a quote from the incoming Attourney General,
"the president has the authority to sidestep laws and treaties and authorize torture in the future..."
yep. you can see why he was a favorite for the position.
a quote from a REPUBLICAN senator, Graham from SC,
"i do believe we have lost our way....." in direct response to the statements from incoming Gonzales, AG. but said he would support him anyway, ie, vote the party line right or wrong.
when you ignorant sheep have let this country slip far enough into this black pit we are heading into, and are ready for another "tea party", you let us know. inspite of our differances, we will be more than happey to help you dig us out of this pit.
as for Senator Graham, shame on you. your job is to protect this country and the people who voted for you, not vote party lines.
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As much as I agree with you, there really isnt anything we can do now, he was re-elected, how, I do not know. Maybe he will finally get introuble for all the stupid sh*t he's done, I atleast hope so.
I have never been so embarrassed to be an american citizen as I do now, I mean look who's supposedly representing us!!!
Anyways, I'll stop ranting, good post^^
I have never been so embarrassed to be an american citizen as I do now, I mean look who's supposedly representing us!!!
Anyways, I'll stop ranting, good post^^
one word:
RECALL
it is part of our constitution. just need enough republicans to get pissed off enough to start the action.
there is still hope.
RECALL
it is part of our constitution. just need enough republicans to get pissed off enough to start the action.
there is still hope.
LOL, tis true^^
I really hope, for the sake of the American people that happens.
I really hope, for the sake of the American people that happens.
It won't.
The people that voted for Bush believe he is doing the right thing.
All the rest of us can do is sit back and hope he doesn't offend the wrong country and start WWIII.
Thankfully only his overseas policy effects me dirctly so i don't have to worry about him ******** the ecconomy, eroding 20 years of hard fought freedoms and trying to force christian views on my Atheist exsistance.
The people that voted for Bush believe he is doing the right thing.
All the rest of us can do is sit back and hope he doesn't offend the wrong country and start WWIII.
Thankfully only his overseas policy effects me dirctly so i don't have to worry about him ******** the ecconomy, eroding 20 years of hard fought freedoms and trying to force christian views on my Atheist exsistance.
Quote:
All the rest of us can do is sit back and hope he doesn't offend the wrong country and start WWIII.
I will put my money down on 2 years this will happen. When it starts, I'm heading to Iceland and live in a goat hut
Quote:
a quote from the incoming Attourney General,
"the president has the authority to sidestep laws and treaties and authorize torture in the future..."
yep. you can see why he was a favorite for the position.
a quote from a REPUBLICAN senator, Graham from SC,
"i do believe we have lost our way....." in direct response to the statements from incoming Gonzales, AG. but said he would support him anyway, ie, vote the party line right or wrong.
"the president has the authority to sidestep laws and treaties and authorize torture in the future..."
yep. you can see why he was a favorite for the position.
a quote from a REPUBLICAN senator, Graham from SC,
"i do believe we have lost our way....." in direct response to the statements from incoming Gonzales, AG. but said he would support him anyway, ie, vote the party line right or wrong.
can you at least link the entire quote. Not that I think you took it out of context or might have some bias or anything. Before you flame I dont personally have any opinion on Gonzalez and would like the info on what exactly you are talking about.
Boy...if there isn't anything substantial for you Leftists to worry about, you can always invent them can't you?
For the umpteenth time: what happened at Abu Graid was >NOT< torture. It was more like 'inconvenience'. If you want to know who was engaging in torture, ask Nick Berg...oh wait, you can't: the peace-loving Islamic Jihadists beheaded him.
I'd also point out that the Geneva Convention does NOT apply to these Terrorists. In fact, its Articles specifically EXCLUDE Terrorists from its protections. So, even if we were torturing these poor souls, it would violate no International law. Now, if you want to argue that torture does violate the UCMJ, I'll conceed that is true but I'd also say that nothing we have done rises to that standard.
From the hysteria in this post, you sound like you are taking the side of the Terrorists over the side of the people they've sworn to kill. To me, that's extremely ignorant. The only thing stopping you- any of you- from being targeted for extermination by the Jihadists is that military presence and the political will by a very few leaders such as Bush and Blair, whom you loathe so much. I'm sure that you'd be the first to run crying to them if you and your was attacked though.
For the umpteenth time: what happened at Abu Graid was >NOT< torture. It was more like 'inconvenience'. If you want to know who was engaging in torture, ask Nick Berg...oh wait, you can't: the peace-loving Islamic Jihadists beheaded him.
I'd also point out that the Geneva Convention does NOT apply to these Terrorists. In fact, its Articles specifically EXCLUDE Terrorists from its protections. So, even if we were torturing these poor souls, it would violate no International law. Now, if you want to argue that torture does violate the UCMJ, I'll conceed that is true but I'd also say that nothing we have done rises to that standard.
