Yes that's right. It might be a bug at this point but I had LnL proc back to back last night on XT-002. Five ES's in a row.
I'm hoping this is working as intended since BA (dot with a lull due to cooldown) procs lock and load instead of serpent sting now.
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Lock and Load internal cooldown removedFollow
It's not really news that the cooldown was removed.
They kind of had to remove it too with BA having a cooldown.
They kind of had to remove it too with BA having a cooldown.
Not necessarily. Since you can still proc it with frost traps on adds the number of procs per fight would probably have remained the same. You'd have to wait for your next BA cooldown before you could proc it anyways. At least on fights with adds.
At first I was under the assumption that they made it so that it procced once every BA as that was my experiance with it up until last night.
At first I was under the assumption that they made it so that it procced once every BA as that was my experiance with it up until last night.
Scholar
48 posts
Maybe I haven't been paying enough attention to it, but I haven't seen L&L proc every BA. I'll try to run a heroic and watch it a bit closer, though.
It doesn't proc every BA. It just seemed that way to me as I was used to only seeing it every 50 seconds or so before the change.
Scholar
18 posts
I haven't seen a black arrow shot or LNL since the patch. The only way I could get LNL to proc was on a test dummy with a frozen arrow.
Rotations the same ES,SpS,AS,SS,SS,ES,AS,SS,SS.....wash/rinse repeat
The talent spec is correct and glyphs are Kill, SPS, and ES
Pet is doing about 200dps on dummies unbuffed.....things just seem off any ideas that jump out at you without a WWS report?
Rotations the same ES,SpS,AS,SS,SS,ES,AS,SS,SS.....wash/rinse repeat
The talent spec is correct and glyphs are Kill, SPS, and ES
Pet is doing about 200dps on dummies unbuffed.....things just seem off any ideas that jump out at you without a WWS report?
Scholar
18 posts
I haven't seen a black arrow shot or LNL since the patch. The only way I could get LNL to proc was on a test dummy with a frozen arrow.
Rotations the same ES,SpS,AS,SS,SS,ES,AS,SS,SS.....wash/rinse repeat
The talent spec is correct and glyphs are Kill, SPS, and ES
Pet is doing about 200dps on dummies unbuffed.....things just seem off any ideas that jump out at you without a WWS report?
Rotations the same ES,SpS,AS,SS,SS,ES,AS,SS,SS.....wash/rinse repeat
The talent spec is correct and glyphs are Kill, SPS, and ES
Pet is doing about 200dps on dummies unbuffed.....things just seem off any ideas that jump out at you without a WWS report?
Don't rotate, prioritize.
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Don't rotate, prioritize.
To make this a little clearer for many, it means in the shots you select (what you are calling rotations) you prioritize what shots you fire: Kill, Black Arrow, Explosive Shot, Serpent Sting, Multi-Shot, Steady Shot. Rotations for many of us "old timers" -hunters who have been around for a few patch changes- means set shot sequences (that could be written into a macro if you wanted). This used to be the norm, but now you fire whatever shot is off CD or going to be off CD, depending on what shot will give you more DPS.
Scholar
34 posts
Jimpadan wrote:
Not necessarily. Since you can still proc it with frost traps on adds the number of procs per fight would probably have remained the same. You'd have to wait for your next BA cooldown before you could proc it anyways. At least on fights with adds.
At first I was under the assumption that they made it so that it procced once every BA as that was my experiance with it up until last night.
At first I was under the assumption that they made it so that it procced once every BA as that was my experiance with it up until last night.
I have not had it proc every BA.. but is this true? Can you get a BA proc and Frost Trap Proc? I thought BA and FT shared a CD so I am unsure how this really helps.
browningguns wrote:
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Don't rotate, prioritize.
To make this a little clearer for many, it means in the shots you select (what you are calling rotations) you prioritize what shots you fire: Kill, Black Arrow, Explosive Shot, Serpent Sting, Multi-Shot, Steady Shot. Rotations for many of us "old timers" -hunters who have been around for a few patch changes- means set shot sequences (that could be written into a macro if you wanted). This used to be the norm, but now you fire whatever shot is off CD or going to be off CD, depending on what shot will give you more DPS.
Correct with regards to Rotations for the more long term player being a macro, but the list of shots that were posted above by kaetamoon is the same way I roll through my shots, although BA is up first and ES and BA CD quicker meaning they get used as soon as they are up, but overall -
Hunters Mark
BA
SpSt
ES
AS
SS
SS
Is a pattern you can rely on for at least your first two rounds of gunning at the target and then it becomes prioritize time like Aethien said, and inevitably you will find, due to the timers, that you come back to this rotation again anyway.
On a side note I have tried both of the current listed top 2 DPS survival Specs, one for those more mana cautious and the other for overall DPS maximization. These came from Aethien and others have given a good write up for it. What I want to know is has anyone seen a big increase in their DPS overall with the addition of BA etc whilst using these Builds?
