I recently turned 80 and just got my first taste of raiding (10 Naxx-after gearing up for a bit). I was just curios, at what point is it a good idea to start doing heroics? Is there some kind of progression (level 80 dungeons > 10 man raids > Heroics > 25 man raids), or is are there some other cues? I'd rather not list myslef for heroics if I'm not ready for them, but I would like to try them.
Any pointers?
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When to be able to do heroics..Follow
Well actually, people usually use heroics to gear up for 10-man Naxx. If you've done alright in there you should be fine in all heroics.
Well, here's my armory link: Link! he'll come to town.. come to save that princess Zelda...
I've been following the very nice gear guide and only have 1 item I really want to replace (trinket), namely with that reg CoS trinket...
I've been following the very nice gear guide and only have 1 item I really want to replace (trinket), namely with that reg CoS trinket...
Your armory would be very helpful
Heroics are more a skill check than a gear check in my opinion. You can heal most heroics with quest greens/blues. It's knowing which spells are optimal at which points and how to get people out of trouble, that's the key.
Since we don't really know how well you play, or how comfortable you are with healing, the only solid advice we can offer is to get gear from regular level 80 instances, and you will be more than adequate for heroics.
Oh as far as technical progression, progression generally conceived to be Regulars > Heroics > 10 man > 25 man. From my experience I would say it's more along the lines of:
Regular >> Heroics > 10-man > 25-man > 10-man > heroics.
Confusing right? lol.
Regular instances are easy.
Then you head into some heroics which are easier than anything else in the game(Nexus, UK as an example).
Then some 10 mans are next in line for difficulty (Vault, OS, Spider/Plague wings of Naxx)
Then some 25 mans (same list as the 10 mans)
Then some heroics(AN, CoS timed, Oculus)
Then some 10 man content (the rest of the wings in naxx, EoE)
Then some 25 man content (repeats 10-man list)
Basically, what I am getting at is, some heroics are harder than some 10 and 25 man content, some heroics are easier, some 25 man content is easier than some 10 man content.
Edit: Yeah I know you posted your armory, I'm not going to change my post, I started typing this before anyone responded.
Edited, Apr 7th 2009 3:46pm by SynnTastic
Heroics are more a skill check than a gear check in my opinion. You can heal most heroics with quest greens/blues. It's knowing which spells are optimal at which points and how to get people out of trouble, that's the key.
Since we don't really know how well you play, or how comfortable you are with healing, the only solid advice we can offer is to get gear from regular level 80 instances, and you will be more than adequate for heroics.
Oh as far as technical progression, progression generally conceived to be Regulars > Heroics > 10 man > 25 man. From my experience I would say it's more along the lines of:
Regular >> Heroics > 10-man > 25-man > 10-man > heroics.
Confusing right? lol.
Regular instances are easy.
Then you head into some heroics which are easier than anything else in the game(Nexus, UK as an example).
Then some 10 mans are next in line for difficulty (Vault, OS, Spider/Plague wings of Naxx)
Then some 25 mans (same list as the 10 mans)
Then some heroics(AN, CoS timed, Oculus)
Then some 10 man content (the rest of the wings in naxx, EoE)
Then some 25 man content (repeats 10-man list)
Basically, what I am getting at is, some heroics are harder than some 10 and 25 man content, some heroics are easier, some 25 man content is easier than some 10 man content.
Edit: Yeah I know you posted your armory, I'm not going to change my post, I started typing this before anyone responded.
Edited, Apr 7th 2009 3:46pm by SynnTastic
Let me warn you off Soul Preserver from reg CoS.
I used it myself until I really looked into it's effects. The mana effect is neigh useless. I used the Procodile add-on to count how many times it actually came up during an instance. 1 or 2, if I was lucky. Reasonably you get more like 15-25 procs off of the 2 minute cooldown trinkets.
The constant 75 spellpower is nice, don't get me wrong. But it's nothing a well placed enchantment or two couldn't do. Enchant gloves - exceptional spellpower and enchant weapon - exceptional spellpower would pretty much cover it for you for the fairly reasonable price of 14 Infinite Dust, 2 Greater Cosmic Essence and 1 Lesser Cosmic Essence.
May I suggest instead Cannoneer's Fuselighter if your interested in throughput, Valonforth's Rememberance if your interested in longevity, and Darkmoon Card: Illusion if you want the best of both worlds and are willing to pay the price.
- Cannoneer's Fuselighter is a reward at the end of a fairly entertaining quest chain in Icecrown. It's in the use-for-spellpower-20second-duration-2minute-cooldown family of trinkets clocking in at 281 Spellpower with a constant 54 critical strike (1.2%).
