I'm the best geared DK in my raid group. We have one Frost spec that tanks normally. We also have one other Unholy, plus a back up unholy. I am almost always the top dps, hitting 4.6k dps at my max(no +damage mods like thaddius). My average patchwerk has been around 4.0k-4.4k.
(the armory is broken atm) I have a four set bonus with three t7.5 and one t7. Ill have the darkmoon card in a week or two. I still have a titansteel destroyer, which is a bit fast. I am sitting at 3.5k ap and 30% crit unbuffed. I don't have any armor pen as of right now.
What do you guys think? I am planning on waiting for a new weapon, but I am sick and tired of fighting for ebon plague.
Edited, Mar 24th 2009 3:33pm by ramera
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You probably want a better weapon. And, you said it yourself, some a.pen would be nice.
But, I wouldn't be surprised if DB was = your Unholy Spec right now, with the rest of your gear.
But, I wouldn't be surprised if DB was = your Unholy Spec right now, with the rest of your gear.
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people
lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
When the servers go up, I might spec and reglyph. I have a raid to night, it will be a decent test I suppose.
Armory is back up, if you would like to link it now.^^
Meanwhile, I'll browse EJ and see what their benchmark for a DB transition is...
Meanwhile, I'll browse EJ and see what their benchmark for a DB transition is...
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people
lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
Me!
And ignore the warsong's favor.... I am the most unlucky ******* ever. I have failed on 3 rolls for loatheb, 2 heroic nexus and H UP has failed to drop. I leveled with the plan to tank so I vendored all dps trinkets or simply picked tank stuff instead...
And ignore the warsong's favor.... I am the most unlucky ******* ever. I have failed on 3 rolls for loatheb, 2 heroic nexus and H UP has failed to drop. I leveled with the plan to tank so I vendored all dps trinkets or simply picked tank stuff instead...
I can't find any real info on when to switch to DB, but I have to say you look good to my eyes (but I'd wait for Theo or Therion to chime in, unless you just want to go ahead and try it).
Just four notes (two of which you know):
1. Try and get a better weapon. DB is all about your MWD, so it being lower is not good. You're probably high enough to at least tie with Unholy though.
2. You could use a small bit more expertise. I believe something like 25-28 is the magic number for a DpS, which will push Dodge off the table, which is always nice. I think your hit could be slightly higher, too, but I'm not sure on that one (either way, you should be fine with both to go DB, they'll just boost DpS).
3. It seems you don't really need to worry about Armor Penetration. EJ seems to feel like the talents +Sunder/Expose are more than enough. Though, if gearing, Armor Pen > Haste.
4. Switch to the Sigil of the Dark Rider. Math says that yours only has a 5% uptime, where that one will add 90 damage to 8 strikes out of each rotation.
Other than that, make sure you have Glyph of Obliterate and Glyph of Blood Strike (which, apparently, also works for Blood Strike). At the moment, I would suggest Ghoul for the 3rd, considering Blood is a high Strength build, giving the ghoul an extra 40% is quite nice.
For minor glyphs, it is pretty much whatever you want. HoW is great. Raise Dead means you don't need Corpse Dust. Blood Tap means you no take damage (though you will probably make it back up in seconds with Blood Presence). The last real option is Death's Embrace, for when you are soloing an elite or something (or maybe saving your ghoul from an unfortunate double AoE hit, without sacrificing 40 RP).
Others know more about DB than me--this is just what I found at EJ, mixed with some opinion.
Just four notes (two of which you know):
1. Try and get a better weapon. DB is all about your MWD, so it being lower is not good. You're probably high enough to at least tie with Unholy though.
2. You could use a small bit more expertise. I believe something like 25-28 is the magic number for a DpS, which will push Dodge off the table, which is always nice. I think your hit could be slightly higher, too, but I'm not sure on that one (either way, you should be fine with both to go DB, they'll just boost DpS).
3. It seems you don't really need to worry about Armor Penetration. EJ seems to feel like the talents +Sunder/Expose are more than enough. Though, if gearing, Armor Pen > Haste.
4. Switch to the Sigil of the Dark Rider. Math says that yours only has a 5% uptime, where that one will add 90 damage to 8 strikes out of each rotation.
Other than that, make sure you have Glyph of Obliterate and Glyph of Blood Strike (which, apparently, also works for Blood Strike). At the moment, I would suggest Ghoul for the 3rd, considering Blood is a high Strength build, giving the ghoul an extra 40% is quite nice.
