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Why would you leave a gun where a little kid can get it?Follow

#27 Jan 24 2006 at 2:46 PM Rating: Good
Wow, why does everyone always miss the point. Smiley: oyvey

Guns are NOT dangerous. They never were, nor will they ever be. It's the bullets that are lethal. Sh[/b]it, you could give a box of real guns to the toddlers to run around and point at each other.. as long as none are LOADED.

I have no problem with gun collecting or showcasing. Just make bullets illegal and everyone wins.

You disagree? Just remember that a .22 calabre gun can be made out of a metal pen casing. Should we ban metal pen casings? No. It's all about the ammo.

That all being said, who the f[b]
uck would leave ammo in reach of a child, in a gun or otherwise? That is f[b][/b]ucking retarded. Leaving live ammo around is just asking for the kid to lose an eye or kill themself. If he threw the bullet accross the room and it hit a hard object, there is a good chance that someone could have been injured or killed. No gun required.
#28 Jan 24 2006 at 3:08 PM Rating: Excellent
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^^^ /liberal rant Oh No! Guess I should Make Jonwin get rid of the amnmo he has in the closet! /Liberal Rant off

Actually it's for when he goes to Single Action Tournaments with a friend. He borrow a gun from his friend, but since the ammo is costly get his own. Even with a gun safe I would have been worry about having guns around my youngest. There were times, I thought of getting a safe to lock up my kitchen knives from her, but then she would have just thought of some other way to kill herself, just so she could stay out of school.

Thankfully she stop threatening to kill herself when she moved out and got her GED. Since her boyfriend is from Texas, I expect her to have her own handgun within a few years.
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This Post is written in Elnese, If it was an actual Post, it would make sense.
#29 Jan 24 2006 at 3:11 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
As I said before, better the blame to be placed on the parents then to be placed on the weapon itself. I for one own several guns and have never shot anyone. I'm not going to shoot anyone either. Why should my gun and my person be held responsible for some asshats lack of ability to keep track of their kids or their guns. Like Katie said, responsible parents should have guns in safe places, out of reach of children. Jesus Christo ... jump the gun lately?
Missing the point 101. read what i f*cking wrote.

I have a problem with the fact that faced with a horrific incident like this your first thought is not the safety of the child or the best way to prevent it happening again.

Oh no the Average American first of all looks for who to blame and how much they can get out of said person.

liability n (plural liabilities)
1. law obligation under the law: legal responsibility for something, especially costs or damages
2. debt: anything for which somebody is responsible, especially a debt

Encarta ® World English Dictionary © & (P) 1998-2004 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.


Edited, Tue Jan 24 15:21:16 2006 by tarv
#30 Jan 24 2006 at 3:11 PM Rating: Good
ElneClare wrote:
Actually it's for when he goes to Single Action Tournaments with a friend. He borrow a gun from his friend, but since the ammo is costly get his own.


I keep my ammo in a safe. Guns are kept in separate, locked metal cabinets in the "gun room". Ammo never meets gun until I am ready to discharge the firearm. It's much safer that way.
#31 Jan 24 2006 at 3:21 PM Rating: Good
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Wrong.

look up the stats or even the word Exponentially punchy.

How is that wrong? The existence of guns doesn't make everything more dangerous it's how they are used. By the logic used that the more guns there are the less safe it is you could argue the same point for automobiles. A car is not inherently dangerous, but when you have some fuc[/b]knut driving three sheets to the wind the wrong way up an onramp that object is probably a danger to someone. The same car sitting in the middle of a Wal-Mart parking lot? Not so much.

2002(most recent stats I could find) there were ~44 thousand automobile related deaths compared to total of ~29 thousand(of which ~17 thousand were suicide) firearm related deaths(CDC).

Quote:
I pity you if you need a gun for your family's safety...
I don't know where the hell you live that you aren't the least bit concerned. I trust you have cops hanging around your house all the time watching out just in case? Or maybe your Allakhazam and you'll just roundhouse kick anyone that looks at you funny?

