Rogue Vs RogueFollow

I need help. Badly.

So my 2s team in early s6 was sitting around 2050 with a disc priest. I could reliably sap other rogues 90% of the time (Me being human without weakness spectralizers, I could sap 99% of everything that had a lower stealth level/stealth sight combined than me and about 70% of everything that had higher or equal.

My partner ditched me for a 2400 team and I jumped around teams for a while, ending up playing with a full furious retadin for a few weeks. We sat around 2050 as well, until he ditched me as well to help gear his friend's alt DK as holy, and they immediately hit it off and are also around 2400.

So now I'm playing with a decent disc priest who knows how to mind control, mana burn, keep me up etc. well, and is a solid player all around. The only thing she isn't good at is tanking plate classes, but that usually isn't an issue because unless their healer is very badly geared I sit on the plate wearer anyway. Gear isn't really an issue- she's in a mix of furious and a few deadly and I am the same. And I can't sap rogues for my life any more. Even if I manage to sap them, I get outplayed, usually.

I wouldn't say that I got carried by my first disc priest and ret pally- They were better than the priest I play with now, but I know what I'm doing and I have at least 3,000 2v2s under my belt in rateds alone. I was consistently above 1900 in s4 and s3 and I've played as and against every goddamn comp in the game hundreds of times.

It's a matter of my reflexes and thinking on-the-go. In arenas I constantly get sapped by other rogues and then dominated. The games last for a few minutes but I am always the one that ends up dying. There are a few things I've noticed that tend to happen:
Me sapping another rogue and then cheap shotting them: They trinket>vanish>cs me before I can hit FoK. Usually I 5-pt rupture them because if they blind me with a 2 pt rupture up they can still restealth. But then there's the chance of them just trinket>vanishing before I get my rupture down, and either I'm caught in between GCDs for FoK or i'm too slow to vanish before they open on me. If I try to pull the same trick on rogues that sap me, I end up using eviscerate on them, because my bar doesn't switch to stealth fast enough and evis and CS are on the same keybind but one in stealth one not.

Another thing that happens is me getting owned when both me and the other rogue vanishes. I can't run properly away from FoK and I can't properly FoK people out of stealth, and I resort to FoK because I can never see people when we are both vanished with the whatever +570 stealth buff up.

I've tried a bunch of different sap macros, none of which have particularly helped. Some issues with sapping that I encounter are these: Spamming tab sap while in the vicinity of more than 1 enemy entity causes me to usually target things that aren't in stealth (which can be remedied by making a macro that says target=stealth), seeing someone in stealth before they see me but 1 or more of us are sprinting and I can't position myself correctly to sap them before they go out of sight, both of us seeing each other and sapping each other at the same time while I have as much as 4.66 levels of stealth sight more than them (I spam sap quite quickly while in stealth, so it's not like they caught me in between clicks), and lastly me seeing them and trying to turn around to sap them but they sap me first (the issue being that every decent rogue I face is better at mouse turning than I am, even though I've been doing it since release). I have also tried moving in different patterns to try and sap people- For example, just mouse moving in every direction randomly, strafing in large circles, small circles, etc.

As you can see I have overthought and underthought the whole sapping ordeal a lot, and I simply can't pull it off like other rogues can. The last issue about my sapping problems is that my latency usually hovers around 36ms- giving me a HUGE advantage against other people who, in my experience, have at least a few hundred ms latency at most times. And yet, I still get destroyed.

I've watched a lot of rogue videos, and I've absorbed some of the tricks and just simple playing style that some famous rogues have utilized (Unmercey being my favorite with his ambush sap trick that I can't for the life of me pull off) but my mind just must not be wired to play rogue vs rogue in WotLK.

So, for you that survived this minor wall of text without just thinking 'this guy must be horrible, because i am one of those rogues in full hateful that keeps killing him' (which is certainly possibly true, but didn't used to be), here's what I'm going to do: Record some videos of me playing 2v2, PMR 3v3 ((which i'm playing the worst at- my mage is incredible at CC and keeps me alive when I get sapped most of the time, and then the game turns into a huge CD-wasting fight to keep me alive in which I blow cloak just to get wound poison off because my priest can dispel other things like immolate/flame shock/frozen) and where I madly try to stay facing all the phys. dps that's fighting me so evasion works) and just duels against rogues.

Don't get me wrong, I can still beat rogues with equal stealth as me in duels that are rated hundreds of points higher than me, but in arenas I just get waxed most of the time, proven by the fact that my 2s is 1800 with me in furious/deadly with t1 furious weapons compared to back when i was at 2050 with hateful, nax 10 gear and titansteel shanker/Anarchy.

One last question: Reduce Input Lag. It's a video setting that I've been playing with and toggling on and off. It describes the setting saying that it reduces input lag but may reduce frame rates- My fps is not a problem and is regularly 60+ in cluster-fawk 3v3s but I haven't noticed any difference input ==> output wise. (Like for example Trinket>vanish>cheap shot because my bars would switch faster because of reduce input lag, but that doesn't happen. Do you guys use it or notice any difference switching it on and off?

Please stay tuned!


Edited, Jul 29th 2009 12:11am by morgorg

I actually just got my Xfire working.


Running Ret/Rogue at 2400 and RLS at 2500MMR. I'll be recording clips and streaming now and then.


I really dunno what to tell you about sap. The only race that usually saps me is human. Most others I see and get with spam/sap easy enough.


I'll just start recording a ton of clips. Look in my sig for my Xfire name and I'll make some thread or something about clips I post.

~~~~~

You are going to need a Spam sap and then a hotkey to just single target sap. So, when you need that one person sapped you dont have your spam sap changing it all the time.

Edited, Jul 29th 2009 7:10am by MYteddy

Thanks for everybody's response- I'll be sure to check out your Xfire page.