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Senate passes US attorney billFollow

#1 Mar 20 2007 at 12:12 PM Rating: Excellent
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Well, at least some good has come of this Gonzales fiasco.
The Trib wrote:
[...]Earlier, the Senate by a 94-2 vote passed a bill that would cancel the attorney general's power to appoint U.S. attorneys without Senate confirmation. Democrats say the administration abused that authority when it fired the eight prosecutors and proposed replacing some with White House loyalists.

"If you politicize the prosecutors, you politicize everybody in the whole chain of law enforcement," said Judiciary Committee Chairman Patrick Leahy, D-Vt.

The bill, which has yet to be considered in the House, would set a 120-day deadline for the administration to appoint an interim prosecutor. If the interim appointment is not confirmed by the Senate in that time, a permanent replacement would be named by a federal district judge.

Essentially, the Senate returned the law regarding the appointments of U.S. attorneys to where it was before Congress passed the Patriot Act, including the unilateral appointment authority the administration had sought in the wake of the 9/11 terror attacks.
Not much doubt that Pelosi & Co. will pass it through with a quickness.

The rest of the story is about the White House agreeing to let Rove, et al give "interviews" but not under oath and not transcripted. It remains to be seen if the Senate will bite on that or press on to issue supoenas. And another Pubbie, Tom Tancredo, came out to say that Gonzales should resign saying that "Alberto Gonzales has repeatedly shown that he is unwilling to enforce the law and unable to effectively manage the Department".
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#2 Mar 20 2007 at 12:17 PM Rating: Good
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Judiciary Committee Chairman Patrick Leahy, D-Vt. wrote:
"If you politicize the prosecutors, you politicize everybody in the whole chain of law enforcement"
Isn't it a little late for such obvious thinking?

I may be ill-informed, but compared to most European laws, this has always been a worying aspect of the US criminal justice system.

That said, we now have an Attorney General in the UK whose impartiality os shot to hell.
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#3 Mar 20 2007 at 12:24 PM Rating: Decent
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http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/D?d110:57:./temp/~bdDTif::

Is that the bill? I'm trying to find out the two Senators that voted no.
#4 Mar 20 2007 at 12:30 PM Rating: Excellent
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Heh, speaking of, Patrick Fitzgerald, who has been publicly lauded by numerous folks (including Bush) and was hand-picked to be Special Counsel for the Plame case was rated as mediocre in the rankings of who the administration liked
The Trib wrote:
U.S. Attorney Patrick Fitzgerald of Chicago was ranked among prosecutors who had "not distinguished themselves" on a Justice Department chart sent to the White House in March 2005, when he was leading a CIA leak investigation that resulted in the perjury conviction of a former vice presidential aide, administration officials said Monday.

The ranking placed Fitzgerald below "strong U.S. Attorneys ... who exhibited loyalty" to the administration but above "weak U.S. Attorneys who ... chafed against Administration initiatives, etc.," according to Justice documents.
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#5 Mar 20 2007 at 12:34 PM Rating: Excellent
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Paskil wrote:
Is that the bill? I'm trying to find out the two Senators that voted no.
Quote:
NAYs ---2
Bond (R-MO)
Hagel (R-NE)

Not Voting - 4
Biden (D-DE)
Johnson (D-SD)
McCain (R-AZ)
Mikulski (D-MD)
That's off the Senate website. Kind of interesting that two presidential hopefuls couldn't be bothered to vote on it. Johnson gets a pass (brain surgery guy) and I've no idea who the hell Mikulski is.

Edited, Mar 20th 2007 1:36pm by Jophiel
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#6 Mar 20 2007 at 12:39 PM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
I'm not idea who the hell Mikulski is.
Isn't he the Engineer 3rd Class who always dies in Star Trek?
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#7 Mar 20 2007 at 12:42 PM Rating: Decent
Odd, I could have sworn that District Attorneys are supposed to be impartial to politics and only be concerned with upholding the law and prosecuting those that break the law, not those that think Bush is an ok guy.
#8 Mar 20 2007 at 12:46 PM Rating: Excellent
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Althrun wrote:
Odd, I could have sworn that District Attorneys are supposed to be impartial to politics and only be concerned with upholding the law and prosecuting those that break the law, not those that think Bush is an ok guy.


