On my server I have noticed a weird feeling about disc priests. Sometimes the talk in trade bemoans disc priests as useless. Other times the sentiment runs pro-disc, as in good luck getting through ICC25 without one (yes, sometimes I turn off my filter and listen to the monkeys chatter in trade). I was in two different PUG runs last week, a TOC25 and an ICC25, and I can see where this sentiment evolves from.
In the ICC25, when I saw the healing team of 2 pallies, a druid a shaman and myself, I was about to go holy when the healing lead told me to stay disc and cover the tank groups. I was surprised, to say the least. The lead was one of the pallies and a good one that I knew from experience. He may be a bit mouthy in trade and has the habit of turning things into an e-peen contest, but he does possess skills that cannot be ignored. I stay disc and we proceed to down the first boss without incident. (I actually died at the end of the fight, trying to boost my numbers by casting Divine Hymn during Bone Storm in the closing moments of the fight while standing in Blue Flame... see, those meters are counter-productive!)
Re: Meters- I don't run Recount during 25s. I find that the initial surge of info when we engage the boss really bogs down my aging processor and causes me to lag during a crucial moment. Others run it though, and the pally healing lead asked for the healing meter after the fights. >.> (he's such a xxxx!) However, on the gunship fight, he made a comment that is really the cause of this post. He said something to the effect that it was nice to see a disc priest that knew how to play their class. /flex =)
I stay disc for the run and we wound up clearing the first wing to everyone's surprise... most 25-man PUGs on my server don't make it that far. One-shotting Saurfang was a real surprise, especially since the first mark came out around 75%. But the healing team had a good plan set up, with the pallies working their beacons and me tossing out shields as fast as I could. The dps was good enough that we get the achievement for the boss and all are happy. That group pretty much was done after that, time had taken its toll and many players were ready to call it a night.
Fast Forward to a TOC25 group. (I'm still looking for the OH drop in there!) With two other priests healing, one of them disc, I go Holy. The group is shaky but effective, and I can't help but notice that the disc priest is not shielding well. I actually wound up tossing shields on the tanks a few times and was beginning to wonder at the skill of the disc priest. We get to the faction champs... the bane of all fail PUGs, and my doubts are confirmed as we wipe during a prolonged engagement.
I can tell that the disc priest is not really up to snuff, this is one fight where disc can really swing the initial moments of the fight by shielding, mass dispelling and pain suppression on a focussed target until the mobs can be brought under control. I rarely heal anyone in the beginning moments of this encounter as disc. So I switch to disc and proceed to do that. Of course, I am the one who gets focussed at the onset, dispelling away their buffs. No problem, it happens alot and I pop fade and am situated away from the main group, but four mobs (hunter, spriest, warlock and shaman all took a chunk out of me according to my combat log) return to me and I die despite a pain suppression, shield, penance... The group wipes, tempers flare, and we are done. (I admit- I screwed up by dying, but my point is that I died doing what I should be doing instead of sitting around and waiting for someone else to take the initiative.)
Now I am not the kind of person to start telling people how to play their class in the middle of an instance (even though I really wanted to, lol). This really isn't the place to be learning that. But my point is that the two different groups illustrate the difference between a well-played disc priest and a person that is disc for fotm. Disc healing is like the duck coasting across the water. Even though it looks like nothing is moving it, a lot of action is going on that you don't see. Now take that duck out of the water and let it walk around... that's what a disc priest looks like when he doesn't use his shields.
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So what you're saying is, if I weigh the same as a duck, I'm a witch, and you may burn me?
There are always situations that can't be judged by general rules, but overall I will be so bold as to say that if you consistently show up high on the meter as Disc, you are not a good Disc priest. You may even be a very bad one. If you have to throw out that much healing, you aren't mitigating enough.
But of course healers are used to playing with the goal of healing as much damage as possible and focusing on "Who needs healing?" instead of "Who is going to take damage?" It's a tough enough adjustment for them, let alone the uphill battle of educating the non-healers about how Disc works.
