Part of the problem is the assignment. Our points are supposed "zingers" as the professor calls them. Short and to the point. But, to actually have a debate about the issues will require in depth description because at face value the policies of both candidates sound great so I need to retool these to fit more info into them.
1. As a senator in Illinois, Obama voted against harsher penalties for child molesters saying "Everyone makes mistakes."
At the time this bill was proposed, Illinois was 5th in the nation for sex crimes against children. Many criminologists blamed the lack of harsh penalties. There was one other person who voted against this and he had a relative arrested soon after for sex crimes. I don't know if that had an effect on his vote but it was a small scandal.
2.Obama's image of growing up in a single parent house is lie. His mom remarried when he was 5 to a wealthy oil man and they were together until Obama was 29. When he was 10 he moved in with his grandparents until he finsihed high school.
Quote:
Obama’s image is very subjective, and I may have a different image of him than you or anyone else. This is assuming too much about your audience.
Fair point but we over heard the other side talking about this in class so we know they might use it.
3.Obama has a track record of not being able to make decisions. He has the highest percentage of "present" votes in Illinois, mostly on controversial issues.
Quote:
This shows care and forethought and a reluctance to get in over his head in debates that might be extremely complex.
So is that saying that he found the issues extremely complex more often than any other senator in Illinois.
Quote:
We've discussed it before, but the "present" votes are a specific tactic used in Illinois Congress.
I've heard about this but didn't really understand it. Still its seems odd that he would have the highest percentage.
Quote:
The way they tack so many different items onto items to bills... so a present vote is used to indicate you cannot vote either way for some reason.
That's fair I'll have to come up with a way to counter that. I know on at least one bill he was the only present vote everyone else voted for it. Something about sex offenders not getting off early.
4.Obama gave $832,000 of his campaing money to Acorn. He lied to the FEC claiming the money was for staging, lighting, and sound.
Quote:
Are you actually making the claim that Obama’s campaign knowingly donated to Acorn to commit voter registration fraud?
No, but I'm trying to imply it. This is an appeal to pathos not logos. Also why did he lie to the FEC. When caught, he later said the it was "[to] get out the vote." Why not say that to begin with. Also I don't really put much credence into the voter fraud thing. The employees get paid on a quota system so they fill out fake registrations. No Acorn employee has been charged with voter fraud just registration fraud.
5.Obama received more money from Fannie and Freddie than any other senator save Chris Dodd and blocked legislation designed to monitor them for abuse.
Quote:
Should Obama have given the money back? If so, on what grounds? What does it mean that he “blocked†legislation? You make it sound like a hockey game, did he just vote against it or did he try to filibuster? Again, what else was in that bill, is it possible he wasn’t actually voting on that specific issue? Any vote in the legislative branch must be carefully examined before judgments are made. Unless you have actually read the bill in question you should not be forming an opinion about it.
All good points, but again this one is an appeal to pathos. There was no filibuster just a vote against but the democrats have the majority so there wouldn't need to be a filibuster. I don't know the exact wording of the bill so I will have to check into that to see what else was in it.
6.Obama has voted with Nancy Palosi 100% of the time.
This one is true. Nancy Palosi has one of the lowest approval ratings of all times and Obama has always agreed with her. On some polls her numbers are worse than Bush's. It's meant to counter the McCain votes with Bush thing. Since Bush doesn't actually get a vote I can only assume that means that 85% of the time McCain agrees with the white house stance which is always the party line. So 85%
of the time McCain votes with his party and Obama votes 100% of the time with his party.
7.Obama had to side step the question "Other than being the democratic presidential candidate, what is the greatest accomplishment of your career?"
This one is a lie but I'm trying to make the point that he hasn't done anything outstanding in his career. He hasn't spearhead any legislation. He always makes the safe vote. His only demonstrated skill is his ability to talk well. I'm not saying he doesn't have any other skills just that I've never seen them.
8.Obama's tax plan is really welfare. Since the tax cuts are "refundable" those who don't pay taxes are still eligible for 6 out of 7 tax cuts.
Quote:
This is a blatant misrepresentation of what welfare really is. A tax cut is not welfare. Welfare is something completely different.
Its a blatant misrepresentation of what a tax cut really is.
If I owe $1.00 in taxes and have a $500 tax cut then I owe nothing and were done
If I owe $1.00 in taxes and have a $500 "refundable" tax cut I owe nothing and the government sends me a check for $499.
When the government gives you money for not doing anything I call that welfare. As long as you work ONE HOUR A YEAR you will qualify for 6 out of 7 "refundable" tax cuts. Also the refunds are scaled so a person who works one hour will receive more money from the government than those who are regularly employed even at minimum wage jobs.
9.The bottom 60% of income earners pay less than 1% of the net federal income yet would receive 100% of the benefit from Obama's plans.
Yeah I probably won't use this one.
10. Obama's plan actually discourage the bettering of one's self. If you make between $40,000-$42,000 and than get a raise of another job you will receive less net income since the tax cuts don't scale accurately. Until you hit $47,000 you will have less net income than before.
Quote:
You are not clear in your facts about how large the raise of another job is, but I happen to make around that much a year and have looked up my tax cut under Obama’s plan and it is around $1500 that I would save.
Its a technical loophole that would probably be fixed before enacted. For simplicity lets say I make $10 I pay $6 in taxes and get back $3. My net would end up being $7 and my taxes were lowered. Now lets say I make $12 pay $9 in taxes and because I'm still in the same bracket would still only get back $3 so my net was $6. It's the same thing at the $40,000-$42,000 range. Past $42,000 until you make $47,000 you will actually have a net lower income.
11.Since businesses will now have to pay for health care and likely higher minimum wage, prices will go up or they will have to fire employees.
12.Obama says he will lower the taxes on 9 out of 10 small businesses but the top 15% of businesses employ 85% of the small business jobs. This is the group he is raising taxes on. So either prices will go up or people get fired.
The problem is the company's getting assistance to pay for health care aren't the ones giving the majority of the health care. What if your job is one of the ones laid off to pay for the health care of others.
Quote:
If the corporations want cheap taxes, let them go to Ireland.
The problem is they will. They are going to do their best to keep there the profit margins the same. So if its cheaper to produce in another country and ship it here they will. The end result is we lose jobs. We are getting something in return for the job loss but most of his plans will result in job loss so how does he intend to counter that.
13.Though Obama promises to lower taxes he has voted against it 4 out the 5 times he has voted on it in his career.
14.Under Obama's plan 44% of America will have no tax liability.
Probably won't use these points