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Madeleine McCannFollow

#1 Sep 07 2007 at 4:16 PM Rating: Excellent
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Now this is just freaky.

Madeleine's parents have had world press coverage about the loss of their daughter, including an audience with the Pope.

But. . .

Quote:
Both parents of missing Madeleine McCann have been named formal suspects in her disappearance by Portuguese police, according to their lawyer.

Gerry McCann was officially given "arguido" status 24 hours after his wife Kate, Carlos Pinto de Abreu said.


and

Quote:
officers believed that traces of Madeleine's blood were in the McCanns' car, hired 25 days after she vanished.


Smiley: disappointed

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#2 Sep 07 2007 at 4:20 PM Rating: Good
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This case gets wierder by the day...

If you believe the portugesse press who where saying the car thing three weeks ago there was also the smell of a corpse picked up inside the room car and on Kate McCanns jeans.

how much is true is pure speculation but while i was mocking the paper story last week it seems they where spot on after all.

I fear there is more to run on this story.
#3 Sep 07 2007 at 4:47 PM Rating: Decent
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I heard this on the radio, and that by Portugese law anyone associated with a criminal case an opt to be named a suspect in order to receive protection. But that sounds mighty odd to me.
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#4 Sep 07 2007 at 5:10 PM Rating: Excellent
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Poor kid. Smiley: disappointed

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#5 Sep 07 2007 at 6:13 PM Rating: Excellent
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Curiouser and curiouser.

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#6 Sep 07 2007 at 8:42 PM Rating: Good
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Is this the little girl with the funny eyes?
#7 Sep 08 2007 at 1:55 AM Rating: Excellent
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The Glorious GitSlayer wrote:
Is this the little girl with the funny eyes?
No, you're thinking of Marty Feldman.
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#8 Sep 08 2007 at 3:55 AM Rating: Decent
The theory now would be that the parents drugged the kid to get her to sleep or be quiet but messed up and killed her.

If they did it, they are about the cold blooded killers I've seen yet though. Not only killing your kid (by accident as the Portuguese police is saying) but swiftly thinking of a plan to cover it all up, keeping the body somewhere else well hidden and then getting rid of it weeks later. And then convincing a friend to lie about some stuff to make the police think the kid was kidnapped.

Very odd case.
#9 Sep 08 2007 at 6:52 AM Rating: Good
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Right from the start of this whole shennanigans I thought that mother looked a bit fishy. Although someone who could knock off their kid by accident and then tell the whole world to look for her for the next couple of months would have to be seriously, seriously deranged/imbalanced/crazy. Very crazy indeed.
#10 Sep 08 2007 at 8:51 AM Rating: Excellent
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This case gets wierder by the day...


It gets more and more ordinary by the dat. It usually is the parents that kill their own kids, not some Republic serial villain lurking in the shadows, stroking his mustache, crazy to kidnap and slaughter little blond girls.

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#11 Sep 09 2007 at 4:37 AM Rating: Good
Nexa wrote:

This case gets wierder by the day...


It gets more and more ordinary by the dat. It usually is the parents that kill their own kids, not some Republic serial villain lurking in the shadows, stroking his mustache, crazy to kidnap and slaughter little blond girls.


Nexa has turned into such a cynical, bitter, partisan know-it-all suddenly. How totally strange. Smiley: dubious

Anyway, I'm sick of hearing about this case. It's not news, it's nothing to do with anyone apart from them, it's just morbid and gruesome curiosity, fuelled by those crappy tabloids using this tragedy to sell more of their crappy newspapers to people that feel better about their lives by staring at the misery of others.

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#12 Sep 09 2007 at 4:56 AM Rating: Excellent
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[quote=Monsieur RedPhoenixxx]******************** cracks me up is that these 'intelligent' people (Both medical doctors) continually slag off the Portuguese police as lazy and corrupt.

I hope they find the child safe and well, and that she stabs her parents to death with a pointy thing.
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#13 Sep 10 2007 at 4:55 AM Rating: Excellent
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Monsieur RedPhoenixxx wrote:
Nexa wrote:

This case gets wierder by the day...


It gets more and more ordinary by the dat. It usually is the parents that kill their own kids, not some Republic serial villain lurking in the shadows, stroking his mustache, crazy to kidnap and slaughter little blond girls.


Nexa has turned into such a cynical, bitter, partisan know-it-all suddenly. How totally strange. Smiley: dubious


haha, yeah, at least for the most part there won't be any doubt when one of us has been too retarded to log in to their own account.

Nexa
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#14 Sep 10 2007 at 1:40 PM Rating: Decent
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/shrug

Got some time this weekend to watch some of the coverage on this case. Looks more like this is just the time in most investigations of this sort where the investigators turn to the family as suspects and the police are playing hardball to see if they can shake them up (and IMO going too far).

