Ok so I'll say it right off the bat...I work for Microsoft (and love doin so).
Everyone has varying opinions about us and our products etc, and that's fine. Use what you want to use, some products are better for some people. But let me say this:
Regarding the tragic Tsunami, an internal email was sent out by Steve Ballmer indicating among other things that we will be contributing $3.5 million in aid, including 100% matching of all employee contributions for the cause (which are of course encouraged but not mandatory).
Say what you want about my company...but as 1 company alone, we are giving at the very least 10% of what Bush first announced (Bush just recenty upped the number to $350 mill, probably because of all the flak he was getting for such a piddly *** donation).
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Of course the countries that are getting the aid probably have to sign a deal to use Microsoft products in perpetuity and to ban the word Anti Trust.
That or Ballmer threatens to inflict this upon them
http://www.media.ebaumsworld.com/index.php?e=microsoftdance.mpg
That or Ballmer threatens to inflict this upon them
http://www.media.ebaumsworld.com/index.php?e=microsoftdance.mpg
Bode - 100 Holy Paladin - Lightbringer
provided it is truely a no-strings attached donation, my hat goes off to M$ for this act.
/salute
/salute
Hey people don't flame Microsoft for their products as much as they do for their marketing practices and constant company buying to keep their advantage. They have supressed many technologies from these acquired companies, albeit while actually incorporating part of the acquired tech in many other products.
The worst though is that they're still closed source. They feel they need to so people can't just compile their own free copy of windows and not buy it. The only people that are allowed to see the code are MS employees and those of companies that have signed 50 page confidentiality agreements with MS.
Being closed source is why it is so vulnerable to attack. Yeah, MS has some very talented people - but certainly they don't regularly have the chance to review _all_ the code looking for errors. Sometimes it takes the mind of a cracker to find them. That's why the various Unices are so damn tight these days.
Windows is working on it, but years behind where they really should be at this point.
That's great they are making such a big donation, but - I wonder if Paul Allen gave Steve and Bill a not so gentle suggestion, or if they need a tax writeoff.
Edited, Fri Dec 31 15:22:04 2004 by Mindwalker
The worst though is that they're still closed source. They feel they need to so people can't just compile their own free copy of windows and not buy it. The only people that are allowed to see the code are MS employees and those of companies that have signed 50 page confidentiality agreements with MS.
Being closed source is why it is so vulnerable to attack. Yeah, MS has some very talented people - but certainly they don't regularly have the chance to review _all_ the code looking for errors. Sometimes it takes the mind of a cracker to find them. That's why the various Unices are so damn tight these days.
Windows is working on it, but years behind where they really should be at this point.
That's great they are making such a big donation, but - I wonder if Paul Allen gave Steve and Bill a not so gentle suggestion, or if they need a tax writeoff.
Edited, Fri Dec 31 15:22:04 2004 by Mindwalker
Ever since they put ME on shelves before Product Development was done with it I have only used Windows for gaming computers. I am glad that they are helping with the victims though.
Nah. Bush knows better than to give cart blanche to the UN. Remember the Food for Oil program? Or how about Kofi Annan's son, who has been skimming millions from UN coffers? The money was always going to be given, just not through those thieves running the baby blue Mafia.
Totem
Totem
Isolationist much, Totem?
Nope. I just don't have any misplaced trust in an organization which places a serial murderer in charge of the UN commission on genocide or a Third World incompetent who nepotically puts his embezzling son in charge of billions of dollars from a program he worked diligently to keep running. And now we are supposed to believe that the UN won't skim 40-60% off the top of all that aid relief for "organizational purposes and administration costs?"
Not I, said the fly.
Totem
Not I, said the fly.
Totem
As opposed to a guy who in office managed to see that his old company full of his friends got a lucrative war contract awarded to them for high costs with no competitive bidders.
The same company that is later busted for defrauding the US military for tens of millions of dollars worth of goods that were supposed to be going to our troops in the field but were never delivered.
