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Spin this, Pubbies!Follow

#1 Nov 11 2005 at 11:18 AM Rating: Decent
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Opinion Poll

Quote:
Poll: Most Americans Doubt Bush's Honesty
WASHINGTON - Most Americans say they aren't impressed by the ethics and honesty of the Bush administration, already under scrutiny for its justifications for an unpopular war in
Iraq and its role in the leak of a covert
CIA officer's identity.

Almost six in 10 — 57 percent — said they do not think the Bush administration has high ethical standards and the same portion says
President Bush is not honest, an AP-Ipsos poll found. Just over four in 10 say the administration has high ethical standards and that Bush is honest. Whites, Southerners and white evangelicals were most likely to believe Bush is honest.

Bush, who promised in the 2000 campaign to uphold "honor and integrity" in the White House, last week ordered White House workers, from presidential advisers to low-ranking aides, to attend ethics classes.

The president gets credit from a majority for being strong and decisive, but he's also seen by an overwhelming number of people as "stubborn," a perception reinforced by his refusal to yield on issues like the Iraq war, tax cuts and support for staffers under intense pressure.

More than eight in 10, 82 percent, described Bush as "stubborn," with almost that many Republicans agreeing to that description. That stubborn streak has served Bush well at times, but now he is being encouraged to shake up his staff and change the direction of White House policies.

Concern about the administration's ethics has been fueled by the controversy over flawed intelligence leading up to the Iraq war and the recent indictment of Vice President
**** Cheney's top aide, I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby, on charges of perjury and obstruction of justice for his role in the leak of CIA operative Valerie Plame's name.

That loss of trust complicates Bush's efforts to rebuild his standing with the public. His job approval rating remains at his all-time low in the AP-Ipsos poll of 37 percent.

"Honesty is a huge issue because even people who disagreed with his policies respected his integrity," said Bruce Buchanan, a political scientist from the University of Texas.

The mandatory White House lectures on ethics for its employees came after the Libby indictment, and some people say they aren't impressed.

"It's like shutting the barn door after the horse escaped," said John Morrison, a Democrat who lives near Scranton, Pa.

"This week's elections were just a preview of what's going to happen," he said, referring to Tuesday's New Jersey and Virginia gubernatorial races, both won by Democrats. "People are just fed up."

Some Republicans are nervous about the GOP's political position.

"A lot of elected Republicans are running for the hills in the Northeast," said Connecticut GOP strategist Chris DePino after what he called "a waterfall of missteps" by Republicans. Bush and the GOP must return to their message that the United States has been safe from terrorism during his administration, DePino said.

Only 42 percent in the new poll said they approve of Bush's handling of foreign policy and terrorism, his lowest rating yet in an area that has long been his strongest issue.

The war in Iraq is at the core of the public's unrest, polling found.

An AP-Ipsos poll last week asked people to state in their own words why they approved or disapproved of the way Bush was doing his job. Almost six in 10 disapproved, and they most frequently mentioned the war in Iraq — far ahead of the second issue, the economy.

"To use an unfortunate metaphor, Iraq is a roadside bomb in American politics," said Rich Bond, a former national Republican chairman.

Many of those who approve of Bush's job performance cited his Christian beliefs and strong values, the second biggest reason for support after backing his policies.

"I know he is a man of integrity and strong faith," said Fran Blaney, a Republican and an evangelical who lives near Hartford, Conn. "I've read that he prays every morning asking for God's guidance. He certainly is trying to do what he thinks he is supposed to do."

The poll of 1,000 adults was conducted Nov. 7-9 by Ipsos, an international polling firm, and has a margin of sampling error of plus or minus 3 percentage points.


I'm just amused that someone actually came straight to the point and asked a pretty straightforward question. I'm also amused that people can crap on how black folks accepted Marion Barry back into the fold, and they don't see the irony in GWB.
#2 Nov 11 2005 at 11:23 AM Rating: Good
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Obama, Mccain '08
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#3 Nov 11 2005 at 11:28 AM Rating: Excellent
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Lord xythex wrote:
Obama, Mccain '08
I've vote it, but no way in hell it'll happen.

Obviously, the only reason people see the Adminstration as unethical is because of the politicised media spin put forth by the Liberal Conspiracy. If media outlets stopped reporting on things like Libby or Iraqi WMD information, no one would think poorly of Bush for it.
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#4 Nov 11 2005 at 11:36 AM Rating: Default
Flea,

How's this for spin...It's just a poll

Often I wonder what the libs would to if there weren't polls affirming their sycophantic fantasies; alas we'll never know.


Achileez
#5 Nov 11 2005 at 11:40 AM Rating: Excellent
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achileez wrote:
How's this for spin...It's just a poll
And yet polls have the adminstration's knickers knotted up tight enough that they have to declare a campaign to "strike back" and try to raise Bush's numbers out of the mid-30's.
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#6 Nov 11 2005 at 11:46 AM Rating: Excellent
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My opinion on GWB is that he's not lying to me much more than he's lying to himself. I think he believes his own press, which has been a huge mistake for any President except Reagan.
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#7 Nov 11 2005 at 11:53 AM Rating: Default
Jophed,

Seems like we had a similar conversation prior to Bushes re-election. Elections are what count and it's rather obvious the Republicans have been spanking the dems for quite some time now.

Achileez
#8 Nov 11 2005 at 11:55 AM Rating: Excellent
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*Shrug*

You said polls don't matter, I pointed out the White House's own, self-admitted "campagin" (their word, not mine) to change public perception and raise the ratings. Maybe polls don't matter to you but they must to someone in charge over there.
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#9 Nov 11 2005 at 11:59 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
How's this for spin...It's just a poll


That was a weak spin. That kind of spin wouldn't even wash my delicates.
#10 Nov 11 2005 at 12:05 PM Rating: Good
I believe that poll is just about dead-on. I don't see it causing any major policy changes such as a pullout of Iraq or GWB suddenly becoming a great speechifier, though.

