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#1 Aug 05 2008 at 4:59 PM Rating: Good
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AP wrote:

FBI used aggressive tactics in anthrax probe
By PETE YOST, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON - Before killing himself last week, Army scientist Bruce Ivins told friends that government agents had stalked him and his family for months, offered his son $2.5 million to rat him out and tried to turn his hospitalized daughter against him with photographs of dead anthrax victims.

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The pressure on Ivins was extreme, a high-risk strategy that has failed the FBI before. The government was determined to find the villain in the 2001 anthrax attacks; it was too many years without a solution to the case that shocked and terrified a post-9/11 nation.

The last thing the FBI needed was another embarrassment. Overreaching damaged the FBI's reputation in the high-profile investigations: the Centennial Olympic Park bombing probe that falsely accused Richard Jewell; the theft of nuclear secrets and botched prosecution of scientist Wen Ho Lee; and, in this same anthrax probe, the smearing of an innocent man — Ivins' colleague Steven Hatfill.

In the current case, Ivins complained privately that FBI agents had offered his son, Andy, $2.5 million, plus "the sports car of his choice" late last year if he would turn over evidence implicating his father in the anthrax attacks, according to a former U.S. scientist who described himself as a friend of Ivins.

Ivins also said the FBI confronted Ivins' daughter, Amanda, with photographs of victims of the anthrax attacks and told her, "This is what your father did," according to the scientist, who spoke only on condition of anonymity because their conversation was confidential.

The scientist said Ivins was angered by the FBI's alleged actions, which he said included following Ivins' family on shopping trips.

Washington attorney Barry Coburn, who represents Amanda Ivins, declined to comment on the investigation. An attorney for Andy Ivins also declined to comment.

The FBI declined to describe its investigative techniques of Ivins.

FBI official John Miller said that "what we have seen over the past few days has been a mix of improper disclosures of partial information mixed with inaccurate information and then drawn into unfounded conclusions. None of that serves the victims, their families or the public."

The FBI "always moves aggressively to get to the bottom of the facts, but that does not include mistreatment of anybody and I don't know of any case where that's happened," said former FBI deputy director Weldon Kennedy, who was with the bureau for 34 years. "That doesn't mean that from time to time people don't make mistakes," he added.

Dr. W. Russell Byrne, a friend and former supervisor of Ivins at the U.S. Army Medical Research Institute of Infectious Diseases at Fort Detrick, Md., said he had heard from other Ivins associates that investigators were going after Ivins' daughter. But Byrne said those conversations were always short because people were afraid to talk.

"The FBI had asked everybody to sign these nondisclosure things," Byrne said. "They didn't want to run afoul of the FBI."

Byrne, who retired from the lab four years ago, said FBI agents interviewed him seven to 12 times since the investigation began — and he got off easy.

"I think I'm the only person at USAMRIID who didn't get polygraphed," he said.

Byrne said he was told by people who had recently worked with Ivins that the investigation had taken an emotional toll on the researcher. "One person said he'd sit at his desk and weep," he said.

Questions about the FBI's conduct come as the government takes steps that could signal an end to its investigation. On Wednesday, FBI officials plan to begin briefing family members of victims in the 2001 attacks.

The government is expected to declare the case solved but will keep it open for now, according to two U.S. officials who spoke on condition of anonymity because of the ongoing investigation. Several legal and investigatory matters need to be wrapped up before the case can officially be closed, they said.

Some questions may be answered when documents related to the case are released, as soon as Wednesday. For others, the answers may be incomplete, even bizarre. Some may simply never be answered.

It is unclear how the FBI eliminated as suspects others in the lab who had access to the anthrax. It's not clear what, if any, evidence bolsters the theory that the attacks may have been a twisted effort to test a cure for the toxin. Investigators also can't place Ivins in Princeton, N.J., when the letters were mailed from a mailbox there.

Richard Schuler, attorney for anthrax victim Robert Stevens' widow, Maureen Stevens, said his client will attend Wednesday's FBI briefing with a list of questions.

