
AshOnMyTomatoes, Guardian of the Glade wrote:
Ok, read what I wrote instead of what you thought I wrote.

Homosexuality: arguably instinctual, arguably a choice. I personally am still up in the air on this one.

Heterosexuality: most certainly instinctual. (At the very least, instinctual for those who are not homosexual.)

Therefore, a homosexual person is either instinctually homosexual, or (again, for me the jury is still out on this) going against instinct. A heterosexual person is just instinctually heterosexual. At no point does a heterosexual person choose to be that way.

So whether you believe homosexuality is a choice or not, heterosexuality isn't a choice, its a natural urge. So you can't say "if homosexuality is a choice, so is heterosexuality."


I can't help but wonder if you're reading what you are typing.

There is nothing that says that heterosexuality is instinctual. It very well may be, but I can't see a way that one (heterosexuality) would be instinctual while the other (homosexuality) would not be. It makes no sense whatsoever.

It stands to reason that if one is an instinct, the other must be as well. If one is a choice, the other must be as well.

Then, of course, there are bi-sexual people who are instinctively (or by choice) attracted to members of both sexes.


The vast preponderance of scientific evidence indicates that humans have an instinctive drive to mate, but that sexual orientation is a feature of fetal brain development. Our instinct drives us to mate, our brains wire up to seek mates of a particular sex.
#229 Nov 06 2008 at 8:50 AM Rating: Excellent
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Okay here's a simple test: ask a goddam homosexual whether they ever had an instinct to be heterosexual.

They feel the same way about their sexuality as you feel about yours, you knucklehead.

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#230 Nov 06 2008 at 8:51 AM Rating: Good
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Samira wrote:
Okay here's a simple test: ask a goddam homosexual whether they ever had an instinct to be heterosexual.

They feel the same way about their sexuality as you feel about yours, you knucklehead.

This isn't about my views, its about the use of "if one's a choice, both of them are a choice" as an argument.
#231 Nov 06 2008 at 8:52 AM Rating: Good
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AshOnMyTomatoes, Guardian of the Glade wrote:
Samira wrote:
Okay here's a simple test: ask a goddam homosexual whether they ever had an instinct to be heterosexual.

They feel the same way about their sexuality as you feel about yours, you knucklehead.

This isn't about my views, its about the use of "if one's a choice, both of them are a choice" as an argument.


But YOU argued the point using your views.

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#232 Nov 06 2008 at 8:53 AM Rating: Good
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Samira wrote:
AshOnMyTomatoes, Guardian of the Glade wrote:
Samira wrote:
Okay here's a simple test: ask a goddam homosexual whether they ever had an instinct to be heterosexual.

They feel the same way about their sexuality as you feel about yours, you knucklehead.

This isn't about my views, its about the use of "if one's a choice, both of them are a choice" as an argument.


But YOU argued the point using your views.

I argued the point using either view.
#233 Nov 06 2008 at 8:53 AM Rating: Good
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It's interesting that you think so.

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#234 Nov 06 2008 at 9:01 AM Rating: Decent
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But YOU argued the point using your views.
No he didn't, but your views made you think he did.

The fact he stated clearly that he thought that homosexuality is instinctual kinda gave that away.

#235 Nov 06 2008 at 9:02 AM Rating: Good
Mindel wrote:
The vast preponderance of scientific evidence indicates that humans have an instinctive drive to mate, but that sexual orientation is a feature of fetal brain development. Our instinct drives us to mate, our brains wire up to seek mates of a particular sex.


And it's funny how that works regardless of sexual orientation.

Thank you, Mindel.

Edited, Nov 6th 2008 11:03am by Belkira
#236 Nov 06 2008 at 9:07 AM Rating: Decent
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"Okay here's a simple test: ask a goddam homosexual whether they ever had an instinct to be heterosexual." --Sammy

Purely anecdotal evidence. If feelings were the standard for scientific proof, th world would still be flat.

Totem
#237 Nov 06 2008 at 9:10 AM Rating: Good
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Totem wrote:
"Okay here's a simple test: ask a goddam homosexual whether they ever had an instinct to be heterosexual." --Sammy

Purely anecdotal evidence. If feelings were the standard for scientific proof, th world would still be flat.