- Valonforth's Remembrance has a static 16MP5 and occasionally grants 222 Spirit for 10 seconds with 15% proc chance and an internal cooldown of 45 seconds. It comes from a quest chain in Dragonblight. So long as you maintain at least 850 Intellect and have full Meditation it bangs out to about 20MP5 (assuming all procs occur I5SR). On the surface this doesn't appear much different from your current 19MP5 Spiritist's Focus. Except Valonforth's Rememberance's reliance on Spirit means not only does an increase in Intellect raise the potential MP5, but having one or both ticks occur O5SR also increases the MP5 as well.
- Darkmoon Card: Illusion is from the 5-minute-cooldown school of trinketry, granting a negliably useful sheild and a very useful 1,200 mana. This is another whose effect evens out to about 20MP5, not to mention it has the very tempting 100 static Spellpower. Purchaseable, although expensive and can only be redeemed for the trinket via a quest available during/at the Darkmoon Fair.
Edited, Apr 8th 2009 2:11am by Zemzelette
I used it myself until I really looked into it's effects. The mana effect is neigh useless. I used the Procodile add-on to count how many times it actually came up during an instance. 1 or 2, if I was lucky. Reasonably you get more like 15-25 procs off of the 2 minute cooldown trinkets.
The constant 75 spellpower is nice, don't get me wrong. But it's nothing a well placed enchantment or two couldn't do. Enchant gloves - exceptional spellpower and enchant weapon - exceptional spellpower would pretty much cover it for you for the fairly reasonable price of 14 Infinite Dust, 2 Greater Cosmic Essence and 1 Lesser Cosmic Essence.
May I suggest instead Cannoneer's Fuselighter if your interested in throughput, Valonforth's Rememberance if your interested in longevity, and Darkmoon Card: Illusion if you want the best of both worlds and are willing to pay the price.
- Cannoneer's Fuselighter is a reward at the end of a fairly entertaining quest chain in Icecrown. It's in the use-for-spellpower-20second-duration-2minute-cooldown family of trinkets clocking in at 281 Spellpower with a constant 54 critical strike (1.2%).
- Valonforth's Remembrance has a static 16MP5 and occasionally grants 222 Spirit for 10 seconds with 15% proc chance and an internal cooldown of 45 seconds. It comes from a quest chain in Dragonblight. So long as you maintain at least 850 Intellect and have full Meditation it bangs out to about 20MP5 (assuming all procs occur I5SR). On the surface this doesn't appear much different from your current 19MP5 Spiritist's Focus. Except Valonforth's Rememberance's reliance on Spirit means not only does an increase in Intellect raise the potential MP5, but having one or both ticks occur O5SR also increases the MP5 as well.
- Darkmoon Card: Illusion is from the 5-minute-cooldown school of trinketry, granting a negliably useful sheild and a very useful 1,200 mana. This is another whose effect evens out to about 20MP5, not to mention it has the very tempting 100 static Spellpower. Purchaseable, although expensive and can only be redeemed for the trinket via a quest available during/at the Darkmoon Fair.
Edited, Apr 8th 2009 2:11am by Zemzelette
Dude, don't diss the Soul Preserver.
Of course you can get 75 spellpower from other stuff, but that's not the point. The point is that spellpower is a stat that's always welcome, and thus there's nothing wrong with having it as the sole stat on a trinket. It beats spirit for example, as such a stat is more spec-based.
As for the procs, I'd say your add-on is bugged or you didn't test it intensively enough. The proc chance on it is 2% per spell hit (which means there's as much as 10% proc chance on your AOE spells) and the trinket doesn't have an internal cooldown. The reason it's currently probably the best trinket before you get a Sart/Naxx 25 trinket is because this because the -800 mana cost makes some of your spells free, thus allowing you to get out of the 5SR. And to make it even better, all this is spoken from a disc priests' perspective. The trinket rocks even more for holy priests with Circle of Healing.
Right now, the trinket is at the least an incredibly nifty one until you seriously get into raiding, especially for holy priests. That said, it'll become worse next patch when the O5SR mana regeneration is nerfed. I predict it to be roughly equal to 5-man heroic trinkets by then.
Of course you can get 75 spellpower from other stuff, but that's not the point. The point is that spellpower is a stat that's always welcome, and thus there's nothing wrong with having it as the sole stat on a trinket. It beats spirit for example, as such a stat is more spec-based.
As for the procs, I'd say your add-on is bugged or you didn't test it intensively enough. The proc chance on it is 2% per spell hit (which means there's as much as 10% proc chance on your AOE spells) and the trinket doesn't have an internal cooldown. The reason it's currently probably the best trinket before you get a Sart/Naxx 25 trinket is because this because the -800 mana cost makes some of your spells free, thus allowing you to get out of the 5SR. And to make it even better, all this is spoken from a disc priests' perspective. The trinket rocks even more for holy priests with Circle of Healing.
