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#1 Jan 11 2006 at 6:24 PM Rating: Good
Ministry of Silly Cnuts
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I found this fascinating:

BBC Online wrote:
Brigadier Nigel Aylwin-Foster said US tactics early in the occupation had alienated Iraqis and exacerbated problems for the coalition.

. . .

In it Brig Aylwin-Foster says American officers displayed such cultural insensitivities that it "arguably amounted to institutional racism" and may have helped spur the insurgency.

. . .

While the army is "indisputably the master of conventional war fighting, it is notably less proficient in... what the US defence community often calls Operations Other Than War," the officer wrote.

Operations to win the peace in Iraq were "weighed down by bureaucracy, a stiflingly hierarchical outlook, predisposition to offensive operations and a sense that duty required all issues to be confronted head on"


Pretty strong stuff, but he claims his motivation was "to be helpful to an institution I greatly respect"

The US Army response was equally interesting.

Obviously, initial hostility:

Quote:
Col Kevin Benson, commander of the US Army's elite School of Advanced Military Studies, said his first reaction was that Brig Aylwin-Foster was "an insufferable British snob".

"Some of this is pretty powerful stuff and it made me a little upset," the colonel told the BBC.


But then an interesting openness:
Quote:
"But sometimes good articles do make you angry. We should publish articles like this. We are in a war and we must always be thinking of how we can improve the way we operate."


Linky

I have to say that this echoes discussions I've had with a recently returned RAF Officer - "Their soldiers are tough as old boots and bloody good fighters, but they'd been given fu[/i]ck-all understanding of their environment."

Sure, some can just write this off as classic British pompousness (we are good at that), but we have vast experience of managing long-term conflict zones in a 'Other Than War' environment. (Aden, Belize, Cyprus, Angola, Northern Ireland etc.)

There's a big difference between a war where your aim is to overcome the enemy and take power, and one where you plan to defeat an opposing aemy but leave the area at peace in the hands of the locals.

Maybe Col. Benson is merely acknowledging that this is something that few US Officers have been subjected to.

Right, back to di[i]
ck and phart jokes
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#2 Jan 11 2006 at 6:45 PM Rating: Excellent
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Probably fair.

We don't travel well, in general.
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#3 Jan 11 2006 at 6:55 PM Rating: Decent
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the nobster wrote:
Operations to win the peace in Iraq were "weighed down by bureaucracy, a stiflingly hierarchical outlook, predisposition to offensive operations and a sense that duty required all issues to be confronted head on"

Well, to be fair, that is pretty much definition of The American Way.
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we all know liberals are well adjusted american citizens who only want what's best for society. While conservatives are evil money grubbing scum who only want to sh*t on the little man and rob the world of its resources.
#4 Jan 11 2006 at 6:57 PM Rating: Good
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Debalic wrote:
the nobster wrote:
Operations to win the peace in Iraq were "weighed down by bureaucracy, a stiflingly hierarchical outlook, predisposition to offensive operations and a sense that duty required all issues to be confronted head on"

Well, to be fair, that is pretty much definition of The American Way.


Smiley: lol

How can you fu[/i]ck up a smiley?!?!!eleven!




[i]Edited, Wed Jan 11 18:58:38 2006 by Nobby
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#5 Jan 11 2006 at 7:14 PM Rating: Good
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Fair as rain..

Where are my di[b][/b]ck and phart jokes?
#6 Jan 11 2006 at 7:25 PM Rating: Good
Well, considering that certain states are STILL ticked off about how they were treated in the latter part of the 19th century post-conflict....I'd say the USA goverment has made a tradition of not giving a damn how the guys who didn't win feel.
#8 Jan 12 2006 at 8:22 AM Rating: Decent
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I can tell you as a sailor in the USN that his portrait of our training in any field other than our immediate function is pretty much dead on. Most of us strive to be the absolute best at what we do, whatever that is, but when it comes to any kind of social convention or proper understanding of a new society or environment, we are useless. You would not believe the kind of conflicts I found myself and my shipmates in because someone couldn't hold their goddam tongue, liquor, or both.
#9 Jan 12 2006 at 5:22 PM Rating: Good
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An interesting response. I spoke to a US gunnery Sar'nt who said the same as Nagafen.

Seems USA's military are awesome at offensive combat in any theater of war, but fu[/i]ck all strategic thinking about the post-combat phase.

So does that mean that Uncle Sam is now totally geared up to be a 19th Century Superpower but in terms of 21st century geo-politics, they're probably fu[i]
cked?

Ironic that 60 years after you helped stop us Limeys having to learn German, you may be the reason we'll all have to learn Chinese and become Moslems.
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#10 Jan 14 2006 at 2:22 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
I can tell you as a sailor in the USN that his portrait of our training in any field other than our immediate function is pretty much dead on. Most of us strive to be the absolute best at what we do, whatever that is, but when it comes to any kind of social convention or proper understanding of a new society or environment, we are useless. You would not believe the kind of conflicts I found myself and my shipmates in because someone couldn't hold their goddam tongue, liquor, or both.
That is also an internal problem that is the main reason why American military actions show a lack of flexiblity when plan A goes to rat shit.

Its a common problem when we are exersicing with American forces... it takes forever to explain changes to them, not sure how much cross training you do either, i can put my hand to all but a couple of the teams in my Fire and repair party post at action stations.

As for the foot in mouth and unable to handle beer aspects that effects us all.

i take over as head of my messdeck (Leading hand of the mess)next week and i am NOT looking forward to it.
#11 Jan 14 2006 at 5:10 PM Rating: Good
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Did anyone else notice this?

By: Debalic
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Go Debalic!
#12 Jan 14 2006 at 5:24 PM Rating: Good
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Yanari, Defender of Justice wrote:
Did anyone else notice this?

By: Debalic
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9992 posts

Go Debalic!

Pppbbbffft! Booooo!

#13 Jan 14 2006 at 5:33 PM Rating: Good
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Get spamming, sister!
#14 Jan 14 2006 at 5:40 PM Rating: Good
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Time to create my own sooper-secret forum where I can play Lasttm until....


Hrm. Wait...
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