No need to pity me, save it for someone who gives a sh[b]
it. I'll just be laughing to myself when some whack job breaks into your house and starts stuffing his wang into the hole he just put in your chest. Hope he makes your kids watch it too.

Quote:
If you come across a rabid animal, and you have enough time to aim your rifle at it and shoot it, it hasn't seen you yet and you obviously have enough time to just turn around and walk away.

The only rabid animal I've seen was a racoon outside my friends old house after it attacked his dog. When we came up on it, it backed up to a wood pile and ran off before we could shoot it.

It's not just rabies though, any animal with the ability to cause harm to a human should concern you. Violent dogs, escaped zoo animals, bears, mountain lions, aligators, etc. can all put a serious damnper on your life expectancy.
#32 Jan 24 2006 at 3:24 PM Rating: Decent
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tarv of the Seven Seas wrote:
Quote:
As I said before, better the blame to be placed on the parents then to be placed on the weapon itself. I for one own several guns and have never shot anyone. I'm not going to shoot anyone either. Why should my gun and my person be held responsible for some asshats lack of ability to keep track of their kids or their guns. Like Katie said, responsible parents should have guns in safe places, out of reach of children. Jesus Christo ... jump the gun lately?
Missing the point 101. read what i f*cking wrote.

I have a problem with the fact that faced with a horrific incident like this your first thought is not the safety of the child or the best way to prevent it happening again.

Oh no the Average American first of all looks for who to blame and how much they can get out of said person.


I don't need to think about the safety of the child, nor do I have to think about how to prevent it from happening again when I know why it occurred in the first place. THE PARENTS ARE IDIOTS!

Not to mention that this isn’t the first time that I have thought about, or talked about this topic. Like the OP said. These stories aren’t uncommon. Your assumption that passing the blame to be my first thought is retarded. It may have been what I posted, by my first though, hardly. Your generalization is as annoying as your assumption.

You want my honest opinion of how to solve such issues? Make parents take a test before they can reproduce. Then pass more laws making parents liable for their children’s actions instead of blaming music, television, video games and guns.

Following this logic we should make **** illegal because it affects a rapists mind. We should also make alcohol illegal because people die from drunk driving accidents all the time.

Edited, Tue Jan 24 15:34:14 2006 by fenderputy
#33 Jan 24 2006 at 3:30 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
I have a problem with the fact that faced with a horrific incident like this your first thought is not the safety of the child or the best way to prevent it happening again.


Just my Smiley: twocents, but is a child's safety not the greatest of a parent's responsibilities? The best way to prevent similar situations from happening again: Parents not being douche bags and leaving loaded guns within access to children.

I'm not a parent, but I'm not an idiot either. I don't care who's to blame, but I do care who's responsible for allowing this atrocity to ever occur since it's not a difficult thing to prevent.
#34 Jan 24 2006 at 3:37 PM Rating: Decent
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How is that wrong? The existence of guns doesn't make everything more dangerous it's how they are used.
Jesus f*cking chris how thick is this guy?

Ok here is is laid out in simple f*cking terms on the off chance your three underused brain cells are close enought together so that they can have a group hug and work together on this one.

The more guns there are (with me so far? more guns ok) the more deaths per 100 guns per year.

So if there is 10000 guns availible in a city of 1,000,000 Vs a city with 30000 guns in the 1,000,000 population instead of the no of deaths increasing by a factor of 3 it is more like a factor of 8 or higher and then when you have 50000 guns instead of a factor of 5 its a factor of 20 and so on.

It is not deaths per % population it is deaths per gun that increases exponentially

It is also true that restricting the type of weapons effects the no of deaths per 100 guns with the largest leap in DpHG (deaths per hundred guns) being when Handguns are not availible.

