To those who believe in the "American Dream"Follow

That's the entitlement speaking. You don't need any of those things to survive unless you're incompetent. They all make life much easier, which is why they're in such high demand, but none of them are necessary. Food and shelter are necessities.





It's a common occurence when someone says something like 'poor people are poor for a reason' that someone immediately begins beating the 'lazy and stupid' horse. There are many reasons for being poor. Lazy and stupid are among them, but I've known plenty of middle and upper income people who are also stupid and lazy. But then they have money already, so stupidity and laziness are luxuries they can afford, at least for the time being.

But, Pickle, if an owner cannot place workers behind the counter then he raises the base wage. On the other hand, if people are willing to work for minimum, then he is under no pressure to raise worker's wages except if other market forces are at work, such as training costs due to a high turnover rate of employees.

I'm not certain why an business owner should be obligated to artificially raise wages for a particular subset of an economic class. I imagine that if people feel that strongly about it, they should purchase their own franchise and give their workers a phenomenally wonderful salary, but to force a particular labor market which utilizes non-skilled workers into paying a skilled laborer's wages is antithetical to the basis on which this country's economic power comes from.

Totem

That's a very good point. There's absolutely no reason why today's employees shouldn't be living in thatch huts on rented parcels of company land.

Oh, for further reading on this subject, you should check out:

http://www.henryholt.com/holt/nickelanddimed.htm

I picked it up a couple of years ago. A very good read. I'd call it informative for those who have never had to live hand to mouth.

I suspect that had you offered your grandparents affordable electricity, etc they would have happily agreed and had a higher quality of life for it. What's your point?

I'm a little confused on if you're trolling or really just a moron.

They are considered necessities in most municipalities today. If you're living in a home without these basic services, it can, and eventually will be condemned.

What our grandparents did or did not have available seventy five years ago is not relevant to this conversation.

That is strange that is almost word for word paragraph 15.4 in my companies employee handbook right after the selling of the soul and all that.

I could see min. wage increase = inflation, but not more.

I live in an area where no-one on minimum wage could afford to live with in 60 miles of. But 70 sure, there is such a thing as comuting.

People just would rather complain than look for the solution, because that would require some sort of sacrifice on thier part.

If you want to help the working people, do something about healthcare, something that people should not have to sacrifice for.



Edited, Tue Dec 21 15:42:37 2004 by kullayen

Here goddamn fault for popping out five kids.. Welcome to the motherfu[/u]ckin 21st century *****! We have this thing called medicine which means cumbuckets like her who can't get by can at least raise one or two kids without fear of them dying from a common cold.

I would agree that a person making minimum wage wouldn't be able to afford thier own housing, but common sense would also say that if they really wanted to survive on their own, they should have a little more sense to know that 5 bucks an hour isn't going to cover anything other than food, gas, and drugs.

I contend that the worse we make the bottom rung of society the more likely people will be encouraged to get the eff out of it. Who knows, Im not a psychology expert or anything. And I'm sorry, but a lady who continues having children she cannot sustain is a *** dumpster less a mind cogniscent of her own well being and the lives she is bringing into this world.

I refuse to subsidize the shortfalls of my fellow man, with my hard work. I am so sick of having to cry about someone elses roblems and fix them. I have my own lot in life. No, I didnt always make the best decisions but I didnt pidgeonhole myself into mediocrity by doing so. In closing, your life will only be as good as the decisions you make. I absolutely refuse to think that someone was given a short end of the stick at birth unless they were born deformed mentally or physically. Economic mediocrity is a chocie to be made. I can be happy and self sufficient at 40k a year and I am well on my way to attaining that. Tell me why I should feel sorry for or change the social structure for people who had just as much opportunity in life as me but chose not to take advantage of it?

There are entire areas of the country that do not indoor plumbing or running water, Jophiel. Significant portions of Louisianna, Alabama, Mississippi, Texas, California, Alaska, Montana, Wyoming, Kentucky, Michigan, and Arizona are without these basic necessities that you think are so terribly needed. Moreover, the Health Department doesn't come knocking either. Are these in towns or cities? No, but that doesn't mean that large segments of society have these either.

It's just that when you live with these goodies for so long you begin to take it for granted and can't imagine life without them.

Totem