Im only linking this 'cos no-one else has yet.
Some of us already know that this is whats happening. And some of us don't or wont believe it. As usual it will be put down by some as, variously flawed, 'political', or simply lies.
El Presidente has already said that does not consider the report credible, and that the methodology used is "pretty well discredited."
Well, just for a change I agree with him. Yup. Its fucking incredible!
Its incredible that with monthly figures like these in the capital city alone, that anyone, anyone at all, has the balls to defend these murdering SOB's.
Whats going on in Iraq (and if these fuckers get their way, Iran) is nothing less than genocide.
Every day bodies are turning up in there scores. For what? so that the good and great US of A, can be shown 'not to back down in the face of terrorism'?
Not content with trashing the country and killing its people in the thousands, using ever changing excuses and motives(GFY Gbaji), every one of wich has been shown to be a bare faced lie.
The same people want to do the same to Iran. Not that any of them have ever been to Iran, you understand. But because they reckon, in their imeasurable wisdom that Iran is a threat to America.
Bollox!
The biggest threat, the biggest bully, and the (this is the scary part) most able and willing regime (able and willing that is to attack, invade and kill) in the world at the moment is the Republican party of America. Aided and abetted by the democrats and the press especially The Weekly Standard, Fox News, National Review, CNN, and the Wall Street Journal editorial, with their ineffectual whining about sex scandals, and downright cheerleading for this atrocity that is happening in Iraq.
For goodness sake, for the good of all of us (especially the rest of the world out here who can only be angry from a distance), I hope, hope, hope that some time soon, very soon, the good and honest people of america, of wich the vast majority of you are, will wake up, blink, look around and say 'enough! FFS. enough killing, enough slaughter, enough war. Its time to try something new'.
This mindless killing has got to stop. And soon.
Its de-humanizing all of us.
/rant off.
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"If you have selfish, ignorant citizens, you're gonna get selfish, ignorant leaders". Carlin.
I had a very nice meatball sandwich for dinner.
I know for a fact that Aishwaria doesn't date meat-eaters.
And your point?
And your point?
"If you have selfish, ignorant citizens, you're gonna get selfish, ignorant leaders". Carlin.
Her name is Aishwarya.
And if you believe you have any shot at dating her you're as delusional as you are moronic.
And if you believe you have any shot at dating her you're as delusional as you are moronic.
Dont wanna date her.
I already got me an Indian Princess. wich is sorta how I knew who she was...
I already got me an Indian Princess. wich is sorta how I knew who she was...
"If you have selfish, ignorant citizens, you're gonna get selfish, ignorant leaders". Carlin.
I don't want to stop the war. My gas is cheap now.
So, paulsol, what you're saying is I'm a terrorist? Huh.
Totem
Totem
I agree it's insane. Completely insane. To put in perspective, its the equivalent of 215 9/11 over 3 years.
Even if the figures are not accurate, anyone with the slightest interest in foreign affairs will notice on page 34 of any newspaper that between 30-50 Iraqi die every day of attaks. And thats only the ones reported.
Having said all that... Most of these deaths are caused by the civil war between Shias and Sunnis. Now, this bring up a whole new issue about the responsability of the US as an occupying force to maintain peace and security in the country. But still, a lot of these deaths are not from US soldiers shooting Iraqis.
It is still sickening. It's easy for us to look and say "Yeah, sucks". We don't even understand what 600,000 deaths really mean. Those numbers are so high, they are meaningless. And, since most of us have never been to Iraq, they are just numbers. And thats for those of us without a hatred for Mulsims. For the others, they'll probably come out with comments like "they deserve it, the savages."
But 99.9% of those people killed had nothing to do with 9/11. Nothing to do with the "war on terror", nothing to do with oil, nothing to do with Al-Qaeda. Their only mistake was to be born at this time, in that country.
And thats not even taking into account all the friends and families of those that died.
So that's the ongoing human tragedy. We can label it "genocide", "civil war", whatever. It doesnt really matter.
Everyday that goes by shows how much of a mistake this invasion was. It's even worse than most could've predicted. For all those people in Iraq, this invasion either ended their lives, or ruined it. And what did they do to deserve this? Absolutely nothing.
If we selfishly bring that discussion back to us, and think about it means, it's also quite scary. We have a whole generation of terrorist being given the greatest training possible. Not only in terms of technical and practical expertise, but also in terms of grieviances. Because don't be so naive as to think they wont blame the West for it. While we discuss how to apportion the blame between the terrorists, the resistance, the army, the innocents, they have already made their minds up. It's the occupying force.
One day, the US will leave Iraq. And Iraq will come back to some form of normality. Well, "relative normality", at least.
