All I can really say after being on a conference call for 3 and a half hours, after paging out to on-call support for 90 minutes, which resulted in me waking up 2 senior managers, a VP of Operations and a CIO, and hearing the words "That's not my job." is that there are some very lucky people living in this world today.
Why?
Because I swear to f'ucking Christ if I lived closer than 1000 miles away from those inbred redneck jerkoff sh'itty excuses for IT workers that populate the state of Ohio, I would have gotten off my *** at that moment, driven to each of their houses and blown the f'uckers up.
No offense, Angsty. I am sure you are the one decent IT worker in the entire god foresaken state.
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"That's not my job."Follow
The only reply to "That's not my job" is "Your job is to do what's needed. If you can not or will not do that, you should look for another job. Your choice."
I understand your frustration. I've had people try to pull that crap with me before. When you're a can-do type it really puts sand in your ****** to hear someone lay out that namby pamby excuse for why they didn't or don't want to do something. I'd rather catch you ******** my sister (if I had one, that is) than to hear you say something isn't your job.
It really does make you want to strangle people to hear that sometimes.
If I hear about a string of arsons in Ohio, I'll probably just hum a little tune and smile to myself thinking about how things sometime come home to roost.
I understand your frustration. I've had people try to pull that crap with me before. When you're a can-do type it really puts sand in your ****** to hear someone lay out that namby pamby excuse for why they didn't or don't want to do something. I'd rather catch you ******** my sister (if I had one, that is) than to hear you say something isn't your job.
It really does make you want to strangle people to hear that sometimes.
If I hear about a string of arsons in Ohio, I'll probably just hum a little tune and smile to myself thinking about how things sometime come home to roost.
TStephens wrote:
The only reply to "That's not my job" is "Your job is to do what's needed. If you can not or will not do that, you should look for another job. Your choice."
I understand your frustration. I've had people try to pull that crap with me before. When you're a can-do type it really puts sand in your ****** to hear someone lay out that namby pamby excuse for why they didn't or don't want to do something. I'd rather catch you ******** my sister (if I had one, that is) than to hear you say something isn't your job.
It really does make you want to strangle people to hear that sometimes.
I understand your frustration. I've had people try to pull that crap with me before. When you're a can-do type it really puts sand in your ****** to hear someone lay out that namby pamby excuse for why they didn't or don't want to do something. I'd rather catch you ******** my sister (if I had one, that is) than to hear you say something isn't your job.
It really does make you want to strangle people to hear that sometimes.
Cultural differences. I haven't ever said it, but I have refused to do things outside of my job description. It's a pain in the *** to constantly cover for people who are inept under the heading of "it's good for the company". I'd rather just let them out themselves and for management to hire someone better. Also, some people will say that the culture of America is work and I find that to be true. If I'm not hourly, you have bought me from 8-5, and I'll be damned if I cancel any personal or family plans over work. I only overextend myself if it's an emergency-type situation. I do a damn good job, but I'm not staying all night over something I could do on a weekend in a couple of hours.
Edited, Fri Nov 18 07:07:56 2005 by Atomicflea
The Glorious Atomicflea wrote:
TStephens wrote:
The only reply to "That's not my job" is "Your job is to do what's needed. If you can not or will not do that, you should look for another job. Your choice."
I understand your frustration. I've had people try to pull that crap with me before. When you're a can-do type it really puts sand in your ****** to hear someone lay out that namby pamby excuse for why they didn't or don't want to do something. I'd rather catch you ******** my sister (if I had one, that is) than to hear you say something isn't your job.
It really does make you want to strangle people to hear that sometimes.
I understand your frustration. I've had people try to pull that crap with me before. When you're a can-do type it really puts sand in your ****** to hear someone lay out that namby pamby excuse for why they didn't or don't want to do something. I'd rather catch you ******** my sister (if I had one, that is) than to hear you say something isn't your job.
It really does make you want to strangle people to hear that sometimes.
Cultural differences. I haven't ever said it, but I have refused to do things outside of my job description. It's a pain in the *** to constantly cover for people who are inept under the heading of "it's good for the company". I'd rather just let them out themselves and for management to hire someone better. Also, some people will say that the culture of America is work and I find that to be true. If I'm not hourly, you have bought me from 8-5, and I'll be damned if I cancel any personal or family plans over work. I only overextend myself if it's an emergency-type situation. I do a damn good job, but I'm not staying all night over something I could do on a weekend in a couple of hours.
