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I don't know how to feel about thisFollow

#1 Oct 25 2005 at 7:53 AM Rating: Excellent
Nexa
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Really: http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/10/25/williams.execution.ap/index.html

Firstly, I'm not in favor of the death penalty anyway, I think rotting in prison is a far worse punishment. Regardless, I really feel bad about this case (surprisingly so, as I am generally fairly free of pity for a murderer four times over). He's been in jail a long time, and I think he should stay there for what he's done, but at the same time he really seems to have tried to make amends...not that you ever really can.

I don't want him set free necessarily, but I just feel bad that it has to be this way. No, I don't really have a point here, except to say I hope that this serves as some sort of an example to kids thinking of joining gangs. I'm sure Williams wishes his life could have gone in a different direction. Such a waste.

Nexa
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#2 Oct 25 2005 at 8:18 AM Rating: Good
Gurue
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I saw that on TV this morning and my reaction is similar to yours. I'm not sure what I want for the man, but it almost seems like he's one of the few that *did* change. Meh, I don't know...
#3 Oct 25 2005 at 8:26 AM Rating: Good
I'm absolutley for the death penalty. IMHO This case should be no exception.

Regardless of what is changed SINCE the murders, it doesn't change the fact that it happened. We are not talking about a manslaughter charge here, it's 4 counts of murder-1 . Sure, he wrote some books and seems like a good guy now, but it doesn't bring back his victims, nor does it satisfy the family members of those vicitms.

I say the death penalty should stand.
#4 Oct 25 2005 at 8:28 AM Rating: Excellent
No matter how much he's changed he doesn't deserve a second chance, because there can be no more chances for the people he killed.
#5 Oct 25 2005 at 9:13 AM Rating: Good
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Although I'm fairly middle of the road on most things (ok, maybe a little on the left side), the only area where I've always been truly conservative is on crime and punishment but do my best to keep an open mind in regards to any reasonable gray areas, if there are any.

I'm ok with capital punishment as long as there is no shadow of a doubt that the person is guilty of the crime.

In this particular situation, I'm glad he has tried to turn his life around for his crimes. Yet I don't think anything short of being able to undo the savage crimes he committed would be acceptable. I will always support the victims in these matters. Like it's been said, there are no second chances for the victims, the same should be for their killers.

Yes, killing him will not bring back the victims. But if it gives the victim's family a sense of closure and justice served, then I cannot hold that against them. Sure, if they did away with death penalty, I have no problem if the guy lived. But I wouldn't want him ever let out.

Like Sammy sang in the theme song for Baretta (ironies of irony for Robert Blake, but that's another matter), "Don't do the crime if you can't do the time." I guess it comes down to taking responsibility for your actions by paying the ultimate price.

Maybe he'll get his redemption on the other side.






Edited, Tue Oct 25 10:34:53 2005 by Smoggy
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#6 Oct 25 2005 at 9:13 AM Rating: Excellent
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Well, hopefully he can take some solace in the fact that he did some good before he died. But writing books wasn't the judgement passed for his crimes.
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#7 Oct 25 2005 at 9:28 AM Rating: Decent
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Off with his head.

#8 Oct 25 2005 at 10:06 AM Rating: Excellent
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The only reason we're having this conversation is because his name is well known. Lots of capital prisoners seek, and for all I know may find, redemption. It's easy, frankly, to be good when you have bars and guards keeping your toes on the line.

He wrote some books. That's nice. He also started up one of the most violent gangs in the country, indirectly contributing thereby to hundreds of deaths and ruined lives and a deepening of the tensions in his own race, as well as between the races. So now he sees that maybe that was a bad idea. Great. I'm glad he came to that realization, if a bit late.

Time to hit the reset button, and try to do better next time.
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#9 Oct 25 2005 at 10:33 AM Rating: Decent
What if a someone murdered a young Hitler?

Just sayin'.
#10 Oct 25 2005 at 10:37 AM Rating: Decent
Fiscally speaking, a bullet to the head is way cheaper than feeding and sheltering someone for the rest of their life.

Imagine, if we killed all the people that really deserved it, we'd have plenty of money for rebuilding New Orleans and taking over small Middle Eastern countries too!
#11 Oct 25 2005 at 11:25 AM Rating: Excellent
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Prince pickleprince wrote:
What if a someone murdered a young Hitler?

Just sayin'.
We'd have the makings for an amazing "alternate reality" science fiction novel!
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Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#12 Oct 25 2005 at 11:36 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
He wrote some books. That's nice. He also started up one of the most violent gangs in the country, indirectly contributing thereby to hundreds of deaths and ruined lives and a deepening of the tensions in his own race, as well as between the races. So now he sees that maybe that was a bad idea. Great. I'm glad he came to that realization, if a bit late.



