- Forums
- Cross Site
- The Asylum
- Save St. Tookie!
Save St. Tookie!Follow
I dont think Tookie should have been executed...i mean prison=correctional facility doesnt it? I seemed to that he had changed his life for the better..they could have atleast gave him life instead of the death sentence...ill never watch a terminator movie again!
ScarrTheGucciGalka wrote:
I dont think Tookie should have been executed...i mean prison=correctional facility doesnt it? I seemed to that he had changed his life for the better..they could have atleast gave him life instead of the death sentence...ill never watch a terminator movie again!
1. Death Row is not exactly a hotbed of rehabilitation.
2. It's fairly simple to behave when there is no alternative.
3. "They" decided 24 years ago that his crimes met the criteria for a sentence of death.
4. I'm sure that breaks the Governor's heart.
In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.
Just out of curiosity, Scarr, by what measure do you believe St. Tookie had changed his life for the better? Mind you, if you answer this, I am going to dig a little deeper into your thought process, because I personally don't see what you apparently do.
Totem
Totem
Governator wrote:
"In this case, the one thing that would be the clearest indication of complete remorse and full redemption is the one thing Williams will not do.''
The man is still trying to play the "I didn't do it" card, yet feels he would somehow be an improvement to society.
I don't understand this argument. I have to wonder if this was his lawyer’s decision, or his own.
Edited, Tue Dec 13 13:19:35 2005 by fenderputy
I mean even if he didnt actually change at least he portrayed a positive image to young black males by writing books and such. Im just kinda against the death sentence cause we all make mistakes. I dont think they should have set the guy free or anything but a life sentence i think would have been a better alternative. At least until he started acting like an idiot again. At least he called for peace between Blood and Crips.
Quote:
I mean even if he didnt actually change at least he portrayed a positive image to young black males by writing books and such. Im just kinda against the death sentence cause we all make mistakes. I dont think they should have set the guy free or anything but a life sentence i think would have been a better alternative. At least until he started acting like an idiot again. At least he called for peace between Blood and Crips.
Where is your bleeding heart for the 4 people he executed with a shotgun or the countless others he killed but wasnt tried for?
Or how about the 1,000's that have had their lives affected by gang violence this reject started 25+ years ago?
What the hell, give em 3 meals a day and free hbo, i'm sure its no different than being dead ...
Edited, Tue Dec 13 13:25:13 2005 by Kronig
He didn't so much "write books" as "allow his name to be used as the author".
He never owned up to or expressed remorse for the four murders he committed.
He laughed at his victims and mocked them after he killed them.
He called one accomplice "pus[u][/u]sy" for being unable to eat after witnessing Williams blowing people away with a shotgun.
He threatened the jury members after his conviction.
He was a disciplinary problem in prison for the first 12 years of his sentence, taking part in several fights and threatening guards on numerous occasions. He allegedly ordered at least one hit from inside prison.
Collaborating on a few books and calling for peace between gangs long after you're a relevant force in the gang culture only goes so far, in my opinion.
He never owned up to or expressed remorse for the four murders he committed.
He laughed at his victims and mocked them after he killed them.
He called one accomplice "pus[u][/u]sy" for being unable to eat after witnessing Williams blowing people away with a shotgun.
He threatened the jury members after his conviction.
He was a disciplinary problem in prison for the first 12 years of his sentence, taking part in several fights and threatening guards on numerous occasions. He allegedly ordered at least one hit from inside prison.
Collaborating on a few books and calling for peace between gangs long after you're a relevant force in the gang culture only goes so far, in my opinion.
In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.
ScarrTheGucciGalka wrote:
I mean even if he didnt actually change at least he portrayed a positive image to young black males by writing books and such. Im just kinda against the death sentence cause we all make mistakes. I dont think they should have set the guy free or anything but a life sentence i think would have been a better alternative. At least until he started acting like an idiot again. At least he called for peace between Blood and Crips.
An easy thing to do when facing death.
I can't believe people think he should be spared because he writes books that point out what would seem to be obvious. Don't kill. Thank fuc[/b]king Bob we have man who can write this in such a way that poor black kids all over will learn this valuable lesson.
Kronig wrote:
Where is your bleeding heart for the 4 people he executed with a shotgun or the countless others he killed but wasnt tried for?
That he *might* have executed. I'm not going to get into the evidence in this case - I assume it is quite damning.
On the topic of the death penalty in general, I always say about the same things:
http://news.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=4&mid=113352919071442016#113355878371441651
and:
In California, we're estimated to be offing one inmate per week via neglegent medical care:
http://www.latimes.com/news/local...-home-local
so although we've only legally killed 13 people since 1978, now a days that's just one "good" summer.
Sure does save on the cost of all those appeals...
You know..you guys are kinda right about this...i think they should change the death sentence though..maybe allow the family to kill him. Also gangs will be around forever so the creation of Crips shouldnt be held against him. I got another question how did Crips spread all the way to Africa lol
Ahh, therein lies the rub. To me those books Tookie wrote are nothing more than a thinly disguised plea for support. While he pays lip service to the idea of children not getting into gangs, it really is his explanation for why he made the Crips in the first place, ie I had no other options available to me, poor me, the gangs were more of a family than the family I had, blah blah.
Rationalizations. Excuses disguised as valid reasons.
