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Wasted OpportunitiesFollow

#1 Mar 01 2007 at 10:07 AM Rating: Good
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The 4th Estate wrote:
WASHINGTON -- Republican presidential contender John McCain, a staunch backer of the Iraq war but critic of how President Bush has waged it, said U.S. lives had been "wasted" in the four-year-old conflict. Democrats demand the Arizona senator apologize for the comment as Sen. Barack Obama did when the Democratic White House hopeful recently made the same observation.
"Americans are very frustrated, and they have every right to be," McCain said Wednesday on CBS' "Late Show With David Letterman." "We've wasted a lot of our most precious treasure, which is American lives."
Smiley: rolleyes

A much, much better response would have been "We know McCain said 'wasted' and we have no issue with it because we know what McCain meant -- the same exact thing Obama meant when he said it. And there is nothing wrong with calling the administration to task for their horrible mismanagement of this war and the fact that it is costing American lives."

The whole "We had to apologize for doing nothing wrong so now you do too even though it was nothing to apologize for" deal is pretty weak.
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#2 Mar 01 2007 at 10:09 AM Rating: Good
Impossible. Being a sackless vag is the new political black.
#3 Mar 01 2007 at 11:28 AM Rating: Decent
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If an apology is an admission of guilt, these guys are stupid to apologize. Hell, name the last president that didn't stand his ground even when he was hopelessly *******
#4 Mar 01 2007 at 11:29 AM Rating: Decent
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The whole "We had to apologize for doing nothing wrong so now you do too even though it was nothing to apologize for" deal is pretty weak.


It's called 'politics'.
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To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.

#5 Mar 01 2007 at 11:31 AM Rating: Good
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Smasharoo wrote:


The whole "We had to apologize for doing nothing wrong so now you do too even though it was nothing to apologize for" deal is pretty weak.


It's called 'politics'.
True. At the end of the day it's a popularity contest, and McCain can't afford to be any less liked by the conservatives on his side of the fence.
#6 Mar 01 2007 at 11:44 AM Rating: Decent
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This is the same thing as Osama, I mean Obama (I don't think that joke will ever get old, tired, but not old). They both said how they felt. What they said was correct, even if "wasted" wasn't the best word.
#7 Mar 01 2007 at 12:00 PM Rating: Excellent
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Smasharoo wrote:
The whole "We had to apologize for doing nothing wrong so now you do too even though it was nothing to apologize for" deal is pretty weak.

It's called 'politics'.
It's called "shitty politics" because there are much better ways to stick it to the other side and seem magnamious about it rather than coming across as pissy children.

We know McCain said 'wasted' and we have no issue with it because we know what McCain meant -- the same exact thing Obama meant when he said it. We are glad to see that some on the other side of the aisle are finally coming to agree with what Obama has been saying for two years now and hope other Republicans will continue to support us in calling this administration to task for their failed policies and mismanagement."

Edited, Mar 1st 2007 12:01pm by Jophiel
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#8 Mar 01 2007 at 12:04 PM Rating: Decent
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It's called ************ politics" because there are much better ways to stick it to the other side and seem magnamious about it rather than coming across as pissy children.


Not and reach voters there isn't.

It's a pandering exercise, dummy, not a rhetorical contest. Oh, as a pointless aside, now that I switched cable companies and get WGN, the election coverage was the funniest thing I've seen in ages.
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Disclaimer:

To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.

#9 Mar 01 2007 at 12:09 PM Rating: Excellent
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Smasharoo wrote:
Not and reach voters there isn't.

It's a pandering exercise, dummy
Oh, of course. To reach the rank-and-file idiot voters who still read the page three politics stories in the paper. Got me there Smiley: dubious
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#10 Mar 01 2007 at 12:14 PM Rating: Decent
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Oh, of course. To reach the rank-and-file idiot voters who still read the page three politics stories in the paper.


Not every attempt to spin something into a story that pervades the collective conciouslessness succeeds.
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Disclaimer:

To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.

#11 Mar 01 2007 at 12:48 PM Rating: Excellent
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Well, duh! That's why they needed to listen to me!

