Iraqi PM Maliki calls Obama's timetable "the right timeframeFollow

See? We won the war in 2003!

Toldja so.

Wow, I just found this thread, and just thought I would stick my 2 cents in.

I'm in the Army. I've been in 10 years now. I am a 19K30, for those of you who don't know Army MOS lingo, that means I am an M1A2 Abrams Tank commander. In 2003, I deployed with 3rd ACR to Iraq, we were in the western province, based out of Al Asad. I served a year on the Syrian border in a small town called Husaybah. In that year, I lost many good friends, 2 very close to me. After that year, I got to spend 11 months back in Colorado before being deployed to Iraq again, another year on the Syrian Border, but up north near Turkey. That year I lost 4 close friends, on top of just the aquaintances. So, I spent early April 2003-late March 2004, and then early March 2005-Feb 2006 over there.

In that two years, I saw it over and over, in the day, people would cheer us on. But at night, they would shoot at us. During the day, they would take our money for goods/services. At night, they would buy RPGs, AK-47s, bullets, IEDs, any weapons they could, and use them to try and kill us. Most of the time, we got them first, and identified them as who they were. I was there during the elections in Dec 2005, helped set up a lot of voting booths and such in Tal Afar. I've trained the IP (Iraqi Police), the IA (Iraqi Army), and the Border Patrol Guards. I've pretty much done it all over there.

I have since been relocated to Walter Reed. As most of you probably remember, last Feb when the Washington Post ran the stories saying wounded troops weren't receiving the best care, being mistreated, etc. Well, I got hand-picked to come out and 'fix it', along with nearly 130 other professional soldiers. Been here since April 2007 now. Have worked everyday with the likes of amptutees, PTSD, TBI, etc. victims. I have seen both sides of this war, caused some of the killing (reveled in it, actually), lost people close, and seen the direct after-effects of what happens when **** goes wrong. This is all just a little background history of an old dog-faced soldier.

Now, I'm probably gonna get rated down and sub-defaulted from hell for stating this, but personally, I have to agree with gbaji. I want nothing more than to stay in Iraq until it is FULLY able to support and defend itself without our help. I know that they aren't able to do that yet, and definitely don't see it happening within the next 10 years. Personally, I think Iraq should become like Western Germany was after WWII, with a PERMANENT set amount of troops there. I like being there, it is my job, and I like doing my job. And this may sound a little selfish, but I want us to stay in Iraq until we are truly ready to leave, not when the politicians or people WANT us to, but when we are READY to. Plus, for me, it's a bit of job security, haha. But, even though the American people may want all the soldiers out of there, and all the politicians want to pull us out for the good PR, doesn't mean we should if WE aren't finished. Yes, its been costly, both in $$$ and in lost American lives. but, as a proffessional soldier, I know we aren't finished. And to pull out before completion would be like wasting the lives of all those I knew that died over there, and basically a slap in the faces of the widows I still see and talk with and am friends with back here in the States.

So please, I know this was a long diatribe, but please, let us finish our job. I don't care if the war is unjust, I don't care if we went there for the wrong reasons, I don't care if there never were any WMD (that any of YOU saw...), all I care about is that we are there now, and I still have a job to do. I need to avenge my lost friends, and for their families. Personally, I will vote for McCain, not because all soldiers are Republican Conservatives, because I'm definitely not a stereotypical soldier. But because he will let me stay there, and deploy as many more times as it takes, to get the job done RIGHT. I didn't start this as a 'VOTE FOR MCCAIN' endorsement, so please don't take it as such. I just read through everything you guys had posted, and wondered to myself if any of you knew a real soldiers point of view on the whole thing. So, rate up, rate down, either way, I don;t care. Like I said, just putting in my 2 cents...

Fine Joph.

How about you do the same. What's your metric for success in Iraq?

Or. Just to cut to the chase: What's the criteria for withdrawing troops from Iraq. When do we remove them and why?

Cause it seems like you have no conditions for winning in Iraq, but very very low conditions for withdrawing troops. Like, say if some folks in Washington tell you we're losing and can't win... Even when they're dead wrong.

And isn't that what this is about? Do you think of withdrawing the troops as the goal, or something you do after you've achieved the goal? Obama clearly thinks it's the former, and that pretty much disqualifies him for the job of commander in chief.

RACK MikeSeyton. You're not the only soldier that I've heard who has that opinion. Indeed, it reflects much of what we felt back in '91 when GW1 was "finished" for the first time. And true to form, Saddam caused all this by not adhering to the conditions of the surrender in the first place-- not that anybody cares about that around here.

Regardless the cynicism of the Smasharoos of the world, the military knows how to get it done. And if the conditions change, we have proven we can adapt and overcome, ala the Marine Corps motto. Given the opportunity US troopers will complete their task with a minimum of casualties and collateral damage and in a minimum of time, every time. It has been the interference of the politicians both in Congress and the White House who have prevented us from doing what we do best: Go in, kill things and break stuff, thus forcing the enemy to capitulate.

And if you haven't been thanked for your service today, consider this to be a heartfelt appreciation for the price you and your comrades-in-arms paid for those of us who remained on the sidelines. And I don't give a rat's a$$ if this sounds jingoistic or rah-rah-sis-boom, I know the human cost of being an American military man and I respect anyone who steps up and pays it. RACK you.

Totem

Edited, Jul 23rd 2008 3:17am by Totem

In the same token I've been there (spear-headed OIF and participated in OSW prior to that twice) three times and have lost 2 corpsmen friends that loathed the war but wasn't about to shame themselves by getting kicked out of the military but felt as I do. This war, and those that have served in it, and those that have died, all caused to make a few politicians and their friends very f*cking rich, and continue to do so off our backs. This war wasn't about freedom, WMD, or violation of a treaty, it was about money. That's all it's ever been about. I've never seen any evidence to convince me, or other liberals in the military, otherwise.

In short, we (as a nation) should not be sending our sons to fight a war that Iraqi boys should be fighting for themselves. Democracy is not a shell you can shove in a missile. Freedom, and democracy, are virtues earned by those who fight for it.

Regardless the cynicism of the Smasharoos of the world, the military knows how to get it done.

Uh-huh. If only NCOs ran the world, everything would be so much better, because it's never a complicated geo-political situation, it's always just a simple matter of will and determination.

How can you ever win in Iraq? If someone attacked the US and kept troops on your soil, how long would it take before you accepted it and stopped fighting back? Not you as an individual, but you as in Americans as a group. Think what you want, but Americans are no more patriotic than most other countries around the world and the middle east is not an exception by any means.

Seyton's saying the same thing 90% of all military i've spoken with say.

You speak with other people who aren't huge pussies who talk about how great war is, but are too cowardly to do anything about it?

Hard to believe.

Man, it's so nice to have that shoe on the other foot.

Playing tit-for-tat?

I'd rather a website revision than someone whose main campaign platofrm is Iraq saying "It's just history!" when it's anything but. Between this and the Iraq/Pakistani border and the Al'Qaeda which he insisted repeatedly are being trained by Iran... well... heh.

Yeah. Websites.