Right now, the trinket is at the least an incredibly nifty one until you seriously get into raiding, especially for holy priests. That said, it'll become worse next patch when the O5SR mana regeneration is nerfed. I predict it to be roughly equal to 5-man heroic trinkets by then.
Hmmmm.
I gave it a run of 2 mid-level heroics and 1 easy heroic.
But I usually find myself agreeing with you, Moz. So I'll give it another chance, as soon as I can find another add-on that will track Healing Trance.
If it isn't the add-on, the only thing I can think of that might account for the discrepancy of our perspectives, is the low difficulty of the content I'm testing with and my personal healing style making an environment Soul Preserver can't excel in. I definitely lean more to the side of Mitigation than straight-up Healing, and I have the good fortune of mostly running with tanks I know.
Edited, Apr 8th 2009 12:39pm by Zemzelette
I gave it a run of 2 mid-level heroics and 1 easy heroic.
But I usually find myself agreeing with you, Moz. So I'll give it another chance, as soon as I can find another add-on that will track Healing Trance.
If it isn't the add-on, the only thing I can think of that might account for the discrepancy of our perspectives, is the low difficulty of the content I'm testing with and my personal healing style making an environment Soul Preserver can't excel in. I definitely lean more to the side of Mitigation than straight-up Healing, and I have the good fortune of mostly running with tanks I know.
Edited, Apr 8th 2009 12:39pm by Zemzelette
Zemzelette wrote:
Let me warn you off Soul Preserver from reg CoS.
I would really have to question your test.
Where exactly did you test it, how many runs?
2% is 2%, so it's very dependent on how often you cast. In most instances I've ran the lack of casting, usually consisting of some renews, a few pom, and sporadic flash/greater heals per fight would make any proc trinket look like crap.
On the other hand, healing intensive fights, even more so AoE healing intensive fights like Sapph and Patchwerk, make trinkets like these shine.
Your 1-2 procs during an instance makes me believe you are healing very little, my own experience with the trinket, as well as many forums I've read since you posted has suggested a very decent proc rate.
Soul Preserver is one of the better pre-raid trinkets available. None of the trinkets you listed are bad either (although personally I would go with Cannoneer's Morale over Fuselight), but soul preserver is right up there at the top for pre-raid trinkets. After all, their only purpose is to have appropriate gear to get into raids, which offer much better trinkets.
But like I said before, all the trinkets(with the exception of DMC, that one is on par with raid/heroic gear, so you really can't put it in the same category) you listed, as well as the Soul Preserver are pre-raid trinkets. They are meant to get you geared for raids/heroics, all will work well enough, at the same time I wouldn't break my back trying to get any of them, since they will be replaced very easily.
Side note about your DMC: Illusion. Of course it's a better trinket, your comparing a iL187 trinket to a iL200 trinket of similar effects, that's kind of like saying "why get the Heroism Helm when the Valorous Helm is better".
Edit: Damnit posting from work, you responded to Moz before I finished typing, basically confirming the possibility of the lack of required healing on those test runs... I'll keep my post up since it still has significance, but I did start typing it long before you responded.
Edited, Apr 8th 2009 1:14pm by SynnTastic
Quote:
Damnit posting from work, you responded to Moz before I finished typing
::comfort::
Happens to me all the time.
Only reason I bothered to mention DMC:Illusion, is because unlike trinkets of the same caliber you don't need to run anything to get it. You can just throw money in it's general direction and receive instant gratification. I'm not sure how it is on other servers, but when the Darkmoon Fair is in town the whole deck slips down to 350-550k, which on the lower end of things is comparable in price of the thread the OP has sewn in his pants.
Same general arguement can be made for Je'tze's Bell, but with a much less friendly pricetag.
Edited, Apr 8th 2009 2:04pm by Zemzelette
Zemzelette wrote:
Quote:
Damnit posting from work, you responded to Moz before I finished typing
::comfort::
Happens to me all the time.
Only reason I bothered to mention DMC:Illusion, is because unlike trinkets of the same caliber you don't need to run anything to get it. You can just throw money in it's general direction and receive instant gratification. Same can be said for Je'tze's Bell, but with a much less friendly pricetag.
But, at the same time Je'tze's Bell is a BiS item, so once you buy it you won't replace it ever in current content. There are quiet a few trinkets(depending on spec and playstyle) in both 10 and 25 man that could easily replace the DMC.
But again, to reiterate, none of the trinkets listed are bad, they all work well for their intents, the soul preserver is among them and shouldn't be callously cast aside, but there isn't a need to excessively seek it out either.
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