Would you like me to explain the exponential increase in DpHG in relation to total number of weapons again or have you got it?
#35 Jan 24 2006 at 3:44 PM Rating: Good
Gurue
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The reason why so many people get killed with guns is because we no longer get out on the battlefield ala Braveheart and whack heads and limbs off with axes anymore.

There's gotta be a release some way...


my point is that people are violent and it doesn't matter what the method is, we will find a way to kill each other.
#36 Jan 24 2006 at 3:47 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
I don't need to think about the safety of the child, nor do I have to think about how to prevent it from happening again when I know why it occurred in the first place. THE PARENTS ARE IDIOTS!

Not to mention that this isn’t the first time that I have thought about, or talked about this topic. Like the OP said. These stories aren’t uncommon. Your assumption that passing the blame to be my first thought is retarded. It may have been what I posted, by my first though, hardly. Your generalization is as annoying as your assumption.

You want my honest opinion of how to solve such issues? Make parents take a test before they can reproduce. Then pass more laws making parents liable for their children’s actions instead of blaming music, television, video games and guns.

Following this logic we should make **** illegal because it affects a rapists mind. We should also make alcohol illegal because people die from drunk driving accidents all the time.
Missing the point again Fender, it about "Blame society" it's about people looking to make a quick buck instead of addressing the issue.

It's about Paramedics being too scared to treat people while off duty incase they get sued.

It's about patients taking doctors to court for trying to save life.

It's about thinking about sueing the parents instead of looking after the child.

It's coming over to the UK and it pisses me off, the "Injury Lawyers for you" adverts asking for people to sue the company because they fell off a ladder or because they tripped over a flagstone when wearing 6 inch stilletto's.
#37 Jan 24 2006 at 3:50 PM Rating: Good
tarv of the Seven Seas wrote:

So if there is 10000 guns availible in a city of 1,000,000 Vs a city with 30000 guns in the 1,000,000 population instead of the no of deaths increasing by a factor of 3 it is more like a factor of 8 or higher and then when you have 50000 guns instead of a factor of 5 its a factor of 20 and so on.


30,000 guns, no bullets = no death.

Just sayin' Smiley: lol
#38 Jan 24 2006 at 4:06 PM Rating: Excellent
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Oh no the Average American first of all looks for who to blame and how much they can get out of said person.


I'm not sure that's the reaction of the average American. I know a lot of people who have been in situations where they could have brought a suit due to injury or grievance, and didn't. On the other hand I don't personally know anyone who has brought such a suit, aside from a workman's comp claim.

At any rate - only a fool would argue that a loaded gun is a safe item to have accessible to a child. However, in terms of fatalities, swimming pools are far more dangerous to children under age 11. More fun facts courtesy of Freakonomics!
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#39 Jan 24 2006 at 4:15 PM Rating: Decent
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tarv wrote:
Missing the point again Fender, it about "Blame society" it's about people looking to make a quick buck instead of addressing the issue.

It's about Paramedics being too scared to treat people while off duty incase they get sued.

It's about patients taking doctors to court for trying to save life.

It's about thinking about sueing the parents instead of looking after the child.

It's coming over to the UK and it pisses me off, the "Injury Lawyers for you" adverts asking for people to sue the company because they fell off a ladder or because they tripped over a flagstone when wearing 6 inch stilletto's.


Yes, but you made the wrongful assumption that I fit into this category. You also then generalized an entire country around that assumption.
#40 Jan 24 2006 at 4:35 PM Rating: Good
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Katie the Deathwisher wrote:
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Then again I'm paranoid like that and had a hot wire around my fence and all my windows nailed shut.


Katie, Bob forbid it should happen, but the middle of the night, when your house is going up in flames very, very quickly, it will be safe to assume you will be fairly groggy amidst the confusion. You will not have time to find blankets, smash windows, and undo screens in such an emergency situation.

You've made quite a nice little death trap for you and your family. You'll never make it out alive. When the firemen, fire investigators and insurance investigators discover the nailed windows and your charred corpses, they will be as boggled by this as much as I am. Smiley: yikes

Others here will attribute it to Darwinism.

