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I have nothing to say about this.

This hinges on what was intended by "all agencies". I would assume that means various departments under the various cabinet positions which deal with classfied materials. So like the FBI, CIA, NSA, DoD, etc...

Without you perhaps having some source of information other then hearsay, it's pretty much impossible to know for sure, but at a guess I'd say that an individuals office within the whitehouse itself is not necessarily considered an "agency".



Again. Source on this information? Was he doing it before? To whom? Was this done in a vacuum? Or perhaps had something to do with the reshaping of how intelligence and classified materials are handled as a result of the formation of the Homeland Security Department. It's not like the VPs office is actually empowered to do anything directly. They may interact with other agencies, but then those documents would appear and be reported because the other agencies were involved.

It's not like the VP has his own super secret squad of Jack Bauer clones doing his evil bidding. Ok. Not that you or I know of anyway... ;)



Well. He is the President of the Senate. He holds the tie breaker vote. Thus, he (and his office) would be involved in legistlative matters as part of the normal day to day job. In fact, that's really one of the major duties of the VPs office. To act as a direct link between the President and Congress. It would not surprise me if a significant majority of paper that passes through that office is legistlative in nature, not executive.




Ok. Do you have any reason to believe that this is false? Again. It would help terrifically if you actually knew something concrete about the executive order rather then just hearsay.




Asked by whom? You make this sound like it's some ominous thing and there's some kind of conspiracy going on. If it's not illegal, then what is there to "rule on" (he's not a judge though, so this is a poor choice of words)? What was Gonzales supposed to do? Have a complete investigation into something that's not illegal so that he can hold a press conference declaring it to not be illegal just so he can satisfy some nutjob leftwinger's strage fantasies about how the law should work?



Apparently? Um... Can we be a bit more definative then this? At this point, you're just rummormongering. And doing it poorly at that. I can make up stories about horrible things that someone in government might be doing right now too...



False dilema. First off, as I pointed out, the VP *is* technically a member of the Senate, and certainly does deal with legistlative issues (has to). It's one of the few (perhaps *only*) Constituationally mandated duties the VP has (except to take over as President in case of incapacitation).

Secondly, since you haven't established what was meant by "agencies", you can't say that the VPs office is in anyway covered under that executive order. Thus, your wonderfully contrived "or else he's doing something evil!!!!" argument is both silly and irrelevant.

You might want to start with the executive order. Then see how the order is applied. Then figure out whether the VPs office is covered. And then you might just want to ask the president how he feels about it. See. It's an "executive order". Not a law. The president is not bound by it. Can't be. He can pick and choose how it's applied to. It's his order, by his authority. The only one who can demand that someone comply is the president. I'm reasonably certain that if he wanted or intended for Cheney's office to comply with that order, Cheney's office would be complying.


Or do you not really understand what an Executive Order is?

Ah. Now I know what this is about.

You do know this has nothing to do with some kind of "freedom of information", right? It has everything to do with abusing power, but not in the way you think.

Chairman Waxman has been trying to dig up dirt on Republicans, specifically the White house since he gained the power to do so in the last elections. His tactic is similar to that used against Libby during the Plame deal. Throw a wall of motions, appeals, and subpeonas at the White House. Get as many people to make statements "on the record" as possible, then dig through the archives for any fact or statement that does not match. Then try to charge them with a crime.


It's a fishing expedition. Again. This is the same guy who attempted to get Rice to show up and give him statements under oath about her knowledge of Iraq's WMD programs from back when she was National Security Advisor. His entire deal is trying to dig up old stuff from two different directions to see if he can create the appearance of inconsistency. He's a monumental waste of time.


In this particular case, he's trying to keep the Plame investigation alive. Not good enough to get one person totally unrelated to the leak, so he's going to see if he can keep throwing stuff out there and hope something shakes loose. Never mind that we already know who leaked her identity. Never mind that Fitzerald has closed that investigation. Never mind that the only result of the investigation was the indictment and conviction of someone who wasn't involved in the leak in any way. Because what he's doing has nothing to do with justice. It has nothing to do with whether or not Cheney's office has correctly handled classified documents. It has everything with trying to catch someone in a lie (or something that can be made to appear like a lie). He figures if he can examine enough documents, he'll find something to use.


And, even if he fails, he can always use the mere fact that he's trying to make some people believe there must be something there. Where there's smoke there's fire, right? If there wasn't something suspicious going on at the White House, Waxman wouldn't be insisting on those documents, right? Think about it...

Don't you live in some worthless ****** little country no one cares about anyway? Why the **** do you care,and why the **** should I care that you care?


I live in hope too, that the Army grabs your *** and tosses you into gitmo. Shut the **** up.

Without reading, allow me to sum up the rest of this post...

Liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy, liberal conspiracy... truely, this is a new low point for the Dems and why they are so dangerous. Think about it.

So he wears heavy plate and gets a gimpy skeleton pet.

Could be worse. He could get to wear plate and get some heals and stuns instead of that gimpy pet...


And Joph? You can cry "OMG! gbaji's talkin Liberal Conspiracy again!!!" all day long. Doesn't change the fact that since being appointed chairman of oversight, Waxman has basically spent all his time on some weird kind of personal vendetta against the White House. It seems as though his "job" really is to dig up any documents or statements by any administration officials that can be used as a political weapon. His tactic of preference seems to be the "get them from two sources" approach. Find a document that says one thing, and a sworn statement that says something that looks different. Present this as some kind of oddity that should be investigated...


Just more of the same IMO.

So he's a ShadowKnight? Seems appropriate.

par for the coarse for this addministraition.

not supprised, no comment. just waiting for their time in office to tick away.

gbaji said




Obviously you have no idea what its about....

The real issue in this story is not the efforts of Waxman, or the withholding of information that is legally required to be passed on to the relevant departments.

No. the real issue here is that D1ck Cheney, the VP of the USA, said in no uncertain terms that the office of The vice president of the United States is not actually part of the executive branch of the federal government, and is therefore not required to give any papers to anyone, ever.

Tho he is covered by executive privilege, and he is a member of the presidential cabinet, yet somehow his office is not part of the executive branch.


The fact that his position as VP. is there at all is in case for some reason Bush is unable to continue his duties as El Presidente, then he is there to step in and take over the reins. If he feels that that isn't what he's there for, he should go home and retire.

For you to get all tied in a knot about Waxman and Plame and Bob knows what, shows that you havnt for a moment, thought about the implications of Cheneys reaction.

As Joph said, you seem to be losin' it ....


And abbadd added


You need to get out more. So much anger!! So little understanding of the world outside of Bumfuck USA.......