Honestly, I see the fact that the blood evidence was found in a car they rented weeks *after* the kid went missing as more likely to indicate a sloppy attempt at a frame up then anything else. I can just see some cop figuring "let's plant some blood in their car and point the blame at them", and not realizing that they weren't driving the same rental car they had when Madeleine disappeared. Oops!

After 20+ days, a body does not bleed. If they had somehow managed to hide her body somewhere (how?) and then waited 3+ weeks to move it, there wouldn't have been blood in the vehicle they moved it in. Hair and other stuff, yeah. But no blood. The fact that her blood appeared seems much more likely to be either a bizarre coincidence (like the abductor happened to rent the same car before the family did), or someone planting evidence, or someone botching the DNA matching.


I've seen some speculation that the local police know that they screwed this case up so badly, that they're desperate to push the blame back on the family so that it doesn't look like a tourist's child was actually abducted and they failed to do anything about it. It's Aruba all over again (Halloway case), where the police fall over themselves and spend more time trying to deflect blame away from anyone local that they botch the actual investigation horribly.


That's not to say it's possible that the parents did something wrong. Anythings possible. But this looks pretty fabricated to me so far...
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#15 Sep 10 2007 at 1:49 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
Honestly, I see the fact that the blood evidence was found in a car they rented weeks *after* the kid went missing as more likely to indicate a sloppy attempt at a frame up then anything else.



Inspector: Hey. Joao! Let's frame the parents
Sergeant: Okay Luis. How?
Inspector: Put some of the eenglish keed's blood in their car!
Sergeant: And you have some of her blood?!?!!
Inspector: Ahh. (looks at shoes)

Idiot
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#16 Sep 10 2007 at 2:18 PM Rating: Decent
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In my opinion, when a child turns up missing or dead in or from the family home (or vacation villa in this case), all eyes should be on the family. Does it prove innocence that they got the Pope to bless a photo of her? No. Susan Smith drowned both her kids then claimed on national tv that the car was jacked by a black man with a generic discription. She shed tears on tv and begged the public to find her babies. She confessed to killing them. Jon Bonet Ramsey gets taken from her room during the night while her parents were just down the hall and they didn't hear a thing? Give me a break, they're guilty as hell. Do I think that young Maddy's parents did it and are trying to cover it up? You betchya. Will they ever be found guilty? Probably not. Because just like the Ramsey's, they have money. I also believe that one of them commited the crime and is not only lying to the public but also the spouse. Now the spouse may or may not know. In this case I believe that the father is clueless that his wife is a murderer. In the case of Jon Bonet, I think the father did it and the mother knew about it after the fact. I really thought that while on her deathbed she would have spilled the beans but she didn't. Looks like another cold case.
#17 Sep 10 2007 at 2:19 PM Rating: Decent
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*cough*

Or they just put any old blood in there (or found a random spot that looked like it could be blood) and faked the DNA match...

Or they collected minor blood evidence from the original crime scene and used that.


Assuming the child had been dead for over 3 weeks at the time the parents rented the car in question, the only way any blood could have gotten there would have been transfer. It is just as likely that a police officer or some other interested party could have intentionally transferred some blood evidence into place after the fact as the parents doing it accidentally after the fact.


It's just incredibly unlikely that the parents managed to hide a body nearby for 3+ weeks with all the searches going on, on incredibly short notice in an otherwise unfamiliar location (they were on vacation, right?), and then with all the media attention on them they were able to load that body into their own rented car and dump it?

Seriously? You buy that?
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#18 Sep 10 2007 at 2:21 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
It is just as likely that a police officer or some other interested party could have intentionally transferred some blood evidence into place after the fact as the parents doing it accidentally after the fact.


Oh, yes. The "OMG they framed O.J.!" defense.
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#19 Sep 10 2007 at 2:23 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
*cough*

Or they just put any old blood in there (or found a random spot that looked like it could be blood) and faked the DNA match...

Or they collected minor blood evidence from the original crime scene and used that.


Assuming the child had been dead for over 3 weeks at the time the parents rented the car in question, the only way any blood could have gotten there would have been transfer. It is just as likely that a police officer or some other interested party could have intentionally transferred some blood evidence into place after the fact as the parents doing it accidentally after the fact.


It's just incredibly unlikely that the parents managed to hide a body nearby for 3+ weeks with all the searches going on, on incredibly short notice in an otherwise unfamiliar location (they were on vacation, right?), and then with all the media attention on them they were able to load that body into their own rented car and dump it?

Seriously? You buy that?
1. British & Portuguese police failed to find any of Madeleine's blood at the apartment.

2. All blood found has been taken to England for DNA testing at HM Home Office laborotories.

Want to look any more stupid?