Both positions are politically vulnerable, but we're talking about U.S. attorneys, not district attorneys.
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#9 Mar 20 2007 at 12:50 PM Rating: Decent
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Duh, guess I should look around a bit more. Smiley: oyvey
#10 Mar 20 2007 at 12:52 PM Rating: Decent
I stand corrected. Smiley: bowdown

Still, in a perfect world politics wouldn't interfere in the justice system.
#11 Mar 20 2007 at 1:13 PM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
Paskil wrote:
Is that the bill? I'm trying to find out the two Senators that voted no.
Quote:
NAYs ---2
Bond (R-MO)
Hagel (R-NE)

Not Voting - 4
Biden (D-DE)
Johnson (D-SD)
McCain (R-AZ)
Mikulski (D-MD)
That's off the Senate website. Kind of interesting that two presidential hopefuls couldn't be bothered to vote on it. Johnson gets a pass (brain surgery guy) and I'm not idea who the hell Mikulski is.
McCain may have been off campaigning or whatnot, but it's not unusual for them to miss a vote. It may have even been smart of him to do so if he didn't want to be on the record with it, although I hear the Senate considered it a foregone conclusion that it would pass when Gonzalez himself said that Bush wouldn't veto.

Barbara Mikulski, from Maryland. I'm sure she was scrapbooking.
#12 Mar 20 2007 at 1:17 PM Rating: Excellent
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Atomicflea wrote:
I hear the Senate considered it a foregone conclusion that it would pass when Gonzalez himself said that Bush wouldn't veto.
Yeah, I assumed there was an air of "It'll pass with or without me" to it but it seemed the sort of thing you'd want to point to to say "Lookit how I helped restore accountibility to the office!"

I'm sure it won't matter either way but it was still an eyebrow raiser.
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#13 Mar 20 2007 at 1:18 PM Rating: Good
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Atomicflea wrote:
Barbara Mikulski, from Maryland. I'm sure she was crushed under a Styrofoam boulder and eaten by tribbles.
See?
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#14 Mar 20 2007 at 5:39 PM Rating: Good
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While I'm not opposed to the bill (checks and balances are usually always a good thing), I am a bit concerned with the one-sided claims of "politisizing" regarding this issue.

It's not like this removes the politics from the decision. If anything, it increases it, since every appointment becomes a matter of politics (multiple parties and/or multiple branches of government getting their hand in the pie). It's like trying to argue that the Senate Confirmation hearings for SCOTUS nominees are somehow "non-political".

Absurd. The real complaint wasn't that the positions were political, but that the Dems were cut out of the political process involved and didn't like that.


Our entire system assumes that every decision is "political". Otherwise why have the whole checks and balances to begin with? We assume that any given party is going to put people into positions of power that will support that party's agenda. Pointing the finger of blame when a party does that is kinda silly IMO. Pointing out a flaw in the legal code that allowed a party to do that without sufficient checks is valid, but leave the whole "They shouldn't be politicizing this!" bit out. Of course they should. More correctly, if one "side" doesn't, it's not like the other side avoids it either.

Ask yourself how "political" the Dems make every single judicial appointment (and the Republicans as well). It's a bit unfair to only say it's wrong when the other guy does it.
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#15 Mar 20 2007 at 9:14 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
While I'm not opposed to the bill (checks and balances are usually always a good thing), I am a bit concerned with the one-sided claims of "politisizing" regarding this issue.


Activist Jugdes, liberal media, partisan politicians.


Those are all good but when a dem uses the same move it is 'concerning'?
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#16 Mar 21 2007 at 2:40 AM Rating: Decent
Nothing to do with the OP, I'm jumping from the **** to the donkey, as we say in French.