The Glorious AtomicFlea wrote:
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In short, I blame Jophiel.


That's usually the best course of action, in just about any situation. Smiley: tongue

Jacobdeception the Whackjob wrote:
Quote:
I'll just be laughing to myself when some whack job breaks into your house and starts stuffing his wang into the hole he just put in your chest. Hope he makes your kids watch it too.

...It's not just rabies though, any animal with the ability to cause harm to a human should concern you. Violent dogs, escaped zoo animals, bears, mountain lions, aligators, etc. can all put a serious damnper on your life expectancy.


Jumpin' Jeebus on a pogo stick, Jacob - you need to shoot out some more airholes in your bunker, bud.

Mistress Nadenu wrote:
Quote:
The reason why so many people get killed with guns is because we no longer get out on the battlefield ala Braveheart and whack heads and limbs off with axes anymore.

There's gotta be a release some way...


I've got this spiffy little battle axe that I keep right next to my bed. Woe unto the ************ who tries to break into my house.Smiley: mad

ElneClare wrote:
Quote:
Since her boyfriend is from Texas, I expect her to have her own handgun within a few years.

You're Katie's mom?! Better talk to her about those nailed windows! Smiley: grin
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#41 Jan 24 2006 at 4:41 PM Rating: Decent
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Elderon wrote:
0,000 guns, no bullets = no death.

Just sayin' icon


Meh, there are probably a lot of corpses who were pistol whipped that would beg to differ ...

1911 Colt 45's are freakin heavy, as are Desert Eagles, and any other numerous models. That's not even breaking into the rifle section.


These lines were brought forth for small comedic (**** poor) purposes only, anyone taking this too seriously, should shoot themselves now...
#42 Jan 24 2006 at 4:44 PM Rating: Excellent
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Samira wrote:
At any rate - only a fool would argue that a loaded gun is a safe item to have accessible to a child. However, in terms of fatalities, swimming pools are far more dangerous to children under age 11. More fun facts courtesy of Freakonomics!
Sounds like a refined version of Gbaji's claim that most deaths in the home are caused by swimming pools.

Did the book give an actual source and numbers for swimming pool deaths? Going off the CDC reports for unintentional deaths and its own claim that only 10% of drowning deaths occur in swimming pools, that'd be (in 2002) a total of 77 swimming pool drownings and 60 gunshot fatalities for ages 1-14 (they lump ages 10-14 together). Granted, I don't know how that 10% drowning number spreads across age ranges but 17 additional deaths seems a bit under the realm of "far more". I suppose that, by percentages, it's a ~25% increase which sounds better when trying to make a point.

Anyway, I've been unable to find an actual listing of swimming pool related drownings, much less by age so I was hoping the book came annotated. It could be that there was a 99.996% swimming pool involvement rate in drownings age 1-14 for all I know.
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#43 Jan 24 2006 at 4:44 PM Rating: Good
Kronig wrote:
Meh, there are probably a lot of corpses who were pistol whipped that would beg to differ ...
That would still be categorized under 'death by blunt instrument' as oppsed to a gun death, which is really, death by projectile which have very little to do with the gun itself.

I had already considered the pistol whipping angle and decided it wasn't funny enough to mention.

Again, just sayin'
#44 Jan 24 2006 at 4:46 PM Rating: Decent
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Elderon wrote:
I had already considered the pistol whipping angle and decided it wasn't funny enough to mention.



Di[sm][/sm]ck!


#45 Jan 24 2006 at 4:59 PM Rating: Default
Quote:
Meh, there are probably a lot of corpses who were pistol whipped that would beg to differ ...

1911 Colt 45's are freakin heavy, as are Desert Eagles, and any other numerous models. That's not even breaking into the rifle section.