"No. 1 is, 'Did Bruce Ivins mail the anthrax that killed Robert Stevens?'" Schuler said, adding, "I've got healthy skepticism."

Critics of the bureau in and out of government say that in major cases, like the anthrax investigation, it can be difficult for the bureau to stop once it embarks on a single-minded pursuit of a suspect, with any internal dissenters shut out as disloyal subordinates.

Before the FBI focused on Ivins, its sights were set on Hatfill, whose career as a bioscientist was ruined after then-Attorney General John Ashcroft named him a "person of interest" in the probe.

Hatfill sued the agency, which recently agreed to pay Hatfill nearly $6 million to settle the lawsuit.

Complaints that the FBI behaved too aggressively conflict with its straight-laced, crime-fighting image of starched agents hunting terrorists.

During its focus on Hatfill, the FBI conducted what became known as "bumper lock surveillance," in which investigators trailed Hatfill so closely that he accused agents of running over his foot with their surveillance vehicle.

FBI agents showed up once to videotape Hatfill in a hotel hallway in Tyson's Corner, Va., when Hatfill was meeting with a prospective employer, according to FBI depositions filed in Hatfill's lawsuit against the government. He didn't get the job.

One of the FBI agents who helped run the anthrax investigation, Robert Roth, said FBI Director Robert Mueller had expressed frustration with the pace of the investigation. He also acknowledged that, under FBI guidelines, targets of surveillance aren't supposed to know they're being followed.

"Generally, it's supposed to be covert," Roth told lawyers in Hatfill's lawsuit.

In the 1996 Atlanta Olympic park bombing that dragged Jewell into the limelight, the security guard became the focus of the FBI probe for three months, after initially being hailed as a hero for moving people away from the bomb before it exploded.

The bomber turned out to be anti-government extremist Eric Rudolph, who also planted three other bombs in the Atlanta area and in Birmingham, Ala. Those explosives killed a police officer, maimed a nurse and injured several other people.

In another case, the FBI used as evidence the secrets that a person tells a therapist.

In the Wen Ho Lee case, Lee became the focus of a federal probe into how China may have obtained classified nuclear warhead blueprints. Prosecutors eventually charged him only with mishandling nuclear data, and held him for nine months. In what amounted to a collapse of the government's case, prosecutors agreed to a plea bargain in which Lee pleaded guilty to one of 59 counts.

In 2004, the FBI wrongly arrested lawyer Brandon Mayfield after the Madrid terrorist bombings, due to a misidentified fingerprint. The Justice Department's internal watchdog faulted the bureau for sloppy work. Spanish authorities had doubted the validity of the fingerprint match, but the U.S. government initiated a lengthy investigation, eventually settling with Mayfield for $2 million.


I would have to say I am still skeptical about whether this guy was one who mailed the anthrax. I am also uncomfortable with the aggressive tactics used in the investigation as tactics like these could pressure innocent people to acting irrationally.

Was Bruce Irvins the anthrax mailer?
Yes:6 (31.6%)
No:3 (15.8%)
Undecided:10 (52.6%)
Total:19
#2 Aug 05 2008 at 5:04 PM Rating: Decent
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Was Bruce Irvins the anthrax mailer?


Probably never be established. You don't have in absentia trials for dead people. The case is seemingly pretty light on evidence though, and the handling of a clearly mentally unbalanced guy wasn't done very well. That's just the justice system in this country, though. His case isn't anything approaching unique.

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#3 Aug 05 2008 at 5:07 PM Rating: Excellent
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Ya know, I'm not saying that my dad was the anthrax mailer. I'm just saying that for $2.5mil, I could help the FBI put a close to this investigation.
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#4 Aug 05 2008 at 5:14 PM Rating: Decent
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*My* father was the anthrax killer. But he died two years ago, so he won't mind my betrayal.