But once those trained and experienced terrorists are done in Iraq... What are they gonna do? Where will they apply their "expertise" and "years of practical training"? Who, for them is the ennemy?
A sobering thought if there ever was one.
Even if the figures are not accurate, anyone with the slightest interest in foreign affairs will notice on page 34 of any newspaper that between 30-50 Iraqi die every day of attaks. And thats only the ones reported.
Having said all that... Most of these deaths are caused by the civil war between Shias and Sunnis. Now, this bring up a whole new issue about the responsability of the US as an occupying force to maintain peace and security in the country. But still, a lot of these deaths are not from US soldiers shooting Iraqis.
It is still sickening. It's easy for us to look and say "Yeah, sucks". We don't even understand what 600,000 deaths really mean. Those numbers are so high, they are meaningless. And, since most of us have never been to Iraq, they are just numbers. And thats for those of us without a hatred for Mulsims. For the others, they'll probably come out with comments like "they deserve it, the savages."
But 99.9% of those people killed had nothing to do with 9/11. Nothing to do with the "war on terror", nothing to do with oil, nothing to do with Al-Qaeda. Their only mistake was to be born at this time, in that country.
And thats not even taking into account all the friends and families of those that died.
So that's the ongoing human tragedy. We can label it "genocide", "civil war", whatever. It doesnt really matter.
Everyday that goes by shows how much of a mistake this invasion was. It's even worse than most could've predicted. For all those people in Iraq, this invasion either ended their lives, or ruined it. And what did they do to deserve this? Absolutely nothing.
If we selfishly bring that discussion back to us, and think about it means, it's also quite scary. We have a whole generation of terrorist being given the greatest training possible. Not only in terms of technical and practical expertise, but also in terms of grieviances. Because don't be so naive as to think they wont blame the West for it. While we discuss how to apportion the blame between the terrorists, the resistance, the army, the innocents, they have already made their minds up. It's the occupying force.
One day, the US will leave Iraq. And Iraq will come back to some form of normality. Well, "relative normality", at least.
But once those trained and experienced terrorists are done in Iraq... What are they gonna do? Where will they apply their "expertise" and "years of practical training"? Who, for them is the ennemy?
A sobering thought if there ever was one.
Quote:
So, paulsol, what you're saying is I'm a terrorist? Huh.
No not really. but you do seem to spend a lot o' time thinking about your wang......
"If you have selfish, ignorant citizens, you're gonna get selfish, ignorant leaders". Carlin.
paulsol the Flatulent wrote:
Whats going on in Iraq (and if these fuckers get their way, Iran) is nothing less than genocide.
BWAHAHAHAHA! You fUcking tool.
So where exactly are the tits and bums? Or were you referring to the body parts strewn about Iraq? I still think it's false advertisement.
RedPhoenixxxxxx wrote:
It is still sickening. It's easy for us to look and say "Yeah, sucks". We don't even understand what 600,000 deaths really mean. Those numbers are so high, they are meaningless.
Quote:
But 99.9% of those people killed had nothing to do with 9/11. Nothing to do with the "war on terror", nothing to do with oil, nothing to do with Al-Qaeda. Their only mistake was to be born at this time, in that country.
Quote:
But once those trained and experienced terrorists are done in Iraq... What are they gonna do? Where will they apply their "expertise" and "years of practical training"? Who, for them is the ennemy?
You know, I wasn't in favor of the Iraqi Invasion to begin with, but I'm also not down with the reckless propaganda you're spewing. True, some crimes have been committed by senseless people, but by and large, most of these kids are just taking orders and doing what they are ordered to do. I think calling them murderers, and calling what they're doing genocide, is a stupid soundbyte that does more to rally people against your point than exclaim at the brilliance of your logic.
In short, you're a tool. If you want people to pay attention to you, just wear a hat or something.
Edited, Oct 12th 2006 at 7:40am PDT by Atomicflea
In short, you're a tool. If you want people to pay attention to you, just wear a hat or something.
Edited, Oct 12th 2006 at 7:40am PDT by Atomicflea
ahem
It is the responsiblility of the citizens of a nation to overthrow their governemnt if their government is abusing them. All this crap about saving the Iraqi people from the brutal dictator is crap. we didn't do it for that; that was just a convienient bi-product that is useful for PR.
It is the responsiblility of the citizens of a nation to overthrow their governemnt if their government is abusing them. All this crap about saving the Iraqi people from the brutal dictator is crap. we didn't do it for that; that was just a convienient bi-product that is useful for PR.
