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You know what keeps criminals from breaking the law?Follow

#27 Aug 14 2007 at 9:12 AM Rating: Decent
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NephthysWanderer the Charming wrote:
Look, if he had said all of these things and then molested some child, everyone would have sued the state. They put forth a restraining order and he breaks it.

I think CA handled it correctly. As far as I know, you don't have to commit a crime to have a restraining order filed against you. It's not like they put him in jail for it.


You're probably right. It's still wrong what they did, but I'd probably have done the same thing given the choice. Sometimes wrong is right, but if he fought this in court he'd probably win (won't matter, the damage is done, he'll be watched like a hawk from now on).
#28 Aug 14 2007 at 9:41 AM Rating: Decent
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A restraining order is an order made by a court to protect a person from physical pain or injury or the threat of pain or injury.

He obviously made it clear enough to the judge that he constituted a threat to the well being of children.

Again, he was not committed of a crime. That is until he broke the restraining order by sitting outside a daycare with a camera.

#29 Aug 14 2007 at 11:07 AM Rating: Good
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Neph is right. You don't have to break a law to get a restraining order. It's common pracice now in divorce cases for the parents to get restraining orders against each other so they can later prove their spouse is 'evil' when it comes to custody.
#30 Aug 14 2007 at 11:14 AM Rating: Good
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I don't think what he is saying is against the law, per se, however, I do belive it is probable casue that he is conspiring to break the law, and conspiracy is a crime if they can find further evidence, say a plan on how he would meet or find this child.

Edited, Aug 14th 2007 3:15pm by fhrugby
#31 Aug 14 2007 at 1:39 PM Rating: Default
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He obviously made it clear enough to the judge that he constituted a threat to the well being of children.


From what I gathered of the story, that was based on a logical leap that "he wants to do it, so he might do it."

As others have already pointed out, there are many illegal things some of us fantasize about doing. That doesn't necessarily warrant a restraining order, particularly if we announce that we realize it's just a fantasy and would never do it.
#32 Aug 14 2007 at 4:48 PM Rating: Good
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Kachi wrote:
Quote:
He obviously made it clear enough to the judge that he constituted a threat to the well being of children.


From what I gathered of the story, that was based on a logical leap that "he wants to do it, so he might do it."

As others have already pointed out, there are many illegal things some of us fantasize about doing. That doesn't necessarily warrant a restraining order, particularly if we announce that we realize it's just a fantasy and would never do it.


Depends on what the legal requirement for a restraining order is though.

Let's say you had a freaky friend. Let's say that this friend publically stated that he'd like to kill you. I'm pretty sure that would meet the criteria for you to get a restraining order.

Same deal here I think. The judge ruled that his public statements regarding his desire to "cuddle" with young girls constituted a sufficient threat to issue the order. We can debate whether he would have actually done anything, but I think that's moot. Someone does not need to have committed an act of violence against someone else for a restraining order to be filed.


I think the bigger legal issue is one of scope. Usually a restraining order is pretty specific. This person represents a threat to this other person or small group of people. I don't think I've ever heard of a restraining order this broad issued before. Conditions of parole? Yes. But not a regular restraining order. He might be able to argue it on those grounds.
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#33 Aug 14 2007 at 8:22 PM Rating: Default
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Well I agree somewhat on that point, because the desire is vague and unspecific to any one individual. If I say I'd like to go on a killing spree, but I wouldn't, that shouldn't be grounds for a restraining order. If I say that I'd like to kill YOU, but I wouldn't, I think it's a lot more reasonable to put a restraining order on me exclusive to you.

But I would still argue that a desire to do something is not sufficient grounds for a restraining order when the person announces that they won't do it and they aren't in a punitive situation when they do so. If I say I'd like a million dollars but wouldn't steal it, I'd hope I'm not going to have to stay at least 30 feet away from any facility that has a million dollars, you know, just to be safe.
#34 Aug 14 2007 at 10:28 PM Rating: Decent
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Tsuki? dat j00?
#35 Aug 15 2007 at 1:28 AM Rating: Good
I think the bigger issue is what the fUck should society do about pedophiles.

Take this case. If the guy goes to jail for breaking his restraining order, he won't be there long. Once he's released, he's back on the streets, and the situation will be just the same as before. It's only a "delaying tactic".

Of course, this guy has been all over the news, so I don't doubt some vigilante groups will try to watch his actions.

But on the long-run, it's still not very productive.

I'm really not an expert on the subject, and i'm not a big fan of castrating people. I don't know if psychotherapists can "cure" pedohpilia or not, or even dimish the urges in some way.

Maybe an explosive-packed bracelet which detonates when the suspect gets within 30 feet of kids...



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#36 Aug 15 2007 at 1:49 AM Rating: Good
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Monsieur RedPhoenixxx wrote:
Maybe an explosive-packed bracelet which detonates when the suspect gets within 30 feet of kids...



Would probably traumatize the kids. Not as much as being molested, but still.

Maybe have it arm if he's too close to kids and detonate if he touches one? To only traumatize the kids if trauma is already imminent?
#37 Aug 15 2007 at 2:24 AM Rating: Good
The One and Only Poldaran wrote:
Maybe have it arm if he's too close to kids and detonate if he touches one? To only traumatize the kids if trauma is already imminent?


I can see the twisted logic, and I like it.

Maybe put the bracelet on his *****, and if he gets an erection, BAM!!

That should help keep their libidos in check.

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#38 Aug 15 2007 at 2:01 PM Rating: Decent
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Same deal here I think. The judge ruled that his public statements regarding his desire to "cuddle" with young girls constituted a sufficient threat to issue the order. We can debate whether he would have actually done anything, but I think that's moot. Someone does not need to have committed an act of violence against someone else for a restraining order to be filed.


No, but someone needs to have been threatened, which no one was here, and also threatened *specifically*. This is the equivalent of a KKK member saying "I'd like to kill a black person, but I never would because it's illegal" being barred from being with so many feet of *any black person*.

It's ludicrously over-broad and has no hope of withstanding challenge. There's no compelling interest here for the state to restrict this guys freedom *before* he's done anything illegal or threatened to do same. You can't ad hoc issue court orders against random people doing nothing wrong who's opinions you disagree with.
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#39 Aug 16 2007 at 11:17 PM Rating: Decent
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I think the bigger issue is what the **** should society do about @#%^philes.


I think that expands to the broader problem of how can we get people to stop doing immoral things when no one is around to stop them. I'm sure that just as in any crime, we can't reasonably get rid of the desire for the action, and there are different reasons why people aren't deterred. At best, we can provide the presumably missing cognitive tool that allows people to not do things that are wrong even if they want to. People break the laws for different reasons, so there is no blanket answer.
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