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I've been an expierenced tank for 2 years now almost always taking the MT spot where ever I went, however right when WotLK came out I didn't play for five months and just recently got back to the game and just hit 80 this last week. Today me and a DK tank fellow guildy were arguing about the defense cap and being crushed/crit. I understand that for heroics i's 535 defense and raids 540 for uncrush but what about crit? He was saying that crit basicly doesn't apply anymore and if you are defense capped you wont get crushed or crit. Now is this true or do the old rules of avoidance still apply. I just wanted verification to this for my better understanding. Any information on this would be helpful tank you.
Okay... no.
535/540 is the amount of defense you need to not be crit by mobs 2 or 3 (or Skull) levels above you. Crushes were effectively removed from the game in large part; they only occur if you're hit by a monster 4 levels above you, which effectively means it won't happen outside of leveling (or if your base defense skill is underleveled, which... isn't likely unless you're a Mage or similar).
535/540 is the amount of defense you need to not be crit by mobs 2 or 3 (or Skull) levels above you. Crushes were effectively removed from the game in large part; they only occur if you're hit by a monster 4 levels above you, which effectively means it won't happen outside of leveling (or if your base defense skill is underleveled, which... isn't likely unless you're a Mage or similar).
RPZip wrote:
535/540 is the amount of defense you need to not be crit by mobs 2 or 3 (or Skull) levels above you.
QFT.
On the subject of crushes, you used to have 102.4% combined block + avoidance to be uncrushable against mobs 3 levels above you in TBC. Defense rating alone would never make you uncrushable.
While we're at this... I've been wondering...
What's the defense cap thing all about? Is it just about being uncritable? I've been looking at wowwiki, which I know has many things outdated but this part is probably mostly correct. And the net avoidance ratings from defense when paired up against bonuses from dodge, parry, block and resil seems to actually be superior even after reaching uncritable.
I guess explaining it doesn't show properly what I mean... I'll just show numbers then...
25 defense skill = 1% dodge + 1% miss + 1% parry + 1% block + 1% less chance to be crit.
25 defense skill = 4.92*25 def rating = 125 def rating.
For sake of making things "more alike" I'll count miss as dodge. So to get that avoidance without def it's...
2% dodge = 78.7 dodge rating
1% parry = 49.18 parry rating
1% block = 16.39 block rating
1% of crit reduction = 82 resil
After you already get crits out your 125 def will still amount 127.88 rating points of dodge+parry, and you get the block rating bonus on top of that. So for avoidance purposes def still outperforms the others unless you don't count block at all and decide to compare it with pure dodge rating.
540 defense r = 4.4% miss/dodge/parry/block and crit reduction .
If you want to push your avoidance higher, why use anything other than more defense?
And when do you decide you have enough avoidance? If the only objective was uncritability it would be easier to reach with resil.
What's the defense cap thing all about? Is it just about being uncritable? I've been looking at wowwiki, which I know has many things outdated but this part is probably mostly correct. And the net avoidance ratings from defense when paired up against bonuