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#27 Sep 27 2006 at 9:11 AM Rating: Decent
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BloodwolfeX wrote:
Jawbox wrote:
Is there a way to copy-and-paste the invasion of Afghanistan and the ousting of the Taliban?

That would be the same Taliban that's moving back in right?

We'll see. Try, and try again. (Or should we just give up?)

Taking them out once is still better than taking them out not-at-all. Don't you think?

#28 Sep 27 2006 at 9:13 AM Rating: Decent
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fenderputy wrote:
Jawbox wrote:
Is there a way to copy-and-paste the invasion of Afghanistan and the ousting of the Taliban?


You combat BUSH not doing a damn thing before 9/11 by convincing yourself he did something after?

Is that what I did? Smiley: confused
#29 Sep 27 2006 at 9:30 AM Rating: Default
Don't worry, in two years a democrat will be in office and all the worlds problems will go away. And if they don't, then they can just blame Bush for all the problems that they can't or won't fix. Hell, the way I figure it, they could blame Bush for a good 15 years to come if they want...there's always a way to tie it all back, truth or no truth.

What really needs to be done to save the world is a big festival in a field somewhere, with lots of bands and the like. That's the only thing that works after all. We should probably have a giant meditation session while we're there to, ya know, ta get the good vibes up into the atmosphere.


#30 Sep 27 2006 at 9:34 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
What really needs to be done to save the world is a big festival in a field somewhere, with lots of bands and the like. That's the only thing that works after all. We should probably have a giant meditation session while we're there to, ya know, ta get the good vibes up into the atmosphere.



Smiley: lol nice


Like Pat Robertson's prayers for conservative Supreme Court Justices and Bush's "Pray the Vote" campaign.

Smiley: lol nice


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#31 Sep 27 2006 at 9:49 AM Rating: Default
Kelvyquayo wrote:
Quote:
What really needs to be done to save the world is a big festival in a field somewhere, with lots of bands and the like. That's the only thing that works after all. We should probably have a giant meditation session while we're there to, ya know, ta get the good vibes up into the atmosphere.



Smiley: lol nice


Like Pat Robertson's prayers for conservative Supreme Court Justices and Bush's "Pray the Vote" campaign.

Smiley: lol nice


Hey, I didn't say that there aren't people who believe in fairies on both sides of the isle. I'm tired of most people in all honesty. As far as the real cool-aid libs go, I'm all for negotiating and all that jazz. I say we go for it, trust Iran and let them develop whatever. Work out a deal with them like we did with North Korea, maybe they'll be different...seriously, I don't care if they are or not anyway.

Iraq? Want to bring everyone home? Go for it...don't much care about that either. I don't think it's the right thing to do, but I'm starting to get worried that some of you are going to start treating our soldiers like you did in Vietnam, and I don't think I could stomach that. Plus, doing jail time after killing one of you at an airport while the troops unload would suck. Besides, if the fights coming, it's coming...so if I'm right it's either now or later, and I'm fine with either (or neither).

And on the right side, I think certain people need to learn a bit more tact. Resolve doesn't seem to be a problem in many areas, and that's good. But a poker face is good too until the time comes, and I think that's lacking at the moment.

Oh, and sex scandals. The right needs to have some good sex scandals. Doesn't have to be with adultery involved, just some young right winger who bangs a couple of hookers then proudly states "Hell yeah I banged those ******** Sex ain't a crime baby!". I think that might help the public image too (sadly).

All in all though. F U (and your mom). Viva mi pantelones!

#32 Sep 27 2006 at 9:53 AM Rating: Decent
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xtremereign wrote:


What really needs to be done to save the world is a big festival in a field somewhere, with lots of bands and the like. That's the only thing that works after all. We should probably have a giant meditation session while we're there to, ya know, ta get the good vibes up into the atmosphere.


Wouldn't work. The Muslims and Christians would clash when G.W-ya requests "Koom-by-ya".
#33 Sep 27 2006 at 9:53 AM Rating: Default
Kelvyquayo wrote:
Quote:
What really needs to be done to save the world is a big festival in a field somewhere, with lots of bands and the like. That's the only thing that works after all. We should probably have a giant meditation session while we're there to, ya know, ta get the good vibes up into the atmosphere.