Or the guy that had private meeting with top guns at the energy companies to hammer out the new law for privatizing power and the electricity grid and then it turns out that those same people use the rules to artificially inflate electricty prices by withholding power. Also those same people are responsible for a mutli billion dollar company going bankrupt and ruining the savings of thousands and throwing the financial market in a tizzy all due to bad book keeping.
Damn horrible people, both Annan, Annans son and the above people should all be charged with a crime or something.
The same company that is later busted for defrauding the US military for tens of millions of dollars worth of goods that were supposed to be going to our troops in the field but were never delivered.
Or the guy that had private meeting with top guns at the energy companies to hammer out the new law for privatizing power and the electricity grid and then it turns out that those same people use the rules to artificially inflate electricty prices by withholding power. Also those same people are responsible for a mutli billion dollar company going bankrupt and ruining the savings of thousands and throwing the financial market in a tizzy all due to bad book keeping.
Damn horrible people, both Annan, Annans son and the above people should all be charged with a crime or something.
Bode - 100 Holy Paladin - Lightbringer
Quote:
Say what you want about my company...but as 1 company alone, we are giving at the very least 10% of what Bush first announced (Bush just recenty upped the number to $350 mill, probably because of all the flak he was getting for such a piddly *** donation).
Pfizer has pledged $35 million in cash and supplies, thereby matching 100% what Bush first announced. But hey, every penny counts
Meh. If that is true, then at least those dollars went to 'Mericans and not some dirty foreigners. Filthy heathen Third Worlders.
Totem
Totem
Yup the donation is truly "no strings attached". One of the things that makes me proud of workin for MS.
Windows ME was a joke, I'll be the first to admit that ^^. Those 2 words are never ever mentioned around here for fear of reprisal lol.
Open source is a whole other topic with ups and downs to it. I will say this though: coding techniques and guidelines are constantly improved and inspected on our end. Sure, things are bound to slip through in millions of lines of code...but every developer is required to take advancement courses to improve testability etc. Plus, contrary to what you say...code review and design review processes are in place and refined every chance we get.
In the end, no product will ever be perfect. Use what suits you best. We of course hope it's our products, but if not, that's your absolute right.
Quote:
Ever since they put ME on shelves before Product Development was done with it I have only used Windows for gaming computers. I am glad that they are helping with the victims though.
Windows ME was a joke, I'll be the first to admit that ^^. Those 2 words are never ever mentioned around here for fear of reprisal lol.
Quote:
Being closed source is why it is so vulnerable to attack. Yeah, MS has some very talented people - but certainly they don't regularly have the chance to review _all_ the code looking for errors. Sometimes it takes the mind of a cracker to find them. That's why the various Unices are so damn tight these days.
Open source is a whole other topic with ups and downs to it. I will say this though: coding techniques and guidelines are constantly improved and inspected on our end. Sure, things are bound to slip through in millions of lines of code...but every developer is required to take advancement courses to improve testability etc. Plus, contrary to what you say...code review and design review processes are in place and refined every chance we get.
In the end, no product will ever be perfect. Use what suits you best. We of course hope it's our products, but if not, that's your absolute right.
Totem wrote:
Meh. If that is true, then at least those dollars went to 'Mericans and not some dirty foreigners. Filthy heathen Third Worlders.
Totem
Totem
Plus I'm sure the money will trickle down from the rich people to all the people that lost there jobs and the supplies and gasoline that the Army was charged for by the one company but which they never actually delivered wasnt hurting the troops.
Bode - 100 Holy Paladin - Lightbringer
I wouldn't doubt there were ulterior motives on Microsoft's part. Publicity, and the moolah that comes with it. I wouldn't be suprised if a bunch of companies did the same and advertised it. "Buy from me! I gave 3.5 million dollars to Tsunami relief!", "No! Buy from me! I gave 4.2 million dollars to Tsunami relief!"