Try and keep up Smiley: grin
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#12 Mar 02 2007 at 7:52 AM Rating: Decent
Atomicflea wrote:
Smasharoo wrote:


The whole "We had to apologize for doing nothing wrong so now you do too even though it was nothing to apologize for" deal is pretty weak.


It's called 'politics'.
True. At the end of the day it's a popularity contest, and McCain can't afford to be any less liked by the conservatives on his side of the fence.


Actually if the Senator wants to know where the centerists in the Republican Party stand on the issue, this is a good way to find out. It will also tell him who among the centerists in the Democratic Party might back him. Basically, he is doing a "reverse Lieberman".

#13 Mar 02 2007 at 8:12 AM Rating: Excellent
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I'd say the issue is that McCain is trying to suck up to the further Right these days and restore credibility after years of being billed as a maverick who'll break from the Republicans. Stuff like this doesn't help that quest.
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#14 Mar 02 2007 at 8:33 AM Rating: Decent
Jophiel wrote:
I'd say the issue is that McCain is trying to suck up to the further Right these days and restore credibility after years of being billed as a maverick who'll break from the Republicans. Stuff like this doesn't help that quest.


Only if you believe that politics is about what is said.

Problem is, politics is frequently about what hasn't been said, or can't be said.

I know a lot of people across the liberal-conservative spectrum who are fed up with party extremists. Most of these people aren't politically active, but do contribute and do vote. They want people in DC who represent Middle Class Middle America, and I mean that in a good way- good education, lower taxes, SS fixed, an end to frivoulous litigation, a responsible media and a government that can be trusted.

Kudos to Senators McCain and Lieberman for stepping outside party boundaries to test the waters of the real mainstream.
#15 Mar 02 2007 at 8:51 AM Rating: Excellent
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LordSpamalot wrote:
Only if you believe that politics is about what is said.

Problem is, politics is frequently about what hasn't been said, or can't be said.

I know a lot of people across the liberal-conservative spectrum who are fed up with party extremists.
Sure. Everyone says they want a 'moderate' guy. Apparently McCain doesn't believe that hype because he's been working hard to re-establish credibility with the Right. I'm not going to hit you with a bunch of links, but Google something like 'McCain woo conservatives' and see what he's been up to. It hasn't been trying to suck up to the moderates. Particularally for the primaries where most of the voters do feel a stronger party affiliation than the general election voters.

That's the reason why this really raised eyebrows. McCain's been busting his hump to appease the Right only to cut his own standing down with a couple words on Letterman.
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#16 Mar 02 2007 at 9:22 AM Rating: Good
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LordSpamalot wrote:
Kudos to Senators McCain and Lieberman for stepping outside party boundaries to test the waters of the real mainstream.
The mainstream won't get them elected. Lieberman proved what the mainstream will do for you. Sadly, the mainstream are a bunch of opinionated folks who will do a lot of complaining, but not much fundraising/voting.
#17 Mar 02 2007 at 9:34 AM Rating: Decent
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I know a lot of people across the liberal-conservative spectrum who are fed up with party extremists.


Me too. None of them vote in primaries or give money.


Shame they'll never have any impact at all on the political process.

____________________________
Disclaimer:

To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.

#18 Mar 02 2007 at 9:52 AM Rating: Decent
Jophiel wrote:
Sure. Everyone says they want a 'moderate' guy. Apparently McCain doesn't believe that hype because he's been working hard to re-establish credibility with the Right. I'm not going to hit you with a bunch of links, but Google something like 'McCain woo conservatives' and see what he's been up to. It hasn't been trying to suck up to the moderates. Particularally for the primaries where most of the voters do feel a stronger party affiliation than the general election voters.

That's the reason why this really raised eyebrows. McCain's been busting his hump to appease the Right only to cut his own standing down with a couple words on Letterman.


Of course he's wooing the conservatives in the Republican Party, and stepping out on Iraq is him opening the door to wooing conservative liberals who may be questioning the hard left's commitment to party and populace. If that door get's shut, it will be because Democrats jump all over him for co-opting their position and compromising their ability to win the independent, undecided and moderate voters.

There really isn't a Republican Party or Democratic Party anymore. The Republicans have been replaced by a cabal of NeoCons who rely on fear-mongering to steer votes their way. The Dems are at best federation of disparate factions (is that redundant?), and at worst, reactionaries whose primary political position is that they aren't fear-mongering NeoCons.