Once again, it gets to the heart of the matter when you ask why doesn't he sack up and take responsibility for what he did, good and bad? That he did those murders is not in question. Why he does not specifically apologise for them is. To make a broad "apology" for creating the Crips is the apology which doesn't cost him anything. It's such a pervasive problem that saying he's sorry for his participation in that act becomes more of a group effort via all the others who have recanted their gang allegiance. In other words, it's watered down.
However, to apologise for the specific crime of killing four people to their families demonstrates he understands the pain he has caused them. But by denying them that, even to his death, he cheated not only them of some measure of peace, but himself of the opportunity to continue his supposed crudade against gang life.
Do you see the dichotomy here? If he was genuinely committed to see gang participation end, he would do what is necessary to keep up those efforts for which he is being credited by celebrities.
Totem
Rationalizations. Excuses disguised as valid reasons.
Once again, it gets to the heart of the matter when you ask why doesn't he sack up and take responsibility for what he did, good and bad? That he did those murders is not in question. Why he does not specifically apologise for them is. To make a broad "apology" for creating the Crips is the apology which doesn't cost him anything. It's such a pervasive problem that saying he's sorry for his participation in that act becomes more of a group effort via all the others who have recanted their gang allegiance. In other words, it's watered down.
However, to apologise for the specific crime of killing four people to their families demonstrates he understands the pain he has caused them. But by denying them that, even to his death, he cheated not only them of some measure of peace, but himself of the opportunity to continue his supposed crudade against gang life.
Do you see the dichotomy here? If he was genuinely committed to see gang participation end, he would do what is necessary to keep up those efforts for which he is being credited by celebrities.
Totem
Quote:
You know..you guys are kinda right about this...i think they should change the death sentence though..maybe allow the family to kill him.
We are right though.
Yea i see your point but how the hell did Crips start in California and spread to Africa..thats a big spread..Also why didnt he apolojize..the way Arnold put it, it sounded like Arnold was gonna be a little forgiving if he would have just apolojized. Why didnt St. Tookie just apolojize even though he denies he didnt do it?
Quote:
I got another question how did Crips spread all the way to Africa lol
Immitation is the greatest form of flattery ...
Somehow or someway, people in South Africa heard/saw about the Crips and started following in their footsteps.
Well the article someone posted or I read earlier lead me to believe this, since it said something along those lines.
Posted Earlier in the Thread wrote:
Twenty-five years ago when I created the Crips youth gang with Raymond Lee Washington in South Central Los Angeles, I never imagined Crips membership would one day spread throughout California, would spread to much of the rest of the nation and to cities in South Africa, where Crips copycat gangs have formed.
The simple answer? Stubborn pride. Anything further and I'd have to shrug my shoulders since I do not know him beyond the superficial.
As for Africa, it's the pervasive influence of American culture, and more specifically pop culture which has people everywhere imitating us. Unfortunately, it seems only the awful stuff seems to stick abroad.
:(
Totem
As for Africa, it's the pervasive influence of American culture, and more specifically pop culture which has people everywhere imitating us. Unfortunately, it seems only the awful stuff seems to stick abroad.
:(
Totem
ScarrTheGucciGalka wrote:
Also why didnt he apolojize..the way Arnold put it, it sounded like Arnold was gonna be a little forgiving if he would have just apolojized. Why didnt St. Tookie just apolojize even though he denies he didnt do it?
I was wondering the same thing. Who knows if the Governator would have been forgiving. He could have been saying this to save face. Some people want him spared after all. He didn't apologize because of his denial. One has to be guilty to be appologetic. As said earlier, I wonder if this was his lawyers tactic of his own.
Edited, Tue Dec 13 13:52:39 2005 by fenderputy
Quick answer: he gambled, and lost.
Longer answer: He may have been in denial. He may have felt that he was not solely responsible, and refused to accept any responsibility based on that. He may have been, and done, a lot of things. Hard to know - impossible, now.
My gut feeling is that his lawyers told him to stick to the innocent plea and never waver from it. I'd love to think he'd written a confession - something - to be read in the event of his death; but I assume we'd have heard about it by now.
Longer answer: He may have been in denial. He may have felt that he was not solely responsible, and refused to accept any responsibility based on that. He may have been, and done, a lot of things. Hard to know - impossible, now.
My gut feeling is that his lawyers told him to stick to the innocent plea and never waver from it. I'd love to think he'd written a confession - something - to be read in the event of his death; but I assume we'd have heard about it by now.
In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.
I was thinking the same thing. If that was the case then I'm sure he is pissed at his lawyers. The only downside that I can see to this whole issue is that, in his death we make him a martyr for some.
Someone was going to be martyred, in any event. I'd just as soon have it be the gangbanger felon as his victims.
In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.
Samira wrote:
Someone was going to be martyred, in any event. I'd just as soon have it be the gangbanger felon as his victims.
/agreed
Totem wrote:
I hope you now see, 'Flea, the error of your ways wherein you avoid my threads due to preconceived notions about my ethnic heritage. The topics I bring to light are edifying to everyone, even people who are bigoted towards Walt Disney's Song of the South like yourself.
You are forgiven. Again.
You are forgiven. Again.
As if I'd believe a word you had to say, darkie.
Recent Visitors: 220
All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (220)
- Forums
- Cross Site
- The Asylum
- Save St. Tookie!
© 2024 Fanbyte LLC