Uhm, if you're going to buy a gun to start hitting people with it, you might as well just get a damn sword. Or a knife. You know, more conventional close quarters weapons.
#46 Jan 24 2006 at 5:04 PM Rating: Good
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Katie wrote:
Windows break Flea m'dear. A blanket over the broken glass and I'm out.

Couldn't the burglars/rapists/vikings break in just as easily, windows nailed shut or not?






Edited, Tue Jan 24 17:06:12 2006 by trickybeck
#47 Jan 24 2006 at 5:14 PM Rating: Excellent
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Jophiel wrote:
Samira wrote:
At any rate - only a fool would argue that a loaded gun is a safe item to have accessible to a child. However, in terms of fatalities, swimming pools are far more dangerous to children under age 11. More fun facts courtesy of Freakonomics!
Sounds like a refined version of Gbaji's claim that most deaths in the home are caused by swimming pools.

Did the book give an actual source and numbers for swimming pool deaths? Going off the CDC reports for unintentional deaths and its own claim that only 10% of drowning deaths occur in swimming pools, that'd be (in 2002) a total of 77 swimming pool drownings and 60 gunshot fatalities for ages 1-14 (they lump ages 10-14 together). Granted, I don't know how that 10% drowning number spreads across age ranges but 17 additional deaths seems a bit under the realm of "far more". I suppose that, by percentages, it's a ~25% increase which sounds better when trying to make a point.

Anyway, I've been unable to find an actual listing of swimming pool related drownings, much less by age so I was hoping the book came annotated. It could be that there was a 99.996% swimming pool involvement rate in drownings age 1-14 for all I know.


It is annotated, but I don't have it with me to give you the cites.

Don't roll your eyes at ME, young man.
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#48 Jan 24 2006 at 5:17 PM Rating: Decent
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Yes, but you made the wrongful assumption that I fit into this category. You also then generalized an entire country around that assumption.
I make that assumption on words you wrote, so either you fail at written english or you fit into that catagory.

Quote:
I'm just thankfull the parents are liable for situations like these.
Quote:
liability n (plural liabilities)
1. law obligation under the law: legal responsibility for something, especially costs or damages
#49 Jan 24 2006 at 5:20 PM Rating: Excellent
Liberal Conspiracy
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TILT
I'm just curious. Gbaji's claim didn't specify age ranges so using a total of accidental deaths from both sources sufficed for proving him wrong. A narrower bracket leaves more open to details. You can't truthfully say "more people die from swimming pools than gunshots" but you can look at the numbers until you find a range where that's accurate and then present that to prove your point.

I know you know all this -- I just love the sound of my keyboard. In any event, the swimming pool v gunshot comparison is a pretty silly one no matter which side comes out on top.
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#50 Jan 24 2006 at 5:25 PM Rating: Decent
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Tarv wrote:
liability n (plural liabilities)
1. law obligation under the law: legal responsibility for something, especially costs or damages


You are taking it out of context, the especially for cost or damages infers situations where there are cost or damages.

IE your kid wrecks your car into the neighbors house, you would be liable to pay for the repairs/insurance fees.

If you shoot someone in the face and are found liable under the law, that does not mean the other people can automatically sue you because you were found liable, it just means the judiciary system now has rights to your *** and they will go after it.

Liable = fault, not how much I should sue for.



#51 Jan 24 2006 at 5:36 PM Rating: Default
I believe this is another case of lame parenting, which is becomming more and more prevalent these days.

My dad brought home a Colt .45 when I was about 8 yrs old and my brother was 5 yrs old. He sat us down, took the gun apart, showed us how the insides work, and then showed us the bullets. A hollow point and normal jacket, and he compared them to a .22 bullet. After that we went shooting in an isolated area around where we lived at the time. He let us shoot his .22 rifle first and then the .45. I never even wanted to touch that gun again.

Now as an extra precaution, he locked the gun up, but at least we knew what the gun was capable of and why we shouldnt touch it without his supervision. If the parents actually did there job, I would be willing to bet this never would have happened
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