~Nab~
~Nab~
Of course there will be ulterior motive both in public relations and tax breaks for donating that much money. Cant expect every action to be altruistic you cant only be grateful that they are helping out.
Bode - 100 Holy Paladin - Lightbringer
kudos to msoft. but of course, there are other good deeds done by other companies. im sure msoft also helps poor little orphanages with toys and stuff during the other times of the year when there are no natural disasters. it's just that we just remember the bad stuff.
when things like this happen, i often think about the individual wealthy celebrities or other rich people who could totally give even $1 million to such a cause and not even feel the strain.
we do what we can. there is no shame in giving just a little if it's all you have, or no worth in giving a lot if it's just a fraction of what you really can give. we do what we can and that's what makes this world go round.
Microsoft is giving away an hours worth of profit. Who cares.
Microsoft has billions in the way to make up for. They have set back the development of software by a decade, and that number is growing. They have ruined the consumer market, and made the market share of computer users illiterate to the facts about Windows vs other operating systems. This isn't counting the jobs that they have destroyed, and software they have stolen.
Microsofts software is shi[b][/b]t. It's insecure, horribly ineffecient, and all around crap. Their business tactics are foul and underhanded.
There's no question in my mind if MS is doing this to help them, or to make themselves look better. It's the former, and the fact that they feel the need to do so is pathetic.
Ace, if what you say is true and Windows code is inspected... That makes me laugh. There is absolutely no excuse for the extremely poor quality of Windows overall, then.
MS is no good samaritan. Them giving 3.5M is nowhere near the amount that they have gained through illegal business practices, shady marketing, and monopolizing. And even through all of this, their products are horrible.
Microsoft has billions in the way to make up for. They have set back the development of software by a decade, and that number is growing. They have ruined the consumer market, and made the market share of computer users illiterate to the facts about Windows vs other operating systems. This isn't counting the jobs that they have destroyed, and software they have stolen.
Microsofts software is shi[b][/b]t. It's insecure, horribly ineffecient, and all around crap. Their business tactics are foul and underhanded.
There's no question in my mind if MS is doing this to help them, or to make themselves look better. It's the former, and the fact that they feel the need to do so is pathetic.
Ace, if what you say is true and Windows code is inspected... That makes me laugh. There is absolutely no excuse for the extremely poor quality of Windows overall, then.
MS is no good samaritan. Them giving 3.5M is nowhere near the amount that they have gained through illegal business practices, shady marketing, and monopolizing. And even through all of this, their products are horrible.
This Donation has Encountered an Illegal Segmentation Fault. Please save all work and reboot your system.
In regards to the original donation by GWB - I really don't think that we (Americans) were obliged to contribute any money at all. Nope, not one penny. What we originally contributed was done out of the pure kindness of our hearts. We had no benefit from it, aside from a slightly increased public image.
Then we see people on television not thanking us for what's essentially free money, but complaining that *it's not enough!*
While I still think that we should have made the contribution that we did (it's only... what, $1 or so per American?) I feel kind of ripped off that these whiners, in addition to the people who are honestly grateful to us, will be recieving the money.
Then we see people on television not thanking us for what's essentially free money, but complaining that *it's not enough!*
While I still think that we should have made the contribution that we did (it's only... what, $1 or so per American?) I feel kind of ripped off that these whiners, in addition to the people who are honestly grateful to us, will be recieving the money.
RognarsDwarvenGrog wrote:
In regards to the original donation by GWB - I really don't think that we (Americans) were obliged to contribute any money at all. Nope, not one penny. What we originally contributed was done out of the pure kindness of our hearts. We had no benefit from it, aside from a slightly increased public image.
Then we see people on television not thanking us for what's essentially free money, but complaining that *it's not enough!*
While I still think that we should have made the contribution that we did (it's only... what, $1 or so per American?) I feel kind of ripped off that these whiners, in addition to the people who are honestly grateful to us, will be recieving the money.