For minor glyphs, it is pretty much whatever you want. HoW is great. Raise Dead means you don't need Corpse Dust. Blood Tap means you no take damage (though you will probably make it back up in seconds with Blood Presence). The last real option is Death's Embrace, for when you are soloing an elite or something (or maybe saving your ghoul from an unfortunate double AoE hit, without sacrificing 40 RP).
Others know more about DB than me--this is just what I found at EJ, mixed with some opinion.
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people
lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
idiggory wrote:
2. You could use a small bit more expertise. I believe something like 25-28 is the magic number for a DpS, which will push Dodge off the table, which is always nice. I think your hit could be slightly higher, too, but I'm not sure on that one (either way, you should be fine with both to go DB, they'll just boost DpS).
You need 20 Expertise as a Blood spec, thanks to getting 6 from talents. So, three more to ignore dodge. You should always be behind the boss, so more expertise is worthless. On a similar note, you have more than enough hit; only need enough for 8% and you have almost 9%. Only thing that helps with are DC and IT after 8%.
That's all I know, really. Your gear is very nice. I'd try out Blood and see how it goes.
Yeah, Im not sure what Im going to do for a sigil. I dont have that one anymore.
Ive already tested it in a heroic VH, not ideal but I got somewhat used to the rotation.
I am using OB, ghoul and blood strike glyphs.
Virulence helps pick up most of that as well.
Edited, Mar 24th 2009 3:43pm by ramera
Ive already tested it in a heroic VH, not ideal but I got somewhat used to the rotation.
I am using OB, ghoul and blood strike glyphs.
Quote:
Only thing that helps with are DC and IT after 8%
Virulence helps pick up most of that as well.
Edited, Mar 24th 2009 3:43pm by ramera
Quote:
You need 20 Expertise as a Blood spec, thanks to getting 6 from talents. So, three more to ignore dodge. You should always be behind the boss, so more expertise is worthless. On a similar note, you have more than enough hit; only need enough for 8% and you have almost 9%. Only thing that helps with are DC and IT after 8%.
That's all I know, really. Your gear is very nice. I'd try out Blood and see how it goes.
His hit is 8.6% increased chance to hit a level 80 mob, no? So he needs more for an 83?
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people
lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
idiggory wrote:
Quote:
You need 20 Expertise as a Blood spec, thanks to getting 6 from talents. So, three more to ignore dodge. You should always be behind the boss, so more expertise is worthless. On a similar note, you have more than enough hit; only need enough for 8% and you have almost 9%. Only thing that helps with are DC and IT after 8%.
That's all I know, really. Your gear is very nice. I'd try out Blood and see how it goes.
His hit is 8.6% increased chance to hit a level 80 mob, no? So he needs more for an 83?
5% to hit a level 80 mob, 1% more for each level, making it 8% hit to not miss a raid boss.
Just got out of 25 OS. Glad to say I got my t7.5 gloves finally, but I hated it! Most of the time I couldn't break 3k. Am I doing something seriously wrong?
OB> OB> HS> RP dump > HS >HS> HS>HS> dumping
I popping trinkets + DRW with hysteria and unholy strength.
Quote:
5% to hit a level 80 mob, 1% more for each level, making it 8% hit to not miss a raid boss.
Ah, got it, thanks.
Quote:
Just got out of 25 OS. Glad to say I got my t7.5 gloves finally, but I hated it! Most of the time I couldn't break 3k. Am I doing something seriously wrong?
OB> OB> HS> RP dump > HS >HS> HS>HS> dumping
I popping trinkets + DRW with hysteria and unholy strength.
OB>OB>HS>HS>RP dump> HS>HS>HS>HS>HS>HS> RP dump, repeat.
Other than that, it may just be that you need a better weapon.
What exactly is the spec you have?
[EDIT]
And, are you remembering to use your Empowered Rune Weapon, Blood Tap and Army of Dead (not sure what the current status of this is, but I remember reading it doesn't taunt bosses so is pure, safe DpS) CDs?
Edited, Mar 24th 2009 5:27pm by idiggory
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people
lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
How many drakes? I ask because the melee strat is different for either. You can't compare Patchwerk numbers to Sarth numbers, they're diametrically opposed fights. Regardless, as melee your goal is simple: Optimize uptime on target, don't grab aggro.
Assuming 0- or 1-drake, some suggestions: Look for ways to stay on top of Sarth when the waves come. In my guild we tank him in one of the wall-clear areas and the tank strafes to the other safe area (center) when the other wall comes along. You can do similar with your positioning and not lose a single GCD. I usually just run between his hind legs (avoiding the tail of course) and get safe. Be sure you don't get close to his front legs as his swipe and breath start-points are in his head rather than at the end of his snout.