/nod

Fry him.
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#13 Oct 25 2005 at 11:37 AM Rating: Good
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no matter what he has done since his crimes, fed, clothed, and supported enough to have the time to write, he took away lives. Those lives can never be returned. He did some good stuff, which is better than some do wasting their lives away in prision, but it does not excuse him from taking the lives of innocent people.

btw I still say a rope is cheaper than a bullet
#14 Oct 25 2005 at 11:50 AM Rating: Excellent
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Lady deadsidedemon wrote:
btw I still say a rope is cheaper than a bullet
A .45 round is about seventeen cents. Ten feet of 3-strand manilla rope with a 1200lb break strength is $2.80 Smiley: grin

You'd need to use the same rope on seventeen criminals just to see savings!
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#15 Oct 25 2005 at 11:55 AM Rating: Good
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ahh but you can use the rope again and again wheras a bullet is a one shot deal.






no pun intended, of course
#16 Oct 25 2005 at 11:56 AM Rating: Good
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I have to agree with those in favor of his death. While he has clearly changed in prison, the purpose of the law is to deter future injustice by consistently punishing those who commit crimes. This guy did the crimes and his death will serve as a deterence to others who might do the same crimes.
#17 Oct 25 2005 at 11:56 AM Rating: Good
Quote:
A .45 round is about seventeen cents. Ten feet of 3-strand manilla rope with a 1200lb break strength is $2.80 icon


I hope you got that price out of a catalog, and not just off the top of your head. Granted, you could be making it up for all I know, but still. Your freaky.
#18 Oct 25 2005 at 11:57 AM Rating: Good
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Reusing the rope is pretty unsanitary. A violent hanging death could cause bleeding which when soaked into the rope could cause a serious infection on the next person to use it.
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#19 Oct 25 2005 at 11:59 AM Rating: Good
Duh. That's why you use a fresh Rope Condom with each hanging.
#20 Oct 25 2005 at 12:00 PM Rating: Excellent
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That's not really the problem. Old rope stretches.
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#21 Oct 25 2005 at 12:00 PM Rating: Excellent
I have thought about this all day. I beleive this is one of those cases where there is no right answer.

He killed, he deserves to be punished for his crimes. But death? I doubt that is the answer.

I remember the film, "The Shawshank Redemption". And every ten years Morgan Freeman goes for his parole. Every time he says "Yessir, I am ready to rejoin society!". Each year he is turned down.
Finally, after 30 years or so, he sits dejected in his chair and says something along the lines of "I am tired, and old. I wish I could talk to who I was, that young man, and tell him to stop and think about what he did and stop him, but I cannot. I committed a terrible crime for which I regret. This is now my home and to be honest young man, all I do is come here to provide you with something to do so you can claim a wage. Please stop wasting my time and send me back where from where I came".
He was released. He was truly sorry for what he did.

Now that film was fiction, but you have to wonder, is this criminal much like Morgan Freemans character? Truly sorry for what he did, murderer or not? If he is truly sorry, does society hold no account of that? Or is mercy beyond us? 20 years is a long time to repent.

I would hope his death penalty could be cancelled and he could live his life out in jail. A dead man cannot repent, in public, to stop the young following his footsteps. A live man, can talk and hopefully disway young people from following the violent path he took.
#22 Oct 25 2005 at 12:02 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
It's easy, frankly, to be good when you have bars and guards keeping your toes on the line.


Not to mention a death scentence hangin' over his head.
#23 Oct 25 2005 at 12:04 PM Rating: Decent
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Jophiel wrote:
Lady deadsidedemon wrote:
btw I still say a rope is cheaper than a bullet
A .45 round is about seventeen cents. Ten feet of 3-strand manilla rope with a 1200lb break strength is $2.80 Smiley: grin

You'd need to use the same rope on seventeen criminals just to see savings!


You forgot the gun in that pricing equation.
#24 Oct 25 2005 at 12:05 PM Rating: Good
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Samira wrote:
That's not really the problem. Old rope stretches.


I thought it was that new rope stretches?

As for the unsanitary factor, do you really think it matters? They wouldnt be alive long enough to get contaminated
#25 Oct 25 2005 at 12:08 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
As for the unsanitary factor, do you really think it matters? They wouldnt be alive long enough to get contaminated


/snicker
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#26 Oct 25 2005 at 12:20 PM Rating: Excellent
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fenderputy the Shady wrote:
You forgot the gun in that pricing equation.
I didn't figure for a scaffold with a lever and a trapdoor either. *Shrug*
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Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
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