Queen Morganne wrote:
Hunters Mark
BA
SpSt
ES
AS
SS
SS
BA
SpSt
ES
AS
SS
SS
This probably isn't the best shot sequence, when you look at some CD's you will have multiple shots coming off CD at the same time which can cause you to loose DPS. Sorry for the following string of text, I am still unsure of how to format correctly in the forums
using your shots it would look something like this (the first number is the next time the shot can be fired, then the shot name and last is the combat timer) this is also assuming a Steady timer of 1.5 (optimum shot time, but not a reality for most)
(24.0) BlA 00.0
(16.5) SrS 01.5
(09.0) ExS 03.0
(14.5) MtS 04.5
-------- SdS 06.0
-------- SdS 07.5
(15.0) ExS 09.0
-------- SdS 10.5
-------- SdS 12.0
-------- SdS 13.5
-----------------15.0 <- here you have both Multi and Explosive
a little variation to that rotation gives you
(24.0) BlA 00.0
(07.5) ExS 01.5
(18.0) SrS 03.0
(14.5) MtS 04.5
-------- SdS 06.0
(13.5) ExS 07.5
-------- SdS 09.0
-------- SdS 10.5
-------- SdS 12.0
(19.5) ExS 13.5
(25.0) MtS 15.0
-------- SdS 16.5
(33.0) SrS 18.0
On long boss fights timers will overlap like the first example, but this rotation (at least for me) seems to flow better.
EDIT: edited to try to align things more
Edited, Apr 24th 2009 10:25am by browningguns
@Browningguns - that is a very nice post.
I think though that hunters should not be looking for a set rotation. Even if you can get that mathematically perfect rotation, 1 of 2 things will happen to ***** it up. You will have to move or LNL will proc. As stated and shown elsewhere:
Killshot>BA>SpS>Exp>Aim/multi>Steady
There may be a case for Explosive before SpS however I find that hitting BA and Explosive before the tank has solid aggro can be a problem. In my experience getting the 2 dots up first provides just enough time for the tank to get his groove.
Keeping track of all this while trying to maximize sniper training in a new raid environment is quite entertaining.
I think though that hunters should not be looking for a set rotation. Even if you can get that mathematically perfect rotation, 1 of 2 things will happen to ***** it up. You will have to move or LNL will proc. As stated and shown elsewhere:
Killshot>BA>SpS>Exp>Aim/multi>Steady
There may be a case for Explosive before SpS however I find that hitting BA and Explosive before the tank has solid aggro can be a problem. In my experience getting the 2 dots up first provides just enough time for the tank to get his groove.
Keeping track of all this while trying to maximize sniper training in a new raid environment is quite entertaining.
Sweathog wrote:
I think though that hunters should not be looking for a set rotation. Even if you can get that mathematically perfect rotation
That isn't a rotation, once my CD shots are fired I am on a priority basis, which you can see by looking at the shots in between Explosive.
Sweathog wrote:
There may be a case for Explosive before SpS however I find that hitting BA and Explosive before the tank has solid aggro can be a problem. In my experience getting the 2 dots up first provides just enough time for the tank to get his groove.
Yes I can see your point here, although I didn't post it in the combat sequence, I have to FD during my fights sometime- normally I just do it earlier. I also have the luxury of running with guild tanks most of the time where initial aggro isn't a problem- and I always seem to end up with the warrior buff! :P
Sweathog wrote:
You will have to move or LNL will proc.
LNL does put the wrench in all things that look like a rotation, thus Blizz's way of removing castsequences. I normally don't get a proc of LNL until later in my BA DoT so I like firing off ExS earlier to make sure my CD is up (once again personal preference, I haven't done any hard number crunching to look at DPS min/maxing)
One thing I am curious about though is with sniper training whether the increased range is better than some other options in the builds. I haven't done a lot of Ulduar, but some of the fights in Naxx your movement can be decreased a lot with the farther range = damage bonus up longer. I'll have to journey to EJ to check if this has been tested.
I wont quote Browningguns reply :) its a bit of a page filler, but thanks for tweaking it.
I agree that getting DOT's up does let the tank get a little more time to get a good hold of aggro and starts your damage of immediately.
What I posted however is not a specific Shot rotation. It is more what i find naturally flows from my fingers when pew pewing at a boss. It is awesome for Patch and Loetheb. (I have not been into Ulduar as yet so cannot possibly comment on those bosses).
However I agree with the variables and of course LnL proccing does mean any form of rotation goes out of the window, but then it is a whole new rotation in itself and once it is up I can normally revert to the previous rotation in a loose manner.
Keep up the good thoughts on this, anything that can improve me is much appreciated.
I agree that getting DOT's up does let the tank get a little more time to get a good hold of aggro and starts your damage of immediately.
What I posted however is not a specific Shot rotation. It is more what i find naturally flows from my fingers when pew pewing at a boss. It is awesome for Patch and Loetheb. (I have not been into Ulduar as yet so cannot possibly comment on those bosses).
However I agree with the variables and of course LnL proccing does mean any form of rotation goes out of the window, but then it is a whole new rotation in itself and once it is up I can normally revert to the previous rotation in a loose manner.
Keep up the good thoughts on this, anything that can improve me is much appreciated.
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