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Well, in all fairness McCain's got bigger heuvos than me. He choose to remain on target even though he saw SAMs heading for him just so that he could launch his ordinance. He elected to risk his own life rather than require his fellow aviators to come back again to take another shot at it. I'm not sure that I could have done it. The guy is a stud and then he proved it all over again for the next many years by not breaking at the hands of his captors. if that's not the definition of a hero, then I don't know is.

Throwing mud on what was an extraordinarily valorous decision is just plain wrong.

Totem

You don't become a Naval aviator without having intelligence, even under wartime personnel staffing requirements.

He refused the preferencial treatment of no beatings, better food, medical care, and even being released by the North Vietnamese unless his fellow PoWs would get the very same treatment. In return for his refusal to cooperate, he was mistreated far worse than other Hanoi Hilton captives.

Yeah, he might have not applied himself at school, broken rules, and generally been an a$$ as a kid, but when the chips were down the man is exactly the guy you want to have your back. No question about it. None at all.

Let me put it this way-- if he ran as a Democrat, I'd vote for him just because of his character. McCain is nails.

Totem

No, you wouldn't. You'd listen to the Swiftboat Veterans whose only reason for being is to tear him down by any means possible. The only reason you're not paying attention to them now is that he's a Republican.

You don't become a Naval aviator without having intelligence, even under wartime personnel staffing requirements.

Unless your father and grandfather are Admirals.

The guy barely made it through the Academy. I mean *barely*. If he hadn't been connected he would have failed.

There is absolutely zero chance he'd have been flying jets if not for his father.

Getting shot down in Vietnam made Jet number 5 he'd lost. They guy was an *awful* pilot. Don't get me wrong, I'm not claiming he's functionally retarded or anything, but lets just say ONI or NASA were never an option for old Punk.

Really? Those aren't qualities you'd like to see in your leader's personality

Bad at calculating risk and stubborn to the point of self destructive behavior? No, I can't imagine those are things anyone wants in a leader.

I'd probably have supported him while he was in office had he not engaged in the behavior he did.

No kidding, I was shocked when I heard he signed Welfare Reform, too.


Integrity and honor is more valuable than any other trait in my opinion.

So, just to be clear, it doesn't bother you that McCain tries to **** every blond woman he meets?

Which behavior is that? The behavior that was smeared all over the news six years into his presidency? So you supported him for six years?

Look, it's okay. You're a dyed-in-the-wool Pubbie, such that you support Bush, who isn't a conservative, and McCain, who's ancient and kinda dumb. There are worse things.

You can't argue with the process he went through that proves it.

Getting shot down? Or the fairy tale that he refused to return home without his comrades, because that one's going to blow up badly sometime in October. Bank on it.

Just how long was McCain in Vietnam?

Certainly the blue dress issue is part of that, Sammy, but it began long before he reached that stage of his career. Travel-gate, FBI-gate--all those sordid, petty things he did even though it was beneath the dignity of the office to engage in them. You aren't trying to tell me Clinton is as pure as the driven snow, are you?

Again, policy is almost an afterthought for me in terms of who a politician is. Lockboxes, ironclad lockboxes, universal healthcare, whatever. Personal integity is what matters to me.

And that actually is what appeals to me about Obama. While he has shown incredible naivite' or stupity concerning people like Rezko, and Wright, he, to all appearances is deeply in love with his wife and is a good father.

Hillary? Her choice in men speaks for itself. McCain, aside from the innuendo that Smash keeps trying to smear him with, hasn't shown any evidence of Bill Clintonianism either. And his past behavior during wartime and in the halls of Congress shows him to be honorable.

Yeah, I guess that makes me naive too, huh?

Totem

$100 says you're wrong on the PoW story Smash. No sly comments from various unnamed sources, no innuendo, no Swiftboating stuff, but proof that his story is a fabrication.

A single, crisp 100 dollar bill. You willing to gamble?

Totem