I guess the question that it comes down to is this, is it man influenced, or is it cycle influenced?
Personally, I think it's just a cycle.
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Quote:
I guess the question that it comes down to is this, is it man influenced, or is it cycle influenced?
As a Librarian, I'd have to go with both.
Cycle influenced however means that there is something unnatural going on.... I'd just go with a Cycle, period. The influence IS the cycle.
Man infuenced... well.... perhaps we may be speeding it along.....
After all.. they have been finding evidence that even prehistoric humans may have effected the climate by burning down forests for game and such things...
either way, here is a clear cut case where WE will need to adapt to the environment and not the otherway around.
Jophiel wrote:
Debalic wrote:
Really? That's weird. You mean Australians and New Zealanders use maps that indicate South on top? Should they use upside-down globes?
Well, I'll be damned. I should have suspected tomfoolery like this.
publiusvarus wrote:
we all know liberals are well adjusted american citizens who only want what's best for society. While conservatives are evil money grubbing scum who only want to sh*t on the little man and rob the world of its resources.
Kelvyquayo wrote:
i really just think that it's a natural occurance... Like Winter seens all horrible and evil.. it really just a cycle of nature...
in that sense; it's just the Earth growing and changing.... I don't think that there is much we can do about it... Maybe we are accelerating the process .. maybe not... it doesn't really matter... whether it's my great-grandkids or my great-great-great grandkids that are going to have to deal with it..
Things have changed like this before and will change again.. regardless of how hard we try to fence nature in.. it will always get loose.
in that sense; it's just the Earth growing and changing.... I don't think that there is much we can do about it... Maybe we are accelerating the process .. maybe not... it doesn't really matter... whether it's my great-grandkids or my great-great-great grandkids that are going to have to deal with it..
Things have changed like this before and will change again.. regardless of how hard we try to fence nature in.. it will always get loose.
Winter seems horrible and evil... psshhhh, at least there's snowboarding. The only downside to winter is that it's too short =) but seriously, I agree with the fencing in nature comment. I really don't think it's all us. I also however, doubt that we have no play in it. Either way, we can work to prevent further damage and that's about it. Nature will do what it does. Humans cannot hope to control everything. Haha, I suppose we do like playing God though...
Kelvyquayo wrote:
personally, I don't care waht's causing it. The fact that there IS an "Thing" is the fun part.
I hope Kurt Russel is still around to save the day.
Lord Darkuwa wrote:
Were either going to be flooded a la waterworld, or have another ice age.
Jeeze, I hope not... Both those movies sucked...
Quote:
Winter seems horrible and evil... psshhhh
Winter is the season of DEATH, jjeeezzee, call yourself Druid?
either way, I think our only chance is for Steven Hawking to get off his *** and invent WARP DRIVE!
magedruid wrote:
but seriously, I agree with the fencing in nature comment. I really don't think it's all us. I also however, doubt that we have no play in it. Either way, we can work to prevent further damage and that's about it. Nature will do what it does. Humans cannot hope to control everything. Haha, I suppose we do like playing God though...
Well sure, we can inhabit extreme environments and push back coastlines, but every once in awhile a volcano, earthquake, twenty-foot high wall of water or mile-thick sheet of ice will come along and show us who's been around for four billion years, and why.
publiusvarus wrote:
we all know liberals are well adjusted american citizens who only want what's best for society. While conservatives are evil money grubbing scum who only want to sh*t on the little man and rob the world of its resources.
Kelvyquayo wrote:
either way, I think our only chance is for Steven Hawking to get off his *** and invent WARP DRIVE!
He'd have to perfect neurobionics first.
publiusvarus wrote:
we all know liberals are well adjusted american citizens who only want what's best for society. While conservatives are evil money grubbing scum who only want to sh*t on the little man and rob the world of its resources.
Kelvyquayo wrote:
As a Librarian,
Libras play into everything m'dear. 
and why not!? we are the only non-animal on the whole damn zodiac!
and why not!? we are the only non-animal on the whole damn zodiac!
The Glorious Atomicflea wrote:
Kelvyquayo wrote:
As a Librarian,
Kelvyquayo wrote:
Libras play into everything m'dear.
and why not!? we are the only non-animal on the whole damn zodiac!
and why not!? we are the only non-animal on the whole damn zodiac!
Here I thought Kelvy was trying to say he was like this guy.
Elderon the Wise wrote:
Here I thought Kelvy was trying to say he was like this guy.
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
Good news Elderon the claims mean absolutely jack crap.
Hence you have Russians in the Australian zone, drilling into a sub-artic lake that has been closed for 400,000 years and the Australian government can't do anything about it. So you get there and grab what you can!
Hence you have Russians in the Australian zone, drilling into a sub-artic lake that has been closed for 400,000 years and the Australian government can't do anything about it. So you get there and grab what you can!
I believe global warming is real. This is a really good video which goes over both sides of the argument.
Here's a chart from NASA showing global surface temperatures over the last 100 years or so. I know 100 years is a really short period when dealing when cyclical climatic changes, but so far I believe that the data so far is showing that the temperature of the Earth is rising at a much greater rate than in previous cycles. Also there is a lot of carbon being released into the atmosphere which I believe is contributing to the warming of the planet.