Tough call but you've seized defeat from the jaws of victory in mopre spectacular ways befoire
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#20 Sep 10 2007 at 2:24 PM Rating: Excellent
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Battan the Irrelevant wrote:
Someone stole the word 'paragraph' from my dictionary
We feel your pain
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#21 Sep 10 2007 at 2:35 PM Rating: Decent
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Battan the Irrelevant wrote:
Susan Smith drowned both her kids then claimed on national tv that the car was jacked by a black man with a generic discription. She shed tears on tv and begged the public to find her babies. She confessed to killing them. Jon Bonet Ramsey gets taken from her room during the night while her parents were just down the hall and they didn't hear a thing? Give me a break, they're guilty as hell.


And Elizabeth Smart was found a year or so later half a continent away...


The fact is that the incidence of a parent killing a child and faking an abduction is incredibly rare. The vast majority of reported abductions are either mistakes (child was with friends and found safely shortly thereafter), or family related (a relative takes the child without permission, and the child is found safe shortly thereafter), or the child is actually kidnapped by a stranger intending the child harm.


The logic of cases like this is that you *always* assume the last case. Why? Because if the parents killed the child and are covering it with a kidnapping, then the status of the child isn't changed if you rush in the wrong direction for awhile. There's no harm done to the child's chances. If either of the other two cases are true, there *also* is no harm or risk to the child's safety. But if it's a true abduction, every single minute counts.

This is why even in cases where there's strong evidence to indicate a family member's involvement, they initially investigate it as though a stranger took the kid. Only after exhausting their leads in that direction do they turn back to the family. Because if you decide to focus on the family and it turns out that a stranger did it and the child may have been saved if only you'd been out beating the bushes instead of questioning family members, you're toast as an investigator (and you'll get sued for massive amounts of money).


Which is why I'm not surprised by the direction this case is going. All their leads have dried up (of course they totally botched the initial investigation and crime scene examination, so who knows how many clues they missed). Naturally, they then turn towards the family. The family was planning on leaving the country, so they needed a reason to keep them in Portugal while they are investigating. Trumping up evidence to make it look like they might have done it is a good way to do that...


Honestly, since we haven't seen the actual evidence yet, but have only heard leaks to the media, it's quite possible that none of this stuff is "true", but is being deliberately leaked by the police in order to make the parents more likely to confess. Hence, my initial statement that this is "hardball" by the police more then actual "proof" of any crime.


Never can be sure, but that's my gut on this. The timing is to coincidental, and the process of questioning of the mother too direct. It's designed to make it as easy as possible to confess. Hint that there's blood evidence of their involvement. Offer the mother a chance to confess that it was an accident. It's a pretty obvious pattern IMO...
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#22 Sep 10 2007 at 2:37 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
Smiley: tinfoilhat
I hear ya
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#23 Sep 10 2007 at 2:42 PM Rating: Decent
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Nobby wrote:
1. British & Portuguese police failed to find any of Madeleine's blood at the apartment.


Ok. But the article you linked said this:

Quote:
A British sniffer dog picked up the scent of a dead body in the apartment and samples, including suspected traces of blood, have been recovered from the scene.


So. We're to assume that none of the blood collected and sent to the UK for testing matched Madeleine, but magically this one sample in the trunk of the car did?

Quote:
2. All blood found has been taken to England for DNA testing at HM Home Office laborotories.



Including the blood allegedly found in the rental car? Remember. So far there's been no official confirmation of this at all (none that I've read anyway). Members of the family have reported that the police told the parents this in the process of interrogating them.

Again. Could have been faked information designed to obtain a confession.
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#24 Sep 10 2007 at 2:43 PM Rating: Good
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Elizabeth Smart was found like 10 miles from where she lived...that is hardly half a continent away.
#25 Sep 10 2007 at 2:56 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
Nobby wrote:
1. British & Portuguese police failed to find any of Madeleine's blood at the apartment.


Ok. But the article you linked said this:

Quote:
A British sniffer dog picked up the scent of a dead body in the apartment and samples, including suspected traces of blood, have been recovered from the scene.


So. We're to assume that none of the blood collected and sent to the UK for testing matched Madeleine, but magically this one sample in the trunk of the car did?

Quote:
2. All blood found has been taken to England for DNA testing at HM Home Office laborotories.



Including the blood allegedly found in the rental car? Remember. So far there's been no official confirmation of this at all (none that I've read anyway). Members of the family have reported that the police told the parents this in the process of interrogating them.

Again. Could have been faked information designed to obtain a confession.


The blood from the apartment has been tested and is not Madeleine's and is almost certailnly from several months before the McCann's visited.

The 'alleged' blood sample from the car has not yet been tested.

You are a *****

Although Alien Ninja abduction has not yet been ruled out.
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#26 Sep 10 2007 at 3:47 PM Rating: Decent
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DannaLyn wrote:
Elizabeth Smart was found like 10 miles from where she lived...that is hardly half a continent away.


Where she'd been for a whopping 7 days.

For the previous 9 months she was in San Diego, California (Lakeside to be precise). Her abductors took her back to Utah after they were spotted in California and the chase began to heat up. Had she not been spotted in San Diego she'd likely *still* be here and still be assumed dead.
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