Kelvyquayo wrote:
ahem
It is the responsiblility of the citizens of a nation to overthrow their governemnt if their government is abusing them. All this crap about saving the Iraqi people from the brutal dictator is crap. we didn't do it for that; that was just a convienient bi-product that is useful for PR.
It is the responsiblility of the citizens of a nation to overthrow their governemnt if their government is abusing them. All this crap about saving the Iraqi people from the brutal dictator is crap. we didn't do it for that; that was just a convienient bi-product that is useful for PR.
I agree. I'm not saying it's necessarily a justification for outsiders invading Iraq.
However, Saddam wasn't making any friends with the Western world and was only interested in his own power and wealth. That's not doing his people any favors, and it obviously put them at great risk in the end. And, like you said, it's the people's responsibility to remove such a dictatorship from power.
Quote:
Bush isn't making any friends in the World and is only interested in his own power and wealth. That's not doing his people any favors, and it obviously put them at great risk in the end. And, like you said, it's the people's responsibility to remove such a President from power.
A link because I like linking.
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
I'm starting to feel sorry for ole' Dub.
Edited, Oct 12th 2006 at 7:52am PDT by Kelvyquayo
Edited, Oct 12th 2006 at 7:52am PDT by Kelvyquayo
Kelvyquayo wrote:
Quote:
Bush isn't making any friends in the World and is only interested in his own power and wealth. That's not doing his people any favors, and it obviously put them at great risk in the end. And, like you said, it's the people's responsibility to remove such a President from power.
Yeah yeah.... Bush is a dictator, he's evil and greedy, America is doomed, blah blah blah.....
I wouldn't call him a dictator; or evil really... and greedy; well that's just another word for ambitious.
I just hate humanity as a whole.
I just hate humanity as a whole.
Jawbox wrote:
Bush is a dictator, he's evil and greedy, America is doomed
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
Jophiel wrote:
Jawbox wrote:
Bush is a dictator, he's evil and greedy, America is doomed
Damn. I must be slipping. It was so obvious!
All I'M saying is; all those crazy brown-people countries that think that Americans are a bunch of greedy capitalists that have no respect for other cultures and are only "in it" for their own gain...
are right.
It's true. Everything we do is for the bettering of our country's prosperity. We used Iraq against Iran wehn they wouldn't play by our rules.. We go to war with Iraq because they wouldn't play by our rules.. We demonize Iran because they won't play by our rules. We refer to Muslim leaders as "nutjobs" openly... Most Americans that I know would rejoice in the nuking of the Middle East and the destruction of Islam..
So again; how is that any different from brownies chanting "death to America" in the streets?
are right.
It's true. Everything we do is for the bettering of our country's prosperity. We used Iraq against Iran wehn they wouldn't play by our rules.. We go to war with Iraq because they wouldn't play by our rules.. We demonize Iran because they won't play by our rules. We refer to Muslim leaders as "nutjobs" openly... Most Americans that I know would rejoice in the nuking of the Middle East and the destruction of Islam..
So again; how is that any different from brownies chanting "death to America" in the streets?
Jawbox wrote:
That's because 600,000 is probably way off. So yeah it's kind of a meaningless number.
I don't know man, Lancet doesn't really have a political agenda. And I think I'd trust them more than... anyone else who hasnt conducted a study on the subject, no?
Quote:
I would say another mistake of theirs was to allow a brutal dictator to rule their country for decades.
What does that have to do with anything? They didn't ask to be "liberated".
Quote:
Their enemy will still be us, just like before we occupied Iraq.
Yes. Thats what I was implying.
Look, I don't agree US troops have commited genocide or anything. I think Flea is right when she says it's just kids following orders. No doubt about that. I don't even blame the troops themselves, if anything I feel sorry for them being thrown into the closest thing resembling hell on this planet.
Denying the horrors and tragedy going there, however, that is not cool. Saying "well, they shouldnt have had a dictator" is quite disgraceful.
I didn't think this thread was about America, but about the Iraqi people.
puasol, this is weak.
If it was 650,000 civilians, killed by U.S. troops, maybe I'd listen.
All that leaving now would do is increase the deaths.
We've made our bed, what's done is done. Now we have to defend it.
If it was 650,000 civilians, killed by U.S. troops, maybe I'd listen.
All that leaving now would do is increase the deaths.
We've made our bed, what's done is done. Now we have to defend it.
RedPhoenixxxxxx wrote:
Jawbox wrote:
That's because 600,000 is probably way off. So yeah it's kind of a meaningless number.
Quote:
Denying the horrors and tragedy going there, however, that is not cool. Saying "well, they shouldnt have had a dictator" is quite disgraceful.
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