*cha-ching!*
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#5 Aug 05 2008 at 11:45 PM Rating: Good
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No, no, *MY Dad* was the anthrax mailer!
#6REDACTED, Posted: Aug 06 2008 at 6:02 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) you small thinkers.
#7 Aug 06 2008 at 6:16 AM Rating: Excellent
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shadowrelm wrote:
the public wants blood.
99% of the country probably needed to be reminded that there was an anthrax mail scare in 2001.
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#8 Aug 06 2008 at 6:28 AM Rating: Decent

How hard would it be to figure out where the strain of Antrax came from? I'm clearly no expert on biological weapons manufacturing, but it seems to me that someone isn't exactly cooking this **** in their kitchen. If they traced it to his facility, I mean, it wouldn't be hard to figure out who it was. I doubt a janitor would have access to the Anthrax.


#9 Aug 06 2008 at 6:28 AM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
you small thinkers.


Yeah, it's a real pity we lack your vision.

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#10 Aug 06 2008 at 6:29 AM Rating: Excellent
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NaughtyWord wrote:

How hard would it be to figure out where the strain of Antrax came from? I'm clearly no expert on biological weapons manufacturing, but it seems to me that someone isn't exactly cooking this sh*t in their kitchen. If they traced it to his facility, I mean, it wouldn't be hard to figure out who it was. I doubt a janitor would have access to the Anthrax.




One of the complicating factors there is that the anthrax was sent TO his lab for testing before anyone there was suspected.

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#11 Aug 06 2008 at 7:22 AM Rating: Default
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Quote:
I would have to say I am still skeptical about whether this guy was one who mailed the anthrax.


You should be because it was clearly ("may" have been) Iraq (Saddam), according to McCain in the run up to the war:

YouTube Video at the 1:00 min mark

Quote:
99% of the country probably needed to be reminded that there was an anthrax mail scare in 2001.


Aye, and that's why most people believe there hasn't been another terrorist attack since 9/11.

Edited, Aug 6th 2008 11:21am by Addikeys
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#12 Aug 07 2008 at 4:30 PM Rating: Good
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http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/news/articles/2008/08/07/20080807AnthraxWarning0807.html

'More than a year before the anthrax attacks that killed five people in 2001, Bruce E. Ivins told a counselor that he was interested in a young woman who lived out of town and that he had "mixed poison" and taken it with him when he went to watch her in a soccer match.

"If she lost, he was going to poison her," said the counselor, who treated Ivins at a Frederick, Md., clinic four or five times during summer 2000. She said Ivins emphasized that he was a skillful scientist who "knew how to do things without people finding out."'


Very scary stuff. Who knows though, the FBI's tactics are questionable.




#13 Aug 07 2008 at 4:33 PM Rating: Decent
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"If she lost, he was going to poison her," said the counselor,


Research the "counselor" in question.

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To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.

#14REDACTED, Posted: Aug 08 2008 at 10:49 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) well, the counsler first invoked patient/doctor confidientality. but after a little "legal" questioning, some waterboarding, a few weeks tied up by his/her wrists in a 50 degree cell naked, eating animal *****, you know, the "legal" kind of questioning, he/she finally addmitted he was a psycopathic scocialpath hell bent on poisioning the world.
#15 Aug 08 2008 at 10:55 AM Rating: Excellent
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Sounds kinda like the opposite, actually. She was apparently really ready to be guided by the FBI in terms of filing a request for a restraining order, etc. Also she appears to be a social worker, not a psychologist or psychiatrist.

No qualified, ethical counselor would go around using the terminology she used. Something really stinks.

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#16REDACTED, Posted: Aug 08 2008 at 11:08 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) agree. sounds kind a like the "experts" who defected from iraq selling americans a nuclear threat.
#17 Aug 08 2008 at 11:11 AM Rating: Decent
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Also she appears to be a social worker, not a psychologist or psychiatrist.


Specializing in drug addiction group therapy. With multiple DUI convictions. Who was on probation. Exactly who you'd want working with a guy you suspect may be a delusional killer.

I mean the screwed up social worker who drives drunk, par for the course in that profession. That you'd have her be the case worker for a PhD Biochemical Weapons expert you suspect of trying to kill people, perhaps not so much.

____________________________
Disclaimer:

To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.

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