Politics is not a position of absolutes. Politics is as dynamic a system as any. A politician who want to succeed has to be willing to step to the right or the left as needed, or else fall prey to the Ann Coulter/Ted Kennedy syndrome.

As far as any party affiliation affinity (wtf?), round these parts (that being the Great State of Cheeze), during primaries you are required to vote the candidates representing a particular political party, on the grounds that it keeps people from crossing party lines and voting for an opposing candidate that can't possibly win. As such, regardless of any statistical or polling models to the contrary, primaries may well be meaning less is what people really want.

FWIW, I'm neither Republican or Democrat. I believe too deeply in the words
Quote:
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. --That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness,"
to give allegance to anyone who would sell my rights for a 5 point bump in the polls.
#19 Mar 02 2007 at 10:25 AM Rating: Decent
Atomicflea wrote:
Sadly, the mainstream are a bunch of opinionated folks who will do a lot of complaining, but not much fundraising/voting.


Smasharoo wrote:
Shame they'll never have any impact at all on the political process.


All the more reason for those of us who do recognize the price of complacency to stand up-

Quote:
"If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you and may posterity forget that ye were once our countrymen."

Samuel Adams
#20 Mar 02 2007 at 10:46 AM Rating: Good
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LordSpamalot wrote:
All the more reason for those of us who do recognize the price of complacency to stand up
..and what? I'm not saying centrist isn't a fine thing to be, but it's like being a member of the Green party. You're holding to an ideal, and it's noble, but you're on the fringe and your actions have no real impact.

Edited, Mar 2nd 2007 12:46pm by Atomicflea
#21 Mar 02 2007 at 11:37 AM Rating: Decent
Atomicflea wrote:
LordSpamalot wrote:
All the more reason for those of us who do recognize the price of complacency to stand up
..and what? I'm not saying centrist isn't a fine thing to be, but it's like being a member of the Green party. You're holding to an ideal, and it's noble, but you're on the fringe and your actions have no real impact.


It's not noble, it's self serving, and to say it has no impact is to fail recognize that being self serving is the key to understanding politics. The failure of governments is typically the failure of the "ruling class" to place the wants of it's constituents before it's own. "Of the People, by the People, for the People" was a self serving statement on the part of the founders of the United States, one which they reiterated in the Tenth Amendment- The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

And as to your perception that people like myself aren't having an impact, all is not lost:

http://www.lp.org/fp/article_470.shtml
#22 Mar 02 2007 at 12:12 PM Rating: Good
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LordSpamalot wrote:
Atomicflea wrote:
LordSpamalot wrote:
All the more reason for those of us who do recognize the price of complacency to stand up
..and what? I'm not saying centrist isn't a fine thing to be, but it's like being a member of the Green party. You're holding to an ideal, and it's noble, but you're on the fringe and your actions have no real impact.


That's exactly what The Man wants us to believe!


FTFY.

#23 Mar 02 2007 at 12:24 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
"Of the People, by the People, for the People" was a self serving statement on the part of the founders of the United States,


Er, no.
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#24 Mar 02 2007 at 12:24 PM Rating: Decent
Celcio wrote:
LordSpamalot wrote:
Atomicflea wrote:
LordSpamalot wrote:
All the more reason for those of us who do recognize the price of complacency to stand up
..and what? I'm not saying centrist isn't a fine thing to be, but it's like being a member of the Green party. You're holding to an ideal, and it's noble, but you're on the fringe and your actions have no real impact.


That's exactly what The Man wants us to believe!


FTFY.



I thought Flea was a woman?
#25 Mar 02 2007 at 12:27 PM Rating: Decent
Samira wrote:
Quote:
"Of the People, by the People, for the People" was a self serving statement on the part of the founders of the United States,


Er, no.


Umm, yes.
#26 Mar 02 2007 at 12:36 PM Rating: Excellent
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LordSpamalot wrote:
Samira wrote:
Quote:
"Of the People, by the People, for the People" was a self serving statement on the part of the founders of the United States,


Er, no.


Umm, yes.


Lincoln was not a founder. So, no.
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In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

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