Your other main concern is getting to and from the blazes when AoE is called (assuming you are being directed to help with AoE) which is a big loss of up-time but can't really be helped. Depending on where the blaze group is being tanked I sometimes blow the runes and swap to Unholy Presence then to Blood Presence to help speed up the run over (while jump-turning Death Coils at Sarth along the way). Honestly though, presence swapping isn't all that helpful unless you're running entirely across the island and I've started to drop the practice but wanted to note it all the same.
Be sure to time your cooldowns to when Bloodlust/Heroism is called which is usually in the 25-30% of boss health area unless your group has time for two calls. Hope it doesn't =)
I also have Speed pots tied to my Hysteria but it's a pretty minor DPS increase. Not a major concern if you're not min/maxing.
3k is fair for melee on that fight especially considering your weapon. Don't beat yourself up about it too much. Keep plugging away, look for some Jawbone or better upgrade and don't stop experimenting and learning.
Oh, also, you may want to reconsider your trinkets.
Hope that helps. Good luck!
Assuming 0- or 1-drake, some suggestions: Look for ways to stay on top of Sarth when the waves come. In my guild we tank him in one of the wall-clear areas and the tank strafes to the other safe area (center) when the other wall comes along. You can do similar with your positioning and not lose a single GCD. I usually just run between his hind legs (avoiding the tail of course) and get safe. Be sure you don't get close to his front legs as his swipe and breath start-points are in his head rather than at the end of his snout.
Your other main concern is getting to and from the blazes when AoE is called (assuming you are being directed to help with AoE) which is a big loss of up-time but can't really be helped. Depending on where the blaze group is being tanked I sometimes blow the runes and swap to Unholy Presence then to Blood Presence to help speed up the run over (while jump-turning Death Coils at Sarth along the way). Honestly though, presence swapping isn't all that helpful unless you're running entirely across the island and I've started to drop the practice but wanted to note it all the same.
Be sure to time your cooldowns to when Bloodlust/Heroism is called which is usually in the 25-30% of boss health area unless your group has time for two calls. Hope it doesn't =)
I also have Speed pots tied to my Hysteria but it's a pretty minor DPS increase. Not a major concern if you're not min/maxing.
3k is fair for melee on that fight especially considering your weapon. Don't beat yourself up about it too much. Keep plugging away, look for some Jawbone or better upgrade and don't stop experimenting and learning.
Oh, also, you may want to reconsider your trinkets.
Hope that helps. Good luck!
One other note, if you contact a GM they may be willing to give you a Sigil of the Dark Rider, as there isn't any other way to get it.
That should boost your DpS more.
That should boost your DpS more.
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people
lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
Is there a sort of "benchmark" at which diseaseless blood becomes viable?
Quote:
Is there a sort of "benchmark" at which diseaseless blood becomes viable?
I searched for one over at EJ, but couldn't find one. But, I didn't exactly have time to search through 71 pages.
The most important piece of equipment, though, is the weapon. Getting a better one will be a very large DpS boost for the OP.
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people
lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
TherionSaysWhat, Assassin Reject wrote:
How many drakes? I ask because the melee strat is different for either. You can't compare Patchwerk numbers to Sarth numbers, they're diametrically opposed fights.
I would agree. The only thing is that I haven't been below 3k in a long while, even on sarth. I got lucky and only moved for 2 waves.
TherionSaysWhat, Assassin Reject wrote:
Oh, also, you may want to reconsider your trinkets.
Yeah, I hate them. I am trying for both of yours. I have seriously gotten the shaft when it comes to trinkets.
Edited, Mar 24th 2009 8:46pm by ramera
idiggory wrote:
Quote:
Is there a sort of "benchmark" at which diseaseless blood becomes viable?
I searched for one over at EJ, but couldn't find one. But, I didn't exactly have time to search through 71 pages.
The most important piece of equipment, though, is the weapon. Getting a better one will be a very large DpS boost for the OP.
2pc T7/T7.5 can also push you up there, not only with stats, but the 5% crit to Oblit.
Personally, since most of my gear but my 2pc T7.5 is PvP gear, I'm not at that point yet (and I don't have a sigil for Blood), but were anyone else geared to my level (mostly ilvl 200/213 epics), they'd be ready for Blood as long as they had a 186 DPS epic 2h.
To benchmark I just respec and compare all-bosses averages. While I do work out a lot of math to see what theoretical range might be possible, I prefer WWS parses. I don't know that there could be an easy benchmark to go by honestly. It's really up to your gear when the tipping point is. I'm not planning on going back to a deep blood build until 3.1 or I finally get the damn Betrayer (I blame the dumb fury jerk in my raid, hi Tort!) and I'm only short a couple of upgrades at the moment.