From the hysteria in this post, you sound like you are taking the side of the Terrorists over the side of the people they've sworn to kill. To me, that's extremely ignorant. The only thing stopping you- any of you- from being targeted for extermination by the Jihadists is that military presence and the political will by a very few leaders such as Bush and Blair, whom you loathe so much. I'm sure that you'd be the first to run crying to them if you and your was attacked though.
What Shadowrealm tell the whole story and make an effort to not apear biased? 
thats a good one.
More chance of Mr Bush pulling those boy out of Iraq tomorrow.
Shadow has taken over from Varrusass as the resident board buffoon.
thats a good one. More chance of Mr Bush pulling those boy out of Iraq tomorrow.
Shadow has taken over from Varrusass as the resident board buffoon.
Quote:
I will put my money down on 2 years this will happen. When it starts, I'm heading to Iceland and live in a goat hut
I'll make the same bet, but I dont have the luxory of being able to move out of the country when it does happen, my husband is in the military, so we have to live wherever he is stationed
=-(
You can come visit. I'll make sure I have enough goat cheese. We can have a feast. Just bring some wine and we're good. 
Party at my goat hut!
Party at my goat hut!Quote:
You can come visit. I'll make sure I have enough goat cheese. We can have a feast. Just bring some wine and we're good. Party at my goat hut!
Sounds wonderful^^ You like merlot?
Quote:
I'd also point out that the Geneva Convention does NOT apply to these Terrorists. In fact, its Articles specifically EXCLUDE Terrorists from its protections. So, even if we were torturing these poor souls, it would violate no International law. Now, if you want to argue that torture does violate the UCMJ, I'll conceed that is true but I'd also say that nothing we have done rises to that standard.
CONVENTION AGAINST TORTURE AND OTHER CRUEL, INHUMAN OR DEGRADING TREATMENT OR PUNISHMENT
Quote:
Article 2: 1. Each State Party shall take effective legislative, administrative, judicial or other measures to prevent acts of torture in any territory under its jurisdiction.
2. No exceptional circumstances whatsoever, whether a state of war or a threat or war, internal political instability or any other public emergency, may be invoked as a justification of torture.
3. An order from a superior officer or a public authority may not be invoked as a justification of torture.
2. No exceptional circumstances whatsoever, whether a state of war or a threat or war, internal political instability or any other public emergency, may be invoked as a justification of torture.
3. An order from a superior officer or a public authority may not be invoked as a justification of torture.
Edited, Fri Jan 7 10:53:50 2005 by tarv
Quote:
Sounds wonderful^^ You like merlot?
I'm a cab fan myself, but merlot is good too. Good to see you like the red stuff
Im not a big white wine fanQuote:
For the umpteenth time: what happened at Abu Graid was >NOT< torture. It was more like 'inconvenience'.
Semantics. Torture is torture, no matter what other, less inflammatory name you attach to it.
Quote:
I'd also point out that the Geneva Convention does NOT apply to these Terrorists. In fact, its Articles specifically EXCLUDE Terrorists from its protections.
Can you quote the area in the Geneva Convention that specifically states this? I would honestly like to see it.
Oh, and rate up to Tarv.
Quote:
From the hysteria in this post, you sound like you are taking the side of the Terrorists over the side of the people they've sworn to kill. To me, that's extremely ignorant.
Wanting to put limits on government power is not supporting terrorists. The desire to see people treated humanely even when they would not afford you the same courtesey is not supporting terrorists. Not giving the President unlimited authority to ignore the law and do as he pleases is not supporting terrorists.
Unless, of course, you can prove that they are...
You would kick the poor goat from his hut?
Why does DSD hate goats?
Why does DSD hate goats?
Nah, I'd raise them. How else am I supposed to make goat cheese?
Quote:
The only thing stopping you- any of you- from being targeted for extermination by the Jihadists is that military presence and the political will by a very few leaders such as Bush and Blair, whom you loathe so much. I'm sure that you'd be the first to run crying to them if you and your was attacked though.
Adeimus this is the backwards logic of people like you that is putting this country in the state it is in.
Do you think that Al-Quada was only active when Bush came into office? If so you are mistaken, these nuts have been around for a long time. So now after 9-11 your saying the only reason we havnt gotten attacked again is because of Bush and Blair's military and political pressence?
Your a f ing tard and can GFY if you think Bush is stopping anything, even if he is, its a little late dont you think asshat?
Oh, one more thing, on a somewhat related note: Another reason to not want Gonzales as AG. He also supports the detainment of American citizens without charges or a fair trial.
A quote, from the article:
"Focusing on torture as the main objection to Alberto Gonzales' taking over as Attorney General distracts us from his greater sin: his attempt to give the president the power to imprison Americans incommunicado and indefinitely, without recourse to courts or lawyers. Such contempt for our civil rights shows that Gonzales cannot be trusted to protect them. [...]