Smiley: lol nice


Like Pat Robertson's prayers for conservative Supreme Court Justices and Bush's "Pray the Vote" campaign.

Smiley: lol nice


Hey, I didn't say that there aren't people who believe in fairies on both sides of the isle. I'm tired of most people in all honesty. As far as the real cool-aid libs go, I'm all for negotiating and all that jazz. I say we go for it, trust Iran and let them develop whatever. Work out a deal with them like we did with North Korea, maybe they'll be different...seriously, I don't care if they are or not anyway.

Iraq? Want to bring everyone home? Go for it...don't much care about that either. I don't think it's the right thing to do, but I'm starting to get worried that some of you are going to start treating our soldiers like you did in Vietnam, and I don't think I could stomach that. Plus, doing jail time after killing one of you at an airport while the troops unload would suck. Besides, if the fights coming, it's coming...so if I'm right it's either now or later, and I'm fine with either (or neither).

And on the right side, I think certain people need to learn a bit more tact. Resolve doesn't seem to be a problem in many areas, and that's good. But a poker face is good too until the time comes, and I think that's lacking at the moment.

Oh, and sex scandals. The right needs to have some good sex scandals. Doesn't have to be with adultery involved, just some young right winger who bangs a couple of hookers then proudly states "Hell yeah I banged those ******** Sex ain't a crime baby!". I think that might help the public image too (sadly).

All in all though. F U (and your mom). Viva mi pantelones!
#34 Sep 27 2006 at 2:41 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
Plus, doing jail time after killing one of you at an airport while the troops unload would suck.



are you saying that were "we" to start treating troops like people did after VietNam you would stalk one of us to an airport and kill us? Smiley: confused

or are you actually in the military yourself?

waht are you saying? waht is the point of your existance here?

do you know?
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#35 Sep 27 2006 at 6:22 PM Rating: Default
Kelvyquayo wrote:
Quote:
Plus, doing jail time after killing one of you at an airport while the troops unload would suck.



are you saying that were "we" to start treating troops like people did after VietNam you would stalk one of us to an airport and kill us? Smiley: confused

or are you actually in the military yourself?

waht are you saying? waht is the point of your existance here?

do you know?


Nope not in the military. I'm just saying that if I were at the airport to welcome our troops home from hell, and try to make them feel good about being home, and ran into jack asses talkin trash, fists would fly. Obviously I'm not going to murder anyone, as much as I might enjoy it. Most of these guys are just kids, or were when they left. Showing support for them when they come home could make the difference when it comes to their mental stability down the line. They shouldn't be the targets of petty impotent hatred regardless. And that's what most of those people are, impotent...able to do nothing more but help chip away at a poor guys sanity. Nice.

My existence is just about as pointless as yours, but not quite.

ed. Took out a reference to throwing tomatoes, to easy to misdirect the arguement with...and I'm to lazy to deal with that crap

Edited, Sep 27th 2006 at 7:32pm PDT by xtremereign
#36 Sep 27 2006 at 6:40 PM Rating: Good
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and where do you see anyone bashing our troops?
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#37 Sep 27 2006 at 6:42 PM Rating: Good
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'I hope our troops die, those chicken sh'its.'

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#38 Sep 27 2006 at 6:59 PM Rating: Default
I never said I saw it occuring, I just said I had a feeling we were getting close. It also wasn't anything but a partial reasoning to why I don't care if we have a full withdrawl at this point. If it were to happen, and the things I believe are wrong, then I live in peace and have to say I was wrong. If I'm right, then things continue to escalate and we continue fighting the war again in a few years if that, and I hate to say I was right.

I have family members who are loonies, too. Not to mention my girls family. Some of them have gotten better, but the things that others of them can say about our troops is scary. It's like they just completely dehumanize them. Hell, there are plenty of people out there now who think the troops are all "robots" just following orders. They're not robots, they're people...and saying they're morons, or desperate, or had no other choice, is a cop out. On the other side of my family, I have cousins who volunteered, and they are smart, kind kids.