This transcript of John McCain being interviewed about his AIDS policy in Africa is quite amusing. I know, I know, it's hard to campaign and have an opinion about everything (except for gbaji), and I quite like the guy all in all, but, in the words of Lilly Allen, it still made me smi-ah-ah-ah-ile:


- Reporter: “Should U.S. taxpayer money go to places like Africa to fund contraception to prevent AIDS?”

- Mr. McCain: “Well I think it’s a combination. The guy I really respect on this is Dr. Coburn. He believes – and I was just reading the thing he wrote– that you should do what you can to encourage abstinence where there is going to be sexual activity. Where that doesn’t succeed, than he thinks that we should employ contraceptives as well. But I agree with him that the first priority is on abstinence. I look to people like Dr. Coburn. I’m not very wise on it.”

(Mr. McCain turns to take a question on Iraq, but a moment later looks back to the reporter who asked him about AIDS.)

- Mr. McCain: “I haven’t thought about it. Before I give you an answer, let me think about. Let me think about it a little bit because I never got a question about it before. I don’t know if I would use taxpayers’ money for it.”

- Q: “What about grants for sex education in the United States? Should they include instructions about using contraceptives? Or should it be Bush’s policy, which is just abstinence?”

- Mr. McCain: (Long pause) “Ahhh. I think I support the president’s policy.”

- Q: “So no contraception, no counseling on contraception. Just abstinence. Do you think contraceptives help stop the spread of HIV?”

- Mr. McCain: (Long pause) “You’ve stumped me.”

- Q: “I mean, I think you’d probably agree it probably does help stop it?”

- Mr. McCain: (Laughs) “Are we on the Straight Talk express? I’m not informed enough on it. Let me find out. You know, I’m sure I’ve taken a position on it on the past. I have to find out what my position was. Brian, would you find out what my position is on contraception – I’m sure I’m opposed to government spending on it, I’m sure I support the president’s policies on it.”

- Q: “But you would agree that condoms do stop the spread of sexually transmitted diseases. Would you say: ‘No, we’re not going to distribute them,’ knowing that?”

- Mr. McCain: (Twelve-second pause) “Get me Coburn’s thing, ask Weaver to get me Coburn’s paper that he just gave me in the last couple of days. I’ve never gotten into these issues before.”



I'm not a big fan of this Coburn guy, though. Read his paper, and he's not that cool.

[i]Edited, Mar 21st 2007 10:40am by RedPhoenixxx
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#17 Mar 21 2007 at 8:33 PM Rating: Excellent
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Just keeping the AGAG info in one place...
Editor & Publisher wrote:
NEW YORK As each day passes, the phrase "shades of Watergate" appears more and more often in the press regarding the conflict surrounding the recent firing of eight U.S. attorneys. There was the hiring of former Nixon legal adviser Fred Fielding (he was once rumored to be Deep Throat) by President Bush, the selective release of documents, the threat to oppose subpoenas -- and now something reminiscent of the famous "18 1/2 minute gap."

Mike Allen wrote for The Politico, "In DOJ documents that were publicly posted by the House Judiciary Committee, there is a gap from mid-November to early December in e-mails and other memos, which was a critical period as the White House and Justice Department reviewed, then approved, which U.S. attorneys would be fired while also developing a political and communications strategy for countering any fallout from the firings."
[...]
Asked about the gap today, Tony Snow, White House spokesman said, "I've been led to believe that there's a good response for it, and I'm going to let you ask them (DOJ) because they're going to have an answer."

CNN, counting differently, later put the gap at 16 days. It also said a few scattered documents from that period were released but nothing important and so the mystery of the missing material remains.
DOJ managed to dump over three thousand pages on Congress to sift through but neglected to include the most important time period in their communications. I'm reminded of the criticisms when Iraq waited until the last moment to dump a bajillion pages of info on the UN regarding its weapon programs.