Totem


Scientific proof has nothing to do with people being protected under the law.
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Seriously, what the f*ck nature?
#238 Nov 06 2008 at 9:11 AM Rating: Good
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Commander Annabella wrote:
Totem wrote:
"Okay here's a simple test: ask a goddam homosexual whether they ever had an instinct to be heterosexual." --Sammy

Purely anecdotal evidence. If feelings were the standard for scientific proof, th world would still be flat.

Totem


Scientific proof has nothing to do with people being protected under the law.
I agree with both of these posts.
#239REDACTED, Posted: Nov 06 2008 at 9:14 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Anna, you are correct. And that's why according to California law homosexuals cannot marry same sex partners. But don't let that stop you from marrying another homosexual-- just of a different sex.
#240 Nov 06 2008 at 9:15 AM Rating: Excellent
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Totem wrote:
Anna, you are correct. And that's why according to California law homosexuals cannot marry same sex partners. But don't let that stop you from marrying another homosexual-- just of a different sex.

Equal rights for all people under the law.

Totem


Well, like I said. When men can marry men, your rights will still be equal to theirs under the law.

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#241 Nov 06 2008 at 9:15 AM Rating: Good
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Totem wrote:
Anna, you are correct. And that's why according to California law homosexuals cannot marry same sex partners. But don't let that stop you from marrying another homosexual-- just of a different sex.

Equal rights for all people under the law.

Totem
Now you're just being silly.
#242 Nov 06 2008 at 9:16 AM Rating: Excellent
Totem wrote:
"Okay here's a simple test: ask a goddam homosexual whether they ever had an instinct to be heterosexual." --Sammy

Purely anecdotal evidence. If feelings were the standard for scientific proof, th world would still be flat.

Totem
Which is why we rely on more than two decades of scientific studies of fetal brain development. Smiley: schooled
#243 Nov 06 2008 at 9:18 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
Anna, you are correct. And that's why according to California law homosexuals cannot marry same sex partners. But don't let that stop you from marrying another homosexual-- just of a different sex.


Totem

You are not a stupid man, and you are not gbaji. Please stop

<3

Pensive
#244 Nov 06 2008 at 9:19 AM Rating: Default
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By-the-by, Anna, abortion is based on scientific evidence-- or rather the specific lack of it's ability to determine when precisely a fetus is a viable human being --to allow women to terminate a pregnancy. That a fetus is human is not in dispute, but that hasn't stopped the law from permitting the arbitrary and capricious death of young humans.

Totem
#245 Nov 06 2008 at 9:19 AM Rating: Excellent
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Totem wrote:
"Okay here's a simple test: ask a goddam homosexual whether they ever had an instinct to be heterosexual." --Sammy

Purely anecdotal evidence. If feelings were the standard for scientific proof, th world would still be flat.


In this case, the scientists agree. There is not a credible or reputable scientist anywhere who will claim that homosexuality is not something one is born with just as with heterosexuality is inborn, nor is there one who claims that it can be changed. The ones who do make those claims are laughingstocks and quacks.



#246 Nov 06 2008 at 9:22 AM Rating: Default
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Wow, I think you'd have a difficult time finding a larger brush with which to paint, Amb. Home Depot sure don't sell 'em any bigger...

Totem
#247 Nov 06 2008 at 9:24 AM Rating: Excellent
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Perhaps she can borrow one of yours, Totes.

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#248 Nov 06 2008 at 9:24 AM Rating: Default
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Behavioral science is hardly an exact study. Saying that any scientists who have come to any conclusion that disagrees with your beliefs labels them a quack is quite the stretch! My, my!

Totem
#249 Nov 06 2008 at 9:24 AM Rating: Excellent
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I opened quite a can of worms here, but the point remains: choice or instinct, there's no reason to deny someone their right to happiness.
#250 Nov 06 2008 at 9:27 AM Rating: Good
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Also, what's so wrong about having the right to marry a vacuum cleaner? We'd be setting a new standard for Inanimate-Object Rights, and it would set precedent for the future Robot Civil Rights Movement that I'm sure is on the horizon.

Edited, Nov 6th 2008 11:27am by AshOnMyTomatoes
#251 Nov 06 2008 at 9:28 AM Rating: Default
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Sure, but that's because I am an artiste' largesse, Sammy. My work is done primarily in broad strokes, literally and figuratively. No one expects Van Gogh to produce a detailed work and neither should they expect such from me! My medium is the written word and the computer is the canvas upon which I type, "Starry Night.."

:D

Totem
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