Anyway, if it doesn't ever happen, then who cares? I mean I'm not just going to go get violent for no reason, I'm a real laid back guy. I mean, if it was happening, are you saying you would be standing with the offenders instead of in front of our soldiers? What's the point of your existence?
#39 Sep 27 2006 at 7:01 PM Rating: Excellent
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Fücking communists. Smiley: oyvey
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#40 Sep 27 2006 at 7:03 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
of them can say about our troops is scary. It's like they just completely dehumanize them. Hell, there are plenty of people out there now who think the troops are all "robots" just following orders. They're not robots, they're people...and saying they're morons, or desperate, or had no other choice, is a cop out. On the other side of my family, I have cousins who volunteered, and they are smart, kind kids.

Anyway, if it doesn't ever happen, then who cares? I mean I'm not just going to go get violent for no reason, I'm a real laid back guy. I mean, if it was happening, are you saying you would be standing with the offenders instead of in front of our soldiers? What's the point of your existence?




the point of my existence is to inform you that you are a robot.
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#41 Sep 27 2006 at 7:03 PM Rating: Default
Demea the Irrelevant wrote:
Fücking communists. Smiley: oyvey


Yay boobs.
#42 Sep 27 2006 at 7:05 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
if it was happening, are you saying you would be standing with the offenders instead of in front of our soldiers?



wehn the hell did I say that?

t(-,-t) up yours , buddy!




Quote:
Recent Visitors, 2: Kelvyquayo, xtremereign


cyb0rz?

Edited, Sep 27th 2006 at 8:18pm PDT by Kelvyquayo
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#43 Sep 27 2006 at 7:14 PM Rating: Default
Kelvyquayo wrote:
Quote:
if it was happening, are you saying you would be standing with the offenders instead of in front of our soldiers?



wehn the hell did I say that?

t(-,-t) up yours , buddy!


I didn't say you did say it, I was asking you if that is what you were getting at. You seemed very perturbed by the whole concept of me possibly defending the troops coming home off planes. You specifically took that out of my post, and referenced it. I did not do that, you did that. Since you continued to fight me on it, I was asking you if you were saying the above. I was not stating you had said it.

However...

Quote:
and where do you see anyone bashing our troops?


When did I say that I did?
#44 Sep 27 2006 at 8:27 PM Rating: Decent
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Wow. Not only did you not see this for the BS it is, but you actually think it's brilliant? Amazing...

Quote:
The Bush Administration did not try to get Osama bin Laden before 9/11.


The Bush administration had 8 months. By the time they got there OBL was already hiding out in Afghanistan and protected by the Taliban.

Quote:
The Bush Administration ignored all the evidence gathered by its predecessors.


Ignored? What evidence? The same evidence was available during the Clinton administration. In fact, the decisions as to what to do with those pieces of evidence were made during his administration. It's not like the FBI and CIA were handling "evidence" about OBL as top priority before Bush took office and suddenly stopped when he arrived.

Quote:
The Bush Administration did not understand the Daily Briefing entitled "Bin Laden Determined To Strike in U.S."


They understood it perfectly. There wasn't enough information there to take any sort of action though. Saying "There might be an attack and it might involve planes" is not exactly actionable. As opposed to, say... "Hey! There's OBL right there in Sudan for anyone to deal with as they wish...".

Quote:
The Bush Administration did not try.


Didn't try what? Run around like chickens with their heads chopped off because there was some guy that Clinton mentioned a whole bunch but didn't apparently take very seriously (not enough to even mention him in the security report his administration passed on to the Bush administration) wandering around somewhere and he might do something someday? Um... What were they supposed to do?


Quote:
Moreover, for the last five years one month and two weeks, the current administration, and in particular the President, has been given the greatest “pass” for incompetence and malfeasance in American history!


Ok. Let's measure incompetance. Clinton ignored the WTC bombing, treating it as a purely criminal matter even after it became apparent that it was part of a broader series of attacks. He ignored the attack in Saudi Arabia, even after OBL took credit for it and told him that it was aimed at the US and part of an attack on the US. He reacted to embassy bombings in Africa by dropping a handful of bombs nowhere near where OBL was. He failed to pursue the matter *at all* after that point. When the US Cole was hit, he did nothing because apparently, despite OBL telling him in two fatwas that he was behind all of these attacks and that his organization would keep attacking him, the CIA and FBI didn't certify that he was involved in anything against the US? Huh!?