Edited, Fri Nov 18 07:07:56 2005 by Atomicflea
Believe me when I say I agree with you about it being a cultural difference. I think you hit the nail on the head by saying the culture of America is work.
I also think that one of the basic problems in this country is that we have so many other cultures that conflict with that. There are a great number of people, many of them young and born in this country, who believe they are entitled to a good paycheck and shouldn't have to do anything to earn it. They believe that anything unpalatable could not possibly fall into their own area of responsibility.
I often wonder what the homes of these people look like. Are they also afraid and ashamed to pick up laundry, wash dishes, or scrub a toilet at home?
I tend to always put in the extra mile, but it goes back to how I grew up. The home I grew up in was all about work. You didn't get anything without working for it and work wasn't just about earning a reward, but it was also a badge of pride. I was taught from my youngest days that if a man doesn't have calluses on his hands you probably don't want to trust him because he's making his living without working. I still catch myself when shaking someone's hand doing "the check." Weird, neh?
I used to date this guy like that. He ******* endlessly about it, but he would always be the last person out of the door whenever a project was due. I'm not saying he didn't work hard, but it was a personal choice that he made, so I waved goodbye to him on my way out of the door and knew he wouldn't be home till late, and ignored him when he complained about it. Thing is, it was almost always a "we've known we had this for a week and tommorrow it's due, get it out the door now" type of situation, and he didn't think of any preventative measures that may have saved him this work earlier, or with any subsequent projects. There are people that are hard workers, and then people that just enjoy working close to a deadline and all the pressure it brings. They don't know how else to work unless their blood pressure is through the roof.
You pointed out that some slackers just do as little as possible to get by. I agree. Fire them.I'm not endorsing that point of view. Anyone that is employed is lucky to have a job. If they've forgotten that, it's time for a reminder in the form of a boot out the door.
I for one am glad that America is becoming infused with so many other cultures and that the attitudes about work are becoming slightly more European. I doubt that on our deathbed, any of us will wish for more time at the office.
You pointed out that some slackers just do as little as possible to get by. I agree. Fire them.I'm not endorsing that point of view. Anyone that is employed is lucky to have a job. If they've forgotten that, it's time for a reminder in the form of a boot out the door.
I for one am glad that America is becoming infused with so many other cultures and that the attitudes about work are becoming slightly more European. I doubt that on our deathbed, any of us will wish for more time at the office.
The Glorious Atomicflea wrote:
I doubt that on our deathbed, any of us will wish for more time at the office.
While I agree on an intellectual level, and have been heard to say that I've never seen an armored truck chasing a hearse, it's very hard to embrace a less work oriented outlook. I doubt I'll ever succeed.
I'm an all-or-nothing, it's black or it's white sort of guy, so I'll probably die in the harness. At least I hope so. I'd hate to think that I'd actually retire and sit around idle for a while before kicking the bucket. What a waste.
"That's not my job", or "That's not my problem".
I think these phrases are muttered all to often.
I absolutley HATE hearing either of those phrases. I do 2nd/3rd level software support, and such work with a lot of other teams. All to often I hear these from the Server support team, or the network team and it just instally turns me into a rage filled mangina.
I usually end up calling their boss and telling them about the problem and asking them if they can have the team look at it. It really sucks that I have to overstep the normal communication methods just to get something done, but such is the life of me.
I think these phrases are muttered all to often.
I absolutley HATE hearing either of those phrases. I do 2nd/3rd level software support, and such work with a lot of other teams. All to often I hear these from the Server support team, or the network team and it just instally turns me into a rage filled mangina.
I usually end up calling their boss and telling them about the problem and asking them if they can have the team look at it. It really sucks that I have to overstep the normal communication methods just to get something done, but such is the life of me.
A relative of mine (an elder) refused to learn about computers or how to use them with regards to their position. Their company tried to convince them it was part of the job description but they still refused to learn computer skills or the new company systems. As a direct result they were demoted, took a substantial pay cut and it has hurt their career for good.