I know some skeptics say that carbon dioxide isn't a cause of global warming because CO2 levels have historically risen and fallen in the past. I don't really like this chart, but it was the first one I found detailing the rise in carbon dioxide emissions over the last 400,000 years. It demonstrates that the amount of CO2 being released into the atmosphere has significantly increased since the industrial revolution - more so than any other period in the past.
There is a lot of data out there dealing with climate changes and global warming . The international scientific community agrees that something needs to be done about global warming. We just need to get off our asses and do something about it.
Here's a chart from NASA showing global surface temperatures over the last 100 years or so. I know 100 years is a really short period when dealing when cyclical climatic changes, but so far I believe that the data so far is showing that the temperature of the Earth is rising at a much greater rate than in previous cycles. Also there is a lot of carbon being released into the atmosphere which I believe is contributing to the warming of the planet.
I know some skeptics say that carbon dioxide isn't a cause of global warming because CO2 levels have historically risen and fallen in the past. I don't really like this chart, but it was the first one I found detailing the rise in carbon dioxide emissions over the last 400,000 years. It demonstrates that the amount of CO2 being released into the atmosphere has significantly increased since the industrial revolution - more so than any other period in the past.
There is a lot of data out there dealing with climate changes and global warming . The international scientific community agrees that something needs to be done about global warming. We just need to get off our asses and do something about it.
I posted elsewhere how the other day, when it was 110 here, my neighbor blamed global warming and said how we were ruining the planet. I asked him if he was trading in his gas-hog 'Vette for a Prius, and he stared at me like I was from the moon.
About 15 years ago the chicken littles were proclaiming we were on the verge of an "ice age." In the early 1970s the CIA - the CIA mind you - put out a study that said the world had at most 20 more years of oil.
Surface temp charts - to go back over 100 years you tend to have to stick to certain measuring stations - i.e. the ones that have been daily measuring temps for 100 years. Okay, most of these stations are not out in the boondocks - or if they were, they aren't now - towns and cities have been growing. Why is this significant?
Urban warming. UW causes a "bubble" or dome of hotter-than-normal air around the town or city because roads, walls and etc. tend to store solar heat and then release it at night - keeping the area a few degrees warmer than normal. So, even though the above poster gave us a scary-looking Nasa chart - it doesn't necessarily mean anything. Has UW been ruled out? I couldn't tell.
I've read a number of people who say that atmospheric warming is not consistent w/ so-called surface warming, which may indicate we're not cooking as badly as we feared. While ice sheets are retreating, they're consistent w/ whalers' reports of ice sheet locations during a warming trend from about 300 years ago, if an article I read is not lying.
That's the big "if". The whole issue is tainted by politics, and you can't trust anyone. You can't trust info saying global warming is natural and isn't so bad because "greedy, short-sighted Big Oil" may have paid for it. You can't trust info saying it's caused by CO2 and that it's awful and that WE MUST DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT NOW because "whack-job Greenies" may have paid for it.
I know a famous science fiction writer who used to work for NASA and has been a consultant to various gov't, space program and DoD efforts for many years. He says it's so bad now that you can't get a grant from the gov't to do climate research unless you basically spell out how you're going to support global warming in your request - i.e. you must be prejudiced. To get private money from oil co's - which he doesn't talk about - the same is true. But the sci fi guy does insist he's never seen such a tainted and UNscientific "climate" before in his life. That I fear is true.
About 15 years ago the chicken littles were proclaiming we were on the verge of an "ice age." In the early 1970s the CIA - the CIA mind you - put out a study that said the world had at most 20 more years of oil.
Surface temp charts - to go back over 100 years you tend to have to stick to certain measuring stations - i.e. the ones that have been daily measuring temps for 100 years. Okay, most of these stations are not out in the boondocks - or if they were, they aren't now - towns and cities have been growing. Why is this significant?
Urban warming. UW causes a "bubble" or dome of hotter-than-normal air around the town or city because roads, walls and etc. tend to store solar heat and then release it at night - keeping the area a few degrees warmer than normal. So, even though the above poster gave us a scary-looking Nasa chart - it doesn't necessarily mean anything. Has UW been ruled out? I couldn't tell.
I've read a number of people who say that atmospheric warming is not consistent w/ so-called surface warming, which may indicate we're not cooking as badly as we feared. While ice sheets are retreating, they're consistent w/ whalers' reports of ice sheet locations during a warming trend from about 300 years ago, if an article I read is not lying.
That's the big "if". The whole issue is tainted by politics, and you can't trust anyone. You can't trust info saying global warming is natural and isn't so bad because "greedy, short-sighted Big Oil" may have paid for it. You can't trust info saying it's caused by CO2 and that it's awful and that WE MUST DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT NOW because "whack-job Greenies" may have paid for it.
I know a famous science fiction writer who used to work for NASA and has been a consultant to various gov't, space program and DoD efforts for many years. He says it's so bad now that you can't get a grant from the gov't to do climate research unless you basically spell out how you're going to support global warming in your request - i.e. you must be prejudiced. To get private money from oil co's - which he doesn't talk about - the same is true. But the sci fi guy does insist he's never seen such a tainted and UNscientific "climate" before in his life. That I fear is true.
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