People in this country don't like to stick things out when it gets rough. That's nothing new and I think it's pretty much a given that we're going to get ourselves a Dem president next time around. I just hope that we don't swing too far into the realms of socialism and isolationism when it's all said and done. Those are steps backward, moreso even than pushing ID in schools.
#11 Nov 11 2005 at 12:23 PM Rating: Good
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So it's a suprise that the people don't trust a politician?
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#12 Nov 11 2005 at 2:41 PM Rating: Default
Flea,

I'm quite certain my washing machine is no where near big enough to handle your granny panties.

Now when the dems actually start winning elections they'll have something to brag about; until then it's just the same liberal media rhetoric.

Achileez
#13 Nov 11 2005 at 3:35 PM Rating: Excellent
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They won several just this past week! Smiley: laugh
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#14 Nov 11 2005 at 3:47 PM Rating: Default
Dems retained seat Dems already held...and Arny lost out; but hey they're Californians not the brightest bunch. All in all not a loss at all. What will be telling is next years mid-term elections where quite a few dem senators are up for re-election; including La senators...I can feel them sweating it out as we speak.

Achileez
#15 Nov 11 2005 at 3:54 PM Rating: Excellent
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Ooohhh... You want to see election results but not the ones that just happened. Those don't count. Gotcha.
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#16 Nov 11 2005 at 3:59 PM Rating: Decent
Drama Nerdvana
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Is Jophiel talking to himself or am I seeing the default fillter in action?
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#17 Nov 11 2005 at 4:00 PM Rating: Excellent
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bodhisattva wrote:
am I seeing the default fillter in action?
You are.

Which I didn't even notice mine was off until you just said something.
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#18 Nov 11 2005 at 4:55 PM Rating: Good
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achileez wrote:
Pretty much what I expected him to write.

Not only are you sadly unimaginative, but sadly misinformed, and you take bait with an eagerness that would do a fisherman proud.

No wonder you're a pubbie.
#19 Nov 11 2005 at 5:36 PM Rating: Decent
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It's 1000 people. Hardly "Most Americans"

but...



Meh.
#20 Nov 11 2005 at 6:46 PM Rating: Good
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Also, the questions were asked in the opposite manner to which they are presented in the article.

They were asked if they thought the Bush administration has high ethical standards, to which 43% said yes.

By writing it as "57% said that the Bush administration does not have high ethical standards" it implies a "low" ethical standard that isn't really supported in the original poll. It's technically correct either way, but it implies more when written the way it's written.

All of the questions were reversed when written in the article from how they were presented as questions in the poll. A good indicator of bias on the part of the writer.
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#21 Nov 11 2005 at 6:55 PM Rating: Good
NephthysWanderer the Charming wrote:
It's 1000 people. Hardly "Most Americans"

but...



Meh.


I imagine it would take a while to actually speak to 140 million people.

So how good is a poll of 1000?

Statistically, if opinions are distributed randomly we expect any one view to get the true fraction of opinion times the sample size plus or minus about two times the square root of this number (for relatively large numbers). (Opinions are not distributed randomly, thus the error is larger).

Let's say the "true" rate of approval for Bush is 40%. In a poll of 100 people, we expect 40 to approve, but with the random error of the poll we expect somewhere between about 27 and 53 (about 95% of the time). This assumes *perfect* sampling of all the population (e.g. asking exactly the right number of races, sexes, classes). This is plus or minus 13%.

If we poll 1000 people, we expect 400 approvals but the square root of 400 is 20, times 2 is 40, so we expect about 360 to 440 approvals. (Again, assuming perfect sampling). This is plus or minus 1%.

If we go to 10,000 people, we get about 0.3% error - and at this level we expect other biases to become a larger source of error then the inherent random (so called "shot noise") no matter how careful we are to try to account for the inherent inaccuracies of polling.

#22 Nov 11 2005 at 6:56 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
Liberal media bias!!
Would've been a lot quicker.
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#23 Nov 11 2005 at 7:05 PM Rating: Decent
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This is my favorite line though....

Quote:
Almost six in 10 — 57 percent


Just over four in 10

The difference? 70 whole people.

This still isn't the 90000 out of 100000 used the words "I hate Bush" kind of evidence.

So again....

meh.
#24 Nov 11 2005 at 7:24 PM Rating: Good
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Behold the power of the internet.

http://www.ipsos-na.com/news/client/act_dsp_pdf.cfm?name=mr051111-1topline.pdf&id=2862

There is poll, question for question, result for result.

Since Ipsos-AP runs this survey as a Tracker (same questions asked every month to see changes and trends over time).
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#25 Nov 11 2005 at 7:35 PM Rating: Excellent
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bodhisattva wrote:
Behold the power of the internet.
I was hoping for **** Smiley: frown

2. Do you think the Bush administration has high ethical standards or not? 
                                                  ALL 
                                                 ADULTS 
Yes, has high ethical standards ................. 41 
No, does not have high ethical 
standards ....................................... 57 
Refused/not sure ................................. 2


Almost six in 10 — 57 percent — said they do not think the Bush administration has high ethical standards

I don't see anything overly vague or misleading about the question nor the article's reporting of it. Any port in a storm, though.
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#26 Nov 11 2005 at 7:47 PM Rating: Good
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If you want I could recite the introduction to the Ipsos AP poll word for word (sexily) and then talk about market sample, gender quotas and all sorts of industry lingo.

Believe me my deep sexy phone voice would have your boxers off in no time.
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