Some lessons are hard to learn. "its not my job" is not a valid argument in todays fluid workplaces where a job may morph over time.
Edited, Fri Nov 18 09:33:22 2005 by JennockFV
Some lessons are hard to learn. "its not my job" is not a valid argument in todays fluid workplaces where a job may morph over time.
Edited, Fri Nov 18 09:33:22 2005 by JennockFV
Really it's a pretty situational question. Yeah, I've worked late, weekends, etc for special circumstances. And I've done stuff out of my realm of responsibilities because the situation called for it. But not every time someone comes to you is some life and death, company saving event.
I've learned in the course of my job how to type and format bids and proposals. There's been times when the administrative staff is absent that it's been a Godsend that someone here could quickly get a proposal out the door. But, when they're here, I don't expect to be given typing work just because someone doesn't want to go to the admin assistant with it or thinks she's too busy and he wants it done now. It's not only not my job but it is someone else's job and we pay her to do her job.
I could come up with a dozen other examples but the point is that I have an actual set of job responsibilities I was hired to perform. I'm earning my paycheck by performing those jobs. My postcount and joking aisde, I do a good job of what I'm supposed to be doing. I mentioned before how the company is going to Vegas to celebrate a banner year -- every dollar we made passed over my desk in some form or another before we got the jobs. I'm sure every example presented so far was some catastrophic event where some person's unwillingness to put forth five minutes effort placed the entire company in jeopardy but, ninty-nine out of a hundred, "not my job" from me means "we've hired someone for this and they're down the hall. Go talk to them and let me do the work I was hired to do instead of theirs".
I've learned in the course of my job how to type and format bids and proposals. There's been times when the administrative staff is absent that it's been a Godsend that someone here could quickly get a proposal out the door. But, when they're here, I don't expect to be given typing work just because someone doesn't want to go to the admin assistant with it or thinks she's too busy and he wants it done now. It's not only not my job but it is someone else's job and we pay her to do her job.
I could come up with a dozen other examples but the point is that I have an actual set of job responsibilities I was hired to perform. I'm earning my paycheck by performing those jobs. My postcount and joking aisde, I do a good job of what I'm supposed to be doing. I mentioned before how the company is going to Vegas to celebrate a banner year -- every dollar we made passed over my desk in some form or another before we got the jobs. I'm sure every example presented so far was some catastrophic event where some person's unwillingness to put forth five minutes effort placed the entire company in jeopardy but, ninty-nine out of a hundred, "not my job" from me means "we've hired someone for this and they're down the hall. Go talk to them and let me do the work I was hired to do instead of theirs".
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
Quote:
If one of my people said "that's not my job" and failed to find the person whose job it was, they would be doubley right; it wouldn't be their job anymore and they wouldn't have a job anymore.
You must be a joy to work for. So some droolsucking douche nugget calls me up at 3 in the morning babbling on about a system I've never even heard of, let alone am on call for. Not only do I have to find out what that system does, but who supports it, in the middle of the night or I lose my job?
You know who's job it is? It's the original knuckle dragger who called me in the middle of night's job to find the right person to call to address the problem, and further more he should have done that quite a while before the actual system blew up.
Nicroll 65 Assassin
Teltorid 52 Druid
Aude Sapere
Oh hell camp me all you want f**kers. I own this site and thus I own you. - Allakhazam
Teltorid 52 Druid
Aude Sapere
Oh hell camp me all you want f**kers. I own this site and thus I own you. - Allakhazam
Quote:
You must be a joy to work for. So some droolsucking douche nugget calls me up at 3 in the morning babbling on about a system I've never even heard of, let alone am on call for. Not only do I have to find out what that system does, but who supports it, in the middle of the night or I lose my job?
You know who's job it is? It's the original knuckle dragger who called me in the middle of night's job to find the right person to call to address the problem, and further more he should have done that quite a while before the actual system blew up.
I'll reply to this, only because we work for the same company and know how things go around here...
I AM the one that is paged at 3AM for some system that I've never heard of. It's not my job to support that system, but it IS my job overall to make sure things are running smoothly and I'm helping out wherever I can. Given that situation I would usually help the 1st level person try to track down who needs to look at it.