There are always situations that can't be judged by general rules, but overall I will be so bold as to say that if you consistently show up high on the meter as Disc, you are not a good Disc priest. You may even be a very bad one. If you have to throw out that much healing, you aren't mitigating enough.
But of course healers are used to playing with the goal of healing as much damage as possible and focusing on "Who needs healing?" instead of "Who is going to take damage?" It's a tough enough adjustment for them, let alone the uphill battle of educating the non-healers about how Disc works.
Link recount GuessedAbsorbs.
I think I'm usually between 30% absorb/70% healing and 40%/60%.
It's also that with shield > Penance you have incredibly powerful instant burst "healing"
I did a VoA25 run last weekend, and a hunter got hit by something on trash I think.
He went down to 13 hp, because of shield > Penance he was safe from any damage under ~6.5k for the first 1.3 or so seconds and after that healed back to over 60%.
Now in that case (trash before Koralon iirc) there was no further damage, but in different situations where someone's health may suddenly drop very fast disc will simply avoid that player's death where other healers couldn't do the same without blowing a cooldown.
Also, a constant shield/weakened soul on the tanks simply makes healing so much easier.
In short, Disc Priests just take care of a lot of spike damage very effectively.
We're a constant buffer against O SH~! moments.
I think I'm usually between 30% absorb/70% healing and 40%/60%.
It's also that with shield > Penance you have incredibly powerful instant burst "healing"
I did a VoA25 run last weekend, and a hunter got hit by something on trash I think.
He went down to 13 hp, because of shield > Penance he was safe from any damage under ~6.5k for the first 1.3 or so seconds and after that healed back to over 60%.
Now in that case (trash before Koralon iirc) there was no further damage, but in different situations where someone's health may suddenly drop very fast disc will simply avoid that player's death where other healers couldn't do the same without blowing a cooldown.
Also, a constant shield/weakened soul on the tanks simply makes healing so much easier.
In short, Disc Priests just take care of a lot of spike damage very effectively.
We're a constant buffer against O SH~! moments.
That's it, I think. Disc protects against the unknown. People don't die nearly as often to rng with a disc around. Holy too, for that matter. If a holy priest has a disc in the raid, chances are that his shield is not on cd and available for saving a member from that last 5k hit that kills them.
I remind myself that no one should die without weakened soul.
Somewhere in the links I think I came across something that GC said... something like priests are #2 at every healing role. I kind of like that. You may not be king terd on top of s### hill, but you can climb every hill and get your pants dirty (just bring a clothespin for your nose!).
I have only been put in a position to explain my low numbers once (lately), and that was by a druid who may have been skilled, but was ignorant of anything that didn't involve a meter. In that case, I would rather burn my bridges (and raid lockout) than attempt to explain the mechanics of a class he obviously did not understand and didn't care to learn.
well... you may just be a very small pebble =)
I remind myself that no one should die without weakened soul.
Somewhere in the links I think I came across something that GC said... something like priests are #2 at every healing role. I kind of like that. You may not be king terd on top of s### hill, but you can climb every hill and get your pants dirty (just bring a clothespin for your nose!).
I have only been put in a position to explain my low numbers once (lately), and that was by a druid who may have been skilled, but was ignorant of anything that didn't involve a meter. In that case, I would rather burn my bridges (and raid lockout) than attempt to explain the mechanics of a class he obviously did not understand and didn't care to learn.
teacake wrote:
So what you're saying is, if I weigh the same as a duck, I'm a witch, and you may burn me?
Oh and teacake, I agree with you about Disc showing up high in the meters. If I am on tanks as disc, I normally only do around 2-3k hps. If I am on raid it goes up, but not much.
Compare that to the pallies and druids turning in 5k hps and it looks like I went to make a sandwich. (Which I really did- roast beef with cheddar, honey mustard and a thick slice of tomato, but that can be our little secret!)