What happened to [Yaser] Hamdi [an American citizen detained as an "enemy combatant" and released after two years] is outrageous. But the greater outrage is that the Administration ever argued for such power in the first place. The safeguards that the president tried to strip from us are part of the fundamental "due process" of law that our Constitution requires before the government can take our life, liberty or property. Due process is not a privilege to be given or removed at the government's behest, but a right that belongs to the citizenry, part of the bargain for delegating our powers to our government."
Edited, Fri Jan 7 11:51:05 2005 by RognarsDwarvenGrog
A quote, from the article:
"Focusing on torture as the main objection to Alberto Gonzales' taking over as Attorney General distracts us from his greater sin: his attempt to give the president the power to imprison Americans incommunicado and indefinitely, without recourse to courts or lawyers. Such contempt for our civil rights shows that Gonzales cannot be trusted to protect them. [...]
What happened to [Yaser] Hamdi [an American citizen detained as an "enemy combatant" and released after two years] is outrageous. But the greater outrage is that the Administration ever argued for such power in the first place. The safeguards that the president tried to strip from us are part of the fundamental "due process" of law that our Constitution requires before the government can take our life, liberty or property. Due process is not a privilege to be given or removed at the government's behest, but a right that belongs to the citizenry, part of the bargain for delegating our powers to our government."
Edited, Fri Jan 7 11:51:05 2005 by RognarsDwarvenGrog
#20REDACTED,
Posted: Jan 07 2005 at 11:54 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Which one do you think it will be? i got 5 on north korea
For those interested Here is the geneva Convention on the treatment of prisoners of war.
While it could be argued that those in AG where not covered by the said act <although it is equally possible to argue they where> there is no mention of any group being an excempted from the articles.
While it could be argued that those in AG where not covered by the said act <although it is equally possible to argue they where> there is no mention of any group being an excempted from the articles.
So, would the Chinese Water "Torture" just be an inconvenience? I mean, come on, it would take a long time for the water to do any real damage. It would barely be humiliating. Yeah, instead of spanking, I will Chinese Water Torture my kids. That's it. Yeah.
this is a very dark path we follow now.
and sadly, our ONLY hope of turning back towards the light lies with the republicans. if they continue to keep their head in the sand, we are lost,probably for a very long long time.
the fact that the most powerfull laywer in the land would make a case for excusing the president of our own laws, and condoning making our word meaningless in the international community by making a case for ignoring and walking away from treaties, not to mention leagally trying to "redefine" torture, or making it blatently excusable by our government agencies......
...........is mind numbing.
people, we need to put partisian politics in the history books as a failed experiment. we need to open our eyes to what our own government is doing.
we need to take.....OUR.....country back.....NOW.
laws are for EVERYONE in this country. NO EXCEPTIONS.
Treaties are our word, our promise, our honor to the rest of the world.
Torture is EVIL. PERIOD. you earn no honor or respect on the battelfield by doing satans work. you earn no respect from the people you try to "save" if you treat them like the tyrant you just defeated. try and guess why the people of Iraq do not embrace us.
this addministraition did this. left or right, i dont care, but they need to go.
it is up to you republicans to make it happen.
and sadly, our ONLY hope of turning back towards the light lies with the republicans. if they continue to keep their head in the sand, we are lost,probably for a very long long time.
the fact that the most powerfull laywer in the land would make a case for excusing the president of our own laws, and condoning making our word meaningless in the international community by making a case for ignoring and walking away from treaties, not to mention leagally trying to "redefine" torture, or making it blatently excusable by our government agencies......
...........is mind numbing.
people, we need to put partisian politics in the history books as a failed experiment. we need to open our eyes to what our own government is doing.
we need to take.....OUR.....country back.....NOW.
laws are for EVERYONE in this country. NO EXCEPTIONS.
Treaties are our word, our promise, our honor to the rest of the world.
Torture is EVIL. PERIOD. you earn no honor or respect on the battelfield by doing satans work. you earn no respect from the people you try to "save" if you treat them like the tyrant you just defeated. try and guess why the people of Iraq do not embrace us.
this addministraition did this. left or right, i dont care, but they need to go.
it is up to you republicans to make it happen.
You are so right. I say let's have another Tea Party this weekend.
I'll bring some Chamomile with a little bit of honey. Its good for sore throats. My house? Say 8ish?
I'll bring some Chamomile with a little bit of honey. Its good for sore throats. My house? Say 8ish?
Quote:
as for Senator Graham, shame on you. your job is to protect this country and the people who voted for you, not vote party lines.
Senator Graham is voting party lines because the people that voted for him voted straight-ticket Republican.
Just sayin'.
Quote:
Senator Graham is voting party lines because the people that voted for him voted straight-ticket Republican.
Just sayin'
Just sayin'
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