Do I think someone needs to be fired for saying "not my job?" No, I do however think (at least at my job) that it's used way more than it needs to be.
Edited, Fri Nov 18 10:34:58 2005 by Frakkor
exactly. That's why I always try to help them find out who to get ahold of. Lot's of time our third shift staff is a little out of touch due to poor communication by the 1st level management. They are always to last to find anything out.
My team supports MOST of the application in our stores, so we are the default go-to people on night and weekends...usually they start with us and then we help them find who really needs to see it.
My team supports MOST of the application in our stores, so we are the default go-to people on night and weekends...usually they start with us and then we help them find who really needs to see it.
Quote:
I AM the one that is paged at 3AM for some system that I've never heard of. It's not my job to support that system, but it IS my job overall to make sure things are running smoothly and I'm helping out wherever I can. Given that situation I would usually help the 1st level person try to track down who needs to look at it.
Well thats fine but when you get paged at 3 in the morning asked about how to change the power regulator board on the monitoring system that runs the Hilo battery chargers, how much time are you going to spend doing their job of tracking down who is in charge of that? All night? Are you going to drive in and hold their hand while they keep calling people? Are you going to get a book on battery maintenance and try to change it yourself? Do you want your name all over it when upper managment is trying to figure out who dropped the ball and why batteries didn't get charged the next day?
Nicroll 65 Assassin
Teltorid 52 Druid
Aude Sapere
Oh hell camp me all you want f**kers. I own this site and thus I own you. - Allakhazam
Teltorid 52 Druid
Aude Sapere
Oh hell camp me all you want f**kers. I own this site and thus I own you. - Allakhazam
So Moe, if someone has a serious dis-***-ter in the ****[/b]ter at work and the bowl is all overflowing with fecal clumps, blood and stray pubes, and someone asks you to deal with it, I expect you to be right in there with your sleeves rolled up. Ok?
Which reminds me, I ran a music event at college, and the toilets we ordered did get blocked, which was a serious problem at the the time. One guy we had employed to run the bar was straight in there pulling out shi[b]t soaked tampons with his bare hands while onlookers were practically vomitting. What a hero.
Would you like some ice with that G&T sir? ...drip.
Which reminds me, I ran a music event at college, and the toilets we ordered did get blocked, which was a serious problem at the the time. One guy we had employed to run the bar was straight in there pulling out shi[b]t soaked tampons with his bare hands while onlookers were practically vomitting. What a hero.
Would you like some ice with that G&T sir? ...drip.
Quote:
Well thats fine but when you get paged at 3 in the morning asked about how to change the power regulator board on the monitoring system that runs the Hilo battery chargers, how much time are you going to spend doing their job of tracking down who is in charge of that? All night? Are you going to drive in and hold their hand while they keep calling people? Are you going to get a book on battery maintenance and try to change it yourself? Do you want your name all over it when upper managment is trying to figure out who dropped the ball and why batteries didn't get charged the next day?
No. If we are not able to find the right person, I have them contact their Team Leader. It's happened before and will happen again. My name has been all over huge problems before and will likley be again. If I was contacted on it and upper management questioned what I did, I would truthfully answer.. " I don't know anything about it, but i helped them to find blah.."
I have stayed up all night helping someone fix a problem that's technically not mine.
For example, right now we are having big problemn with an application that I have had no contact with. A few of us have been asked to contact every store and talk to store leadership and stress the importance of the app. Do I say "sorry, i don't support that app, not my job." Nope. I just take some time out of my day and help out where I can.
Since our acquisition and restructuring I've run into the opposite problem. When we were a small company, everything was my job, basically. If it crossed my desk I could probably do something to help.
Now, of course, job descriptions actually have some weight. I can't charge in and do the necessary thing without A) clearing it with three people first; or B) risking stepping on some toes. It's funny to see those of us who have been around for a while; you can actually see the impulse to jump in being restrained.
What I can do, and will do, is push the process along by defining what needs to be done and letting the heads of those departments know... and volunteer to help as needed, which frees them up, if they're so inclined, to say okay to my meddling ways.
Now, of course, job descriptions actually have some weight. I can't charge in and do the necessary thing without A) clearing it with three people first; or B) risking stepping on some toes. It's funny to see those of us who have been around for a while; you can actually see the impulse to jump in being restrained.