Compare that to the pallies and druids turning in 5k hps and it looks like I went to make a sandwich. (Which I really did- roast beef with cheddar, honey mustard and a thick slice of tomato, but that can be our little secret!)
Well but that's why we play priests. Throw some shields around, get the PoM ball rolling, and you can make a whole batch of cookies before you need to cast Penance.
I like Disc, I have since I saw the patch stating that Disc would have radical changes.
Preventing damage and keeping folks alive is fun but doesn't show on standard healing meters.
My guilds main healer is a Disc priest and sometimes in PuGs people think he is teribad do to Recount, he then flashes his Skada heals and Absorbs meter to shut people up. It is easier to visually show people the awesomeness of Disc than adding two separate Recount meters.
Preventing damage and keeping folks alive is fun but doesn't show on standard healing meters.
My guilds main healer is a Disc priest and sometimes in PuGs people think he is teribad do to Recount, he then flashes his Skada heals and Absorbs meter to shut people up. It is easier to visually show people the awesomeness of Disc than adding two separate Recount meters.
Hellbanned
idiggory wrote:
Drinking at home. But I could probably stand to get laid.
Yah..sadly people *still* don’t know how effective disc priests really are.
Its something we have all put up with since the start of the expansion.
“lol why ur healz so low??â€
“soz, disc is pvp spec I need pve healrzâ€
Etc etc etc…I
When played correctly disc plays a vital support role to the other healers. You will notice when a good disc priest isn’t in the raid things just “feel†off. At least that’s true for me when I’m on my holy paladin or resto shaman…
Now a days its usually just the non raiders community that that generally don’t keep up to date with the goings on of wow that think disc is underpowered. Now I just ask them if they seriously don’t understand how disc works a year into the expansion. I link things like divine ageis,renewed hope, inspiration,rapture and power infusion. While not all healing, they are all support for a raid.
The biggest problem is that the recount addons, in my minor testing, seem to be grossly overstated. Which doesn’t leave us with much of an option. You have to be confident enough as a healer to know you are making a difference. Of course when a disc priest is bad he is usually REALLY bad which doesn’t bode well for us in the community.
The biggest thing you can do as disc is to see the number of glyph procs you had per fight. That is how I usually gauge if I did well. Keeping weaken soul on the tanks and saving penance for spike damage.
Yah most holy paladins love the meter, can’t say I haven’t smiled at myself after having a good fight. But in the end it comes down to your healing group not individual performances.
tl;dr version: I agree with you and have had similar issues :P
Its something we have all put up with since the start of the expansion.
“lol why ur healz so low??â€
“soz, disc is pvp spec I need pve healrzâ€
Etc etc etc…I
When played correctly disc plays a vital support role to the other healers. You will notice when a good disc priest isn’t in the raid things just “feel†off. At least that’s true for me when I’m on my holy paladin or resto shaman…
Now a days its usually just the non raiders community that that generally don’t keep up to date with the goings on of wow that think disc is underpowered. Now I just ask them if they seriously don’t understand how disc works a year into the expansion. I link things like divine ageis,renewed hope, inspiration,rapture and power infusion. While not all healing, they are all support for a raid.
The biggest problem is that the recount addons, in my minor testing, seem to be grossly overstated. Which doesn’t leave us with much of an option. You have to be confident enough as a healer to know you are making a difference. Of course when a disc priest is bad he is usually REALLY bad which doesn’t bode well for us in the community.
The biggest thing you can do as disc is to see the number of glyph procs you had per fight. That is how I usually gauge if I did well. Keeping weaken soul on the tanks and saving penance for spike damage.
