You wanna know what pisses me off?Follow

It's not an obsession. It's precisely because I have something to do, and I worked hard and put myself through school for it, that I want and demand equal pay. If you're willing to put up with less pay, so be it, that's your perogative to be lazy and lay down and take what you're given, but I didn't get to where I am in life by putting up with the status quo. I realize that may intimidate you, but you need to quit projecting your insecurities onto women who are simply more fulfilled as people.

Maybe you need something to do, like a hobby.

Edited, Dec 21st 2006 11:12am by Atomicflea

I have never been a fan of the "keep them bare-foot, pregnant and in the kitchen" ideology. I mean come on; they should at least have slippers on. Don't want them cutting their feet if they drop something and tracking blood all over the house.

Yeah, yeah, late to the party here. Damned need for sleep.

Totem, I refuse to respond to. He's a bigot, an all around ******* and he's just playing enfant provocateur. No pun intended. Not worth my effort, because there's simply no reasoning with someone who has no interest in being remotely reasonable.



You, whoever you are, are a complete idiot.

Line up a babysitter? You do realize that most daycares refuse to take sick kids for the health and well-being of the rest of the children. Ever tried finding a babysitter at 7 AM on a weekday morning? Unless you've got retired relatives in the vicinity, good luck.

It boggles the mind. For all our "family values" so often prattled about by politicians, this country is one of the least family-friendly countries in the world. We rank with Swaziland and Papua New Guinea in our stance on paid family leave, despite the mountains of research emumerating the health and psychosocial benefits to children who are reared by their parents through infancy, not to mention the increased productivity, employee retention and decreased training costs to employers who offer their employees more flexibility to spend time with their families.

Take this exerpt from The Motherhood Manifesto as an example of the impossible position we put parents in, and then have the gall to call them lazy or deadbeats for wanting a better option.



Honestly, Totem, bubspeed and the rest of you slack-jawed Neanderthal idiots should be ashamed of yourselves.






Edited, Dec 21st 2006 2:01pm by Ambrya

Nothing says rational discourse quite like "manifesto"

I don't completely agree with Totem.

That being said. Women make less than men in the same positions because their priorities are generally not in the same place. Keep in mind we're not talking about specific people here, but in general, and it's not a consious decision to pay them less. There are women who make more than man in the same position.

Now lets examine this. Each year most people get an evaluation that determines their salary increase.

Men have a few things going for them here. They tend to put work as their first priority, they take less time off, they work more hours, they don't sit and chat as much, they concentrate on the task at hand. Most importantly, they are less likely to accept a lower salary, they are more aggressive with their employers and more impulsive. Employers have to be careful with men because they are more likely to quit out of spite if they are not treated well. Men also have less conscience than women, they're more willing to bend rules (lie) for their employers and are less likely to hesitate when questionable practices are required.

Women are more socially driven. Their priorities lean towards keeping people happy, making them comfortable, they are less likely to argue with their boss, more likely to stay home to handle a personal issue, tend to have more personal issues, more likely to spend time chatting and arguing with coworkers. Women tend to be better in organizational positions than men, they do well in jobs requiring multitasking like Receptionists which are low education low pay jobs that most employers would hire a female for. Females are easier to approach, less threatening, eager to please (eager might be a strong word, more likely to be kind might fit better). The BIGGEST problem is women tend bring their personal life to work more so than men.

Bottom line is women make less than men because their reviews tend to provide smaller raises (for the reasons above), and they are more likely to accept these smaller raises.

Men value physical/work accomplishments, women value social accomplishments. Social accomplishments are not compatible with most high paying jobs and the need for people to like you makes you easier to manipulate/less likely to ***** to your boss about lower pay.

Another thing to consider. Men live in a King of the Hill social heirarchy, they work better when one person is in charge and follow a chain of command everyone knows who's important and focus their attention on that person. Women have a more dynamic social heirarchy, they are constantly juggling for the top spot the important person changes on a regular basis based on their current social status. Basically men kiss the bosses ***, women spread their *** kissing amongst everyone and therefore have less *** kissing for the boss who gives them their raise every year.

Let's say this, then. We give everybody in the workforce a gender test, and anyone that skews female (some men will) gets paid less because we assume they are less productive and the 'female' traits (like empathy and creativity) don't benefit companies in any way. You don't think that's discriminatory?



Edited, Dec 21st 2006 1:20pm by Atomicflea

He was talking about typical behavior. Behavior, job performance, and seniority should be the only factors considered in a person's salary. Yoda's theory (and I'm not saying it's valid) is that behavior likely to garner a lower salary is more prevalent among women.

Basing salary off some kind of gender test would be ridiculous. Basing salary off the actual performance of each individual worker is completely fair.

I agree. Hop to, Hop Sing.

"Honestly, Totem, bubspeed and the rest of you slack-jawed Neanderthal idiots should be ashamed of yourselves."
____________________________________________________________________________


I am perfectly fine with continuing to take it up the *** while my female co-workers call in sick to care for their little pursuits of happiness. It's happened so often that I don't even need lube anymore. Just dig your feet in and continue to do the job of 2, sometimes 3 people during school season. Afterall, if its really that bad then why don't I look for another job.... Shame on me..

If it's that bad, you need to talk to your management. You're obviously understaffed.

Good to see you making sense.