If you're the sort to enjoy transcripts of White House breifings, today's was amusingly McClellan-esque.
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#18 Mar 21 2007 at 9:01 PM Rating: Good
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If you're the sort to enjoy transcripts of White House breifings, today's was amusingly McClellan-esque.


Almost embarrased to admit that i am that 'sort'. This was my favorite bit...

Quote:
Q So, Tony, back when President Clinton was citing executive privilege to keep internal deliberations in that White House from being talked about in Congress, you wrote -- now famously --

MR. SNOW: I didn't say it was famous, Ed. I didn't get that kind of coverage at the time. (Laughter.)

Q Well, it's become more famous.

MR. SNOW: Is it making its way through the left-wing blogs?

Q It is. (Laughter.)

Q No, no. But you wrote quite eloquently about this. You said, "Taken to its logical extreme, that position would make it impossible for citizens to hold the chief executive accountable. We would have a constitutional right to a coverup."

MR. SNOW: Right. Now let me --

Q So why were you wrong then and right now?

MR. SNOW: Because this is a not entirely analogous situation. I've just told you what we have, in fact, offered to make available to members of Congress. And what we are doing is we are holding apart confidential communications between advisors and the President. And that is pretty standard practice in White Houses. But, again --

Q It's exactly what the Clinton administration talked about.

MR. SNOW: Well, I'm not so sure. And I'll let others do the legal arguing on that. But the important point here is we're maintaining the presidential prerogatives and, at the same time, we're making available exhaustive -- we're offering basically to give them, exhaustively, communications that bear on this issue and also make the key players -- at least at the Justice Department and the people they said they wanted to hear from at the White House -- they're all going to be available. That's not a coverup. That is, in fact, a very open offer to get all the facts into the hands of the people who, presumably, want to figure out what the facts are.



And this..

Quote:
MR. SNOW: You know, the President has a very fertile mind.


Does he really mean its full of shit? Or what? We need to know....
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#19 Mar 22 2007 at 4:34 PM Rating: Good
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There is the critical difference that Clinton was attempting to use Executive Privilege to avoid having to provide Congress with any documents or records, while Bush is freely offering those documents to Congress, but does not want them to be made "public".

The former allows for coverups. The latter does not. The real question is: "Why is there a requirement to release these publically?". The answer is really simple. The day to day workings and decision making processes in any organization, if released en-mass to the public would inevitably result in ammunition to use against that organization. It does not matter what that organization is. Someone will suggest something and whether acted upon or not, the mere fact of the suggestion may result in public outcry.

We've seen this before when minutes from meetings end up leaked to the public (both from private and public sources). It's pretty obvious that this is the reason the Dems want this information released publically. They don't care about these attorneys, or why they were fired. They just want to see if they can find some juicy statements made in an email or three that can be presented to the public with a "See what the Evil Bush administration guys are thinking/saying?" tag attached.


There's a very good reason why this is a bad idea. Organizations within the government (including the White House), need to have the freedom to consider many different options. They are hindered if every single member of their staff feels that anything they say may become public record and be gone over for any interpretation that might reflect badly on the people they work for. They need to feel safe that they can make any suggestion and allow it to be considered on the merit of the situation at hand, not based on how it might be percieved by some future public.


There is absolutely zero reason why Congress can't conduct their investigation into whether there was wrongdoing in the case of these firings *without* requiring that every single email and document be made public information. This should be something handled internally by the Judiciary Committee. If they can find evidence of wrongdoing, *then* they can bring it up, file charges, demand subpoenas for testimoney, etc. But right now all we have is a giant fishing expedition...


EDIT: I'm pretty sure "firingings" isn't a word...

Edited, Mar 22nd 2007 5:36pm by gbaji
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#20 Mar 22 2007 at 6:22 PM Rating: Decent
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They don't care about these attorneys, or why they were fired. They just want to see if they can find some juicy statements made in an email or three that can be presented to the public with a "See what the Evil Bush administration guys are thinking/saying?" tag attached.


Yup. Awesome, isn't it? I'm so glad the Dems won the Senate.