What I can do, and will do, is push the process along by defining what needs to be done and letting the heads of those departments know... and volunteer to help as needed, which frees them up, if they're so inclined, to say okay to my meddling ways.
In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.
Patrician wrote:
One guy we had employed to run the bar was straight in there pulling out shi[b][/b]t soaked tampons with his bare hands while onlookers were practically vomitting. What a hero.
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
Sadily, I'm an office *****. I know it. I can live with it.
Yesterday I had to climb a 150ft water tower in over 50mph winds becuase something didn't work. Guess who's job that wasn't? Now guess where the guy whos job that is was at? At the bottom of the fuc[/b]king tower waiting for me to finish. Ever felt like a kite before? Thank god for OSHA rated 4 point harness.
The system I work on every night after hours isn't mine. It was my old bosses'. Thats not my job. Yet I'm still trying to figure out a routeing problem thats plaguing his wireless side for over a day now.
This is a small company with around 1000 customers and only about 7 employees. We have to be able to do the other persons job if necessary. If the installer is sick, guess who takes over? If the admin is a fu[b]cking lazy bit[/b]ch? I have to take his bullsh[i][/i]it. But you gotta remember, it reflects upon both of us. Me for doing it, and him for not.
It pays to take on things that arn't your job becuase a) someone is gonna realize your putting more then 100% in - b) becuase you LEARN something - c) because if I don't do it, it won't get fuc[b]king done.
Yesterday I had to climb a 150ft water tower in over 50mph winds becuase something didn't work. Guess who's job that wasn't? Now guess where the guy whos job that is was at? At the bottom of the fuc[/b]king tower waiting for me to finish. Ever felt like a kite before? Thank god for OSHA rated 4 point harness.
The system I work on every night after hours isn't mine. It was my old bosses'. Thats not my job. Yet I'm still trying to figure out a routeing problem thats plaguing his wireless side for over a day now.
This is a small company with around 1000 customers and only about 7 employees. We have to be able to do the other persons job if necessary. If the installer is sick, guess who takes over? If the admin is a fu[b]cking lazy bit[/b]ch? I have to take his bullsh[i][/i]it. But you gotta remember, it reflects upon both of us. Me for doing it, and him for not.
It pays to take on things that arn't your job becuase a) someone is gonna realize your putting more then 100% in - b) becuase you LEARN something - c) because if I don't do it, it won't get fuc[b]king done.
Quote:
It pays to take on things that arn't your job becuase a) someone is gonna realize your putting more then 100% in - b) becuase you LEARN something - c) because if I don't do it, it won't get ******* done.
Huzzah! Someone got it right!
I forgot to mention he was naked and furiously ************ with his other hand, while vigorously inhaling through his nose.
Patrician wrote:
I forgot to mention he was naked and furiously ************ with his other hand, while vigorously inhaling through his nose.
In that case I will take ice with that G&T, thanks.
In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.
I have to agree with most of the comments about "That's not my job" - An organisation needs a sense of "All hands to the pump" these days.
But I have one exception.
When the person asking me to do it is the guy paid to do it.
Sure, if s/he asks me to 'help' or 'advise', I'm there, but I often get requests from people too damned lazy or cowardly to do what's needed. That's when I tell them to go forth and multiply.
But I have one exception.
When the person asking me to do it is the guy paid to do it.
Sure, if s/he asks me to 'help' or 'advise', I'm there, but I often get requests from people too damned lazy or cowardly to do what's needed. That's when I tell them to go forth and multiply.
"I started out with nothin' and I still got most of it left" - Seasick Steve
Quote:
... many of them young and born in this country, who believe they are entitled to a good paycheck and shouldn't have to do anything to earn it. They believe that anything unpalatable could not possibly fall into their own area of responsibility.
Maybe i'm a slacker, maybe i've got non-callused hands. Maybe i'm one of the younger generation of workers TS complained about. Maybe i'll get fired one day and learn my lesson. But i often work on contracted terms, and if it's not written down and agreed upon beforehand, it's not getting done by me unless i'm getting some extra compensation.
I don't believe that i should get paid for nothing. I believe that i should get paid for EXACTLY what i agreed to do. no more, no less.
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