Then we see people on television not thanking us for what's essentially free money, but complaining that *it's not enough!*
While I still think that we should have made the contribution that we did (it's only... what, $1 or so per American?) I feel kind of ripped off that these whiners, in addition to the people who are honestly grateful to us, will be recieving the money.
Yeah... those whiners who just lost 120000 of their friends, loved ones, and country men. Damn those whiners.
Quote:
Yeah... those whiners who just lost 120000 of their friends, loved ones, and country men. Damn those whiners.
I kind of expected a reply like that, even though it really doesn't address the issue at hand any more than the "mushroom cloud over NYC" assertion addresses objections to draconian national security measures.
While undoubtedly a tragedy, the tsunami disaster nevertheless gives no one the right to look at a gift of millions in free money and *demand* more.
EDIT: People who rate down legitimate opinions suck.
Edited, Sun Jan 2 16:59:44 2005 by RognarsDwarvenGrog
If you were a woman, I'd kiss you, Rognar. Finally someone with the same opinion!
Give them money, sure, but if they complain, stop it.
Beggars can't be choosers.
Give them money, sure, but if they complain, stop it.
Beggars can't be choosers.
The UN allegation of being 'stingy' was made when USA offered $15M - a fraction of the offer made by much smaller and less prosperous countries.
GWB then upped it to £35M and then called UN misguided. The original $15M was pitiful, but (Get it here, Nobby defends GWB) Nobody realised how serious this all was, so Bush's later uplift to $350 is to be applauded.
Now, we can ***** about which Government donated most, or even brag about which country's citizens donated most.
Or we could personally get onto the charity sites and give money.
Children are dying, horribly. Quit fu[i][/i]cking whining and donate.
GWB then upped it to £35M and then called UN misguided. The original $15M was pitiful, but (Get it here, Nobby defends GWB) Nobody realised how serious this all was, so Bush's later uplift to $350 is to be applauded.
Now, we can ***** about which Government donated most, or even brag about which country's citizens donated most.
Or we could personally get onto the charity sites and give money.
Children are dying, horribly. Quit fu[i][/i]cking whining and donate.
"I started out with nothin' and I still got most of it left" - Seasick Steve
And if you watched the interview that Colin Powell gave, he described the process pretty clearly. That first day, there was no way to know how much money would be needed. You start out with a small amount, assess what's needed, and then up the amount as that assessment comes in. It's not like we *spent* 15M in the first day anyway, right? What difference does it make if we pledge 15M the first day, then up it to 35 on day two, then up it to 350 on day four? Would it have made any more funds or relief available on day one if we'd started out immediately at the 350M figure? Nope. Not one bit.
It's silly rhetoric folks. Those who need aid will get it. As someone pointed out earlier in the thread, one of the really great things about globalization is that the nations of the world do pull together when disasters like this occur. Getting snippy over who pledged what when is silly. The needed amount of aid *will* be there. That's all that really matters.
It's silly rhetoric folks. Those who need aid will get it. As someone pointed out earlier in the thread, one of the really great things about globalization is that the nations of the world do pull together when disasters like this occur. Getting snippy over who pledged what when is silly. The needed amount of aid *will* be there. That's all that really matters.
King Nobby wrote:
More words please
If Indonesia pulls another rally where they burn American flags and chant "America is the Great Satan," I'll be hoping that the next tsunami is caused by a quake that registers somewhere near 15 on the Richter scale.
Maybe this whole thing was Allah telling them to stop supporting terrorism, hmmmm?
Totem
Maybe this whole thing was Allah telling them to stop supporting terrorism, hmmmm?
Totem
What the hell has Indonesia done for the world? The fact that they cant handle their own problems proves their a weak country. When 9/11 happened hey weren't donating anything to us, I believe the sentiment was something along the lines of "They deserved it." If Countries want to be countries they need to be self-reliant rather than dependant on other countrie's donations.
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