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#102 Oct 07 2008 at 1:24 PM Rating: Default
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Samira wrote:


Lol. And he was a member of the Boy Scouts, and there were some other Boy Scout troops in the country where the kids were molested, so McCain is a child molestor!!!


You weren't serious with this were, you?
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#103 Oct 07 2008 at 1:25 PM Rating: Excellent
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NPR has a pretty sane run-down of the "scandal", including mentions that Annenberg himself (funder of Ayers' "omg so radical!" board) was a Republican and quotes from Republicans previously in the state legislature essentially laughing off the claims that Ayers is some feared power-monger in Chicago politics.

Not that they'd know more about Chicago politics than Gbaji, of course.
NPR wrote:
Walter Annenberg, a lifelong Republican and former ambassador who was appointed by Presidents Nixon and Reagan, funded an ambitious program to reform urban education in many cities in the mid 1990s. Ayers was an important member of the group that developed and wrote the grant proposal to the Annenberg Foundation.
[...]
Later in 1995, Ayers hosted a "getting to know you" gathering at his house as Obama was preparing for his first campaign, a run for the Illinois Senate. The incumbent state senator, Alice Palmer, had announced she would run for Congress.

To help Obama in the Democratic primary race to succeed her, Palmer organized a few informal meetings to introduce Obama to her supporters in the fall of 1995, including the gathering at Ayers' house. It was not a fundraiser, as some reports have stated. And it was not the meeting that launched Obama's political career, as other Obama critics have alleged.
[...]
"It was never a concern by any of us in the Chicago school reform movement that he had led a fugitive life years earlier," said former Illinois state Republican Rep. Diana Nelson, who worked with both Obama and Ayers over the years. "It's ridiculous. There is no reason at all to smear Barack Obama with this association. It's nonsensical, and it just makes me crazy. It's so silly."

Nelson says her fellow Republicans "might snort when they hear the name Bill Ayers, because they know he comes from a wealthy family, they know he became a radical activist early in his life ... but beyond just snorting, I don't think anyone gives it another thought."


Edited, Oct 7th 2008 4:26pm by Jophiel
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Belkira wrote:
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#104 Oct 07 2008 at 1:42 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
Samira wrote:


Lol. And he was a member of the Boy Scouts, and there were some other Boy Scout troops in the country where the kids were molested, so McCain is a child molestor!!!


You weren't serious with this were, you?


It is exactly as valid as holding Obama accountable for the political activities of an acquaintance dating from when Obama himself was in kindergarten.

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#105 Oct 07 2008 at 1:48 PM Rating: Decent
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Jophiel wrote:
gbaji wrote:
He worked his way up politically by working in funded programs Ayers was involved in.
No, he didn't. Seriously. No, he didn't.

And you still haven't given a source for dating the meet & greet.


The source I linked says that he joined was on the board for the Anneberg Challenge in "early 1995". The date for the party at Ayers home was "in the fall of 1995". Since that's when people generally kick off their political campaigns, that seems like a reasonable date, right? If we assume "early" in a year is in the first quarter, that places it over 6 months prior to the party. If we take a broader view of "early" and only take it to mean "in the first half of the year", we're still looking at a minimum of 3-4 months (assuming "fall" means Sep/Oct timeframe).

So. Assuming those statements are correct (and while I do question some of the conclusions or relevances in the page, I don't see any reason to question the actual facts contained within), then we're looking at anywhere from 3-4 months up to 10 months between when Obama joined the board of Annenberg Challenge and when he attended the party at Ayers' home.


Were you unable to noodle this out on your own?


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#106 Oct 07 2008 at 1:51 PM Rating: Decent
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Samira wrote:
It is exactly as valid as holding Obama accountable for the political activities of an acquaintance dating from when Obama himself was in kindergarten.


The background on Ayers is colorful, but not the issue.

Obama was no in kindergarten when he was on the boards of those two groups. And Ayers was still just as radical. He just shifted tactics.

The point isn't to say that Obama's a mad bomber.
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#107 Oct 07 2008 at 1:58 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
Obama's a mad bomber.
You should write out of context scripts for Sarah
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#108 Oct 07 2008 at 6:25 PM Rating: Decent
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Nobby wrote:
gbaji wrote:
Obama's a mad bomber.
You should write out of context scripts for Sarah


Sure. But that seems to be the strawman that everyone lumps onto this. When someone argues that Obama's connection to Ayers doesn't matter since Obama was a child when Ayers did his bombing, they are arguing against the idea that Obama somehow supports the bombing that Ayers did.

No one is saying that. No one has said that. The reference to Ayers past is purely historical. It's designed to make it clear to people just how radical Ayers is, not specifically to try to connect Obama to the bombings. That's just silly...
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#109 Oct 07 2008 at 7:35 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
When someone argues that Obama's connection to Ayers doesn't matter since Obama was a child when Ayers did his bombing, they are arguing against the idea that Obama somehow supports the bombing that Ayers did.

No one is saying that. No one has said that.
Sure. When Palin makes a point of saying "Pals around with terrorists!", she's no doubt alluding to shared philosophies of education between the two men.

Grow up, Gbaji. You know damn well that Camp McCain is trying to tie Obama not to a guy who has some leftist philosophies on education but to a guy who placed a bomb in the Pentagon. No one is calling Ayers a "terrorist" because of the Woods Foundation or the Annenberg Challenge. They're calling him a terrorist explictly because of Ayers' actiosn in the 1960s and you're a fool if you think McCain's campaign isn't trying to tie Obama to that perception of Ayers.
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
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