Clinton put no boots on the ground in Afghanistan. He expended zero effort to gain any intelligence in the country or even in the region. What little effort was spent was not continued in any actual effort to take out OBL (despite what Clinton claims). Clinton apparently prefered using airstrikes on large targets rather then actually going after OBL himself. I can only assume because he wouldn't have been able to put images of a predator drone taking out OBL in a precise strike on the evening news and using it for media manipulation. Big airstrikes on buildings make for great news though...

That's not incompetance, but apparently, coming into office at the tail end of all of this, and failing to completely change the approach to OBL and prevent attacks which had already been planned and were already in operation prior to Bush taking office is "incompetance".

Wow. Biased a bit? Yeah. I think so...

Quote:
President Roosevelt was rightly blamed for ignoring the warning signs—some of them, 17 years old—before Pearl Harbor.


President Roosevelt was in office for the entire time period that these warnings arose. I'm pretty sure that if all those warning signs appeared between 1935 and 1940, and he took office in 1941, most people would have blamed the previous administration and not him.

Quote:
President Hoover was correctly blamed for—if not the Great Depression itself—then the disastrous economic steps he took in the immediate aftermath of the Stock Market Crash.


Sure. Because they were decisions he made in reaction to an event that occured while he was in office. Again. Had the crash and poor economic decisions occured before he was in office, he would not be blamed for the economic problems experienced after the fact.

Quote:
Even President Lincoln assumed some measure of responsibility for the Civil War—though talk of Southern secession had begun as early as 1832.
But not this president.


Of course. Because he choose to engage in warfare to resolve the situation. You can't blame him for the secession attempt, but you can blame him for the war itself. He could have chosen differently. He didn't. Bush didn't make any decision that caused 9/11 to happen. That attack was already in progress before he took office.

Quote:
To hear him bleat and whine and bully at nearly every opportunity, one would think someone else had been president on September 11th, 2001 -- or the nearly eight months that preceded it.


Or the 8 years before that? Hehe.



Look. While you can certainly place some blame on Bush for not preventing 9/11 (it did happen on his watch so to speak), you absolutely must place the blame on Clinton for the attack happening in the first place. When he took office, OBL was not planning any attacks against the US. When he took office, Al-qaeda was still relatively inactive. When the time frame for Iraq to comply with the terms of the cease fire agreement came and went (during Clinton's first year in office), Clinton made the decision to keep giving Iraq more time and too keep troops in Saudi Arabia to enforce the inspections and no-fly zones. That decision was the triggering point that led OBL to activate Al-qaeda and turn it towards the US. Period.

The 9/11 attack occured 100% as the result of Clinton's foreign policy. That's just an inescapable historical fact. OBL had no plans to attack the US prior to Clinton taking office. As a direct result of Clinton's decisions, he conducted a "war" against the US, which resulted in a series of increasingly violent attacks, culminating in the 9/11 attacks. Clinton must bear the brunt of the responsiblity for that attack as a result.

Again. You can blame Bush for not preventing the attack, but he would not have needed to if Clinton hadn't screwed up his foreign policy so badly.
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#45 Sep 27 2006 at 8:44 PM Rating: Good
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just keepin you on your toes!
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#46 Sep 27 2006 at 10:00 PM Rating: Excellent
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Kelvyquayo wrote:
Quote:
of them can say about our troops is scary. It's like they just completely dehumanize them. Hell, there are plenty of people out there now who think the troops are all "robots" just following orders. They're not robots, they're people...and saying they're morons, or desperate, or had no other choice, is a cop out. On the other side of my family, I have cousins who volunteered, and they are smart, kind kids.

Anyway, if it doesn't ever happen, then who cares? I mean I'm not just going to go get violent for no reason, I'm a real laid back guy. I mean, if it was happening, are you saying you would be standing with the offenders instead of in front of our soldiers? What's the point of your existence?




the point of my existence is to inform you that you are a robot.

You are not a unique and special snowflake. You are made of the same biodegradable compost as the rest of humanity. You will never amount to anything.

The first rule of Fight Club is you do not talk about Fight Club.
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