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#21 Mar 23 2007 at 4:54 PM Rating: Good
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Smasharoo wrote:

They don't care about these attorneys, or why they were fired. They just want to see if they can find some juicy statements made in an email or three that can be presented to the public with a "See what the Evil Bush administration guys are thinking/saying?" tag attached.


Yup. Awesome, isn't it? I'm so glad the Dems won the Senate.


While I'm sure you are, I think that most of the voters that went Dem in 2006 were hoping for something a bit more meaningful then "We'll use the power you give us to try to dig up irrelevant dirt on Republicans so we can con you all into giving us more power in the next election!!!".


Wasn't there something about the "first 100 hours" and how they were going to accomplish all these great things that the people voted Dem for? Oh yeah! They pretty much failed on every single point. But don't worry. They'll come up with enough scandal "smokescreen" to make sure that the voting public doesn't really notice that they didn't fullfill a single one of their promises, but instead embarked on a pork-finding-expedition to enrichen themselves at voter expense...
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#22 Mar 23 2007 at 5:05 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
Wasn't there something about the "first 100 hours" and how they were going to accomplish all these great things that the people voted Dem for? Oh yeah! They pretty much failed on every single point.
Huh?

Minimum Wage Act: Passed House & Senate.
Implementing 9/11 Recommendations: Passed House, in Senate committee.
Stem-Cell Research: Passed House, on Senate voting calendar
MediCare Prescription Drug Act: Passed House, in Senate committee.
College Student Relief Act: Passed House, in Senate committee.
Long-Term Energy act: Passed House, on Senate voting calendar.

Pelosi never promised anything about the Senate. She couldn't have. She promised that, in the first 100 hours, the House (under her control) would pass these bills. They did. I don't know if they'll all pass the Senate or if Bush will veto or whatever but I have no idea how you can say that she failed in what she announced that she'd do as Speaker.
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#23 Mar 23 2007 at 7:26 PM Rating: Good
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Joph. The bills that were passed were shadows of what Pelosi promised. Which is the point. With the exception of the minimum wage change, they're all things that look great if you don't read anything more then the title of the bill.

We're also looking at a list that somehow doesn't include the single most important issue that decided the vote in 2006, the Iraq war. Odd, don't you think...?

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#24 Mar 24 2007 at 6:20 AM Rating: Excellent
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Was the Iraq war on the list that Pelosi floated over a month before the election? What? No?

How DARE she not include it in her list of 100 hour accomplishments then! Smiley: laugh

It cccoooouuuulllldddd be that Pelosi realized that bringing the war to a close would take more than a single bill passed in the first week of Congress. Go figure.

As for the rest, HR5 cuts college loan interest rates in half by 2011, as promised. HR3 opens NIH funding for embryonic stem cell research on IVF embryos, as promised. HR4 demands that Health & Human Serevices negotiate with pharmacutical comapnies to lower prices for medications, as promised...

What exactly are you claiming didn't happen here? Is this just some talking point you picked up from the AM radio without bothing to look into yourself?
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#25 Mar 24 2007 at 7:11 AM Rating: Excellent
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Getting back to AGAG, today's paper says
The paper wrote:
WASHINGTON -- New documents sent by the Justice Department to Congress on Friday night cast doubt on earlier assertions by Atty. Gen. Alberto Gonzales that he was not deeply involved in plans to fire U.S. attorneys.

The records show that Gonzales approved plans to fire the prosecutors at an hourlong meeting Nov. 27, less than two weeks before the dismissal of seven of the prosecutors.

Gonzales told reporters on March 13 that "what I knew about the process was not involved in seeing any memos, was not involved in any discussions about what was going on."

Justice Department spokeswoman Tasia Scolinos on Friday night told The Washington Post that the department does not see Gonzales' remarks as inconsistent with the Nov. 27 meeting.


Edited, Mar 24th 2007 8:12am by Jophiel
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#26 Mar 24 2007 at 1:02 PM Rating: Good
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