Quote:
the pally healing lead asked for the healing meter
Yah most holy paladins love the meter, can’t say I haven’t smiled at myself after having a good fight. But in the end it comes down to your healing group not individual performances.
tl;dr version: I agree with you and have had similar issues :P
The constant lurker here deciding to type a little ;)
Don't get me wrong I love a pally healer on tank healing but, its always funny when they ask for or link the healing meter themselves in the raid. Yes, they are usually on top but they never seem to ask for the overhealing link. A pally is a spamming healer, casting regardless of damage taken and therefore roughly 50% or more of their heals land on a full healthbar.
I'm with you here. Being a great healer at just about every type of healing situation is what has always kept me madly in love with my priest.
Quote:
the pally healing lead asked for the healing meter after the fights.
Don't get me wrong I love a pally healer on tank healing but, its always funny when they ask for or link the healing meter themselves in the raid. Yes, they are usually on top but they never seem to ask for the overhealing link. A pally is a spamming healer, casting regardless of damage taken and therefore roughly 50% or more of their heals land on a full healthbar.
Quote:
Somewhere in the links I think I came across something that GC said... something like priests are #2 at every healing role. I kind of like that. You may not be king terd on top of s### hill, but you can climb every hill and get your pants dirty (just bring a clothespin for your nose!).
I'm with you here. Being a great healer at just about every type of healing situation is what has always kept me madly in love with my priest.
Overhealing is useless unless your target is dying because you're oom
99% of the time overhealing doesn't matter for jack
99% of the time overhealing doesn't matter for jack
Overhealing is an important stat to watch for a variety of reasons, not all of them negative. Depending on how I am playing my healer, I can convert other's heals into overheals instead of complementing their style (Nice shoes!). Different classes can make adjustments by watching the overheals. Druids may be more selective where they stack their hots, shamans may elect to lhw spam instead of chaining, pallies can move their beacon to a more intelligent target, priests can reduce PoH and rely on Fheal more...
I normally heal 10-mans with a druid. I have kept an eye on it. Over time, her overheals have shrunk, not due to her changing the way she casts, but because I am merely shielding her targets and trusting her hots to ramp up instead of sniping them. I see this as building confidence between healers rather than competing against.
I normally heal 10-mans with a druid. I have kept an eye on it. Over time, her overheals have shrunk, not due to her changing the way she casts, but because I am merely shielding her targets and trusting her hots to ramp up instead of sniping them. I see this as building confidence between healers rather than competing against.
priests are the best snippers in the game =P
I see what you are saying, but I don't really account for overhealing or caring too much
On my paladin I overheal like 70% of the time some fights, i just spam HL on the tanks and let the raid healers do their job
Maybe i'm lazy :P
I see what you are saying, but I don't really account for overhealing or caring too much
On my paladin I overheal like 70% of the time some fights, i just spam HL on the tanks and let the raid healers do their job
Maybe i'm lazy :P
Quote:
Overhealing is useless unless your target is dying because you're oom
99% of the time overhealing doesn't matter for jack
99% of the time overhealing doesn't matter for jack
I wasn't stating the importance of overhealing merely showing that the said pally asking for the meters was /flexing yet like you said most of his healing was probably overhealing. I get a lot of overhealing as holy and significantly less as disc. Disc just makes me feel more effective.
It is pretty obnoxious. I LOVE my disc priest, but those accursed meters...
Last week, after the first fail on Marrowgar in ICC 25, the raid leader just silently booted me, even though I was doing my job well and was one of the last 3 to die. Of course he was a resto druid.
I'm definitely getting that skada addon.
Last week, after the first fail on Marrowgar in ICC 25, the raid leader just silently booted me, even though I was doing my job well and was one of the last 3 to die. Of course he was a resto druid.
I'm definitely getting that skada addon.
We just got to Lich King in our 10 man ICC group.
For that fight...a Disc priest is REQUIRED to pre-shield for Infest. That's all I will say about that.
Ignore the trade trolls.
For that fight...a Disc priest is REQUIRED to pre-shield for Infest. That's all I will say about that.
Ignore the trade trolls.
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