Honestly, I don't know that the current content demands min/max of any of us aside from a few achievements (Sarth 3D, 6 min Maly, etc) so I would say, go ahead an play around and try out different specs. Just be sure you're comparing same gear to same instance with same (or mostly the same) group composition. It may be that your gear isn't going to give you better results with other builds. But at least you would have tried 'em out and learned a bit about them in action.
As to the trinkets: The darkmoon card was just a bunch of farming. It's something that every pve DK should have. It's easily available with a bit of effort. The second slot is whatever drops, so good luck! (as to my not having the five flights, see above, jerk-face fury!)
Cheers!
Honestly, I don't know that the current content demands min/max of any of us aside from a few achievements (Sarth 3D, 6 min Maly, etc) so I would say, go ahead an play around and try out different specs. Just be sure you're comparing same gear to same instance with same (or mostly the same) group composition. It may be that your gear isn't going to give you better results with other builds. But at least you would have tried 'em out and learned a bit about them in action.
As to the trinkets: The darkmoon card was just a bunch of farming. It's something that every pve DK should have. It's easily available with a bit of effort. The second slot is whatever drops, so good luck! (as to my not having the five flights, see above, jerk-face fury!)
Cheers!
Jawbone - Check!
Cap expertise - Check!
So the raid tonight started bad, real bad. My dps on most of Military sucked. I knew I would lose my overall spot, but even on bosses I dropped to 4 or 5.
We were about to rap things up for the night so I decided to experiment. I went to Unholy pres... and owned. On Maexxna I shot up to 3.7k, the Jawbone dropped. It was almost like a sweet reward for my hard work.
The new test will be tomorrows patchwerk. Wish me luck lol.
Edited, Mar 25th 2009 6:32am by ramera
Cap expertise - Check!
So the raid tonight started bad, real bad. My dps on most of Military sucked. I knew I would lose my overall spot, but even on bosses I dropped to 4 or 5.
We were about to rap things up for the night so I decided to experiment. I went to Unholy pres... and owned. On Maexxna I shot up to 3.7k, the Jawbone dropped. It was almost like a sweet reward for my hard work.
The new test will be tomorrows patchwerk. Wish me luck lol.
Edited, Mar 25th 2009 6:32am by ramera
Unholy Presence only helps if you're having trouble keeping to the tighter rotations that Blood Presence needs. It helps but once you get better at timing your strikes, consider going back to Blood Presence.
Grats on the upgrade!
Grats on the upgrade!
Im running a tight rotation, I just dont have enough time. I have been getting hung up on my RP dumps and leaving my runes to sit and rot. I think I will go back to blood with the Sigil of Awareness. I think Ill be using OB instead of HS. Im still tweaking it. Anyother way and I just am not seeing the dps.
I am using that rotation, I simply left out two HS when I typed it. Blood tap doesnt sit on cooldown long, but I find that I dont have the time for empowered rune weapon. Without being in unholy pres, I cant get my runes on cooldown. That is a bit of a lie, it just feels like I waste it. As unholy, I could pop off 3 SS > ERW > gargoyle > 3SS.
I do cast AotD whenever I can. I do it either at pull or on a phase change if I cant dps. An example would be right after the jump on thaddius.
Edited, Mar 25th 2009 6:32am by ramera
Quote:
OB>OB>HS>HS>RP dump> HS>HS>HS>HS>HS>HS> RP dump, repeat.
Other than that, it may just be that you need a better weapon.
What exactly is the spec you have?
[EDIT]
And, are you remembering to use your Empowered Rune Weapon, Blood Tap and Army of Dead (not sure what the current status of this is, but I remember reading it doesn't taunt bosses so is pure, safe DpS) CDs?
Other than that, it may just be that you need a better weapon.
What exactly is the spec you have?
[EDIT]
And, are you remembering to use your Empowered Rune Weapon, Blood Tap and Army of Dead (not sure what the current status of this is, but I remember reading it doesn't taunt bosses so is pure, safe DpS) CDs?
I am using that rotation, I simply left out two HS when I typed it. Blood tap doesnt sit on cooldown long, but I find that I dont have the time for empowered rune weapon. Without being in unholy pres, I cant get my runes on cooldown. That is a bit of a lie, it just feels like I waste it. As unholy, I could pop off 3 SS > ERW > gargoyle > 3SS.
I do cast AotD whenever I can. I do it either at pull or on a phase change if I cant dps. An example would be right after the jump on thaddius.
Edited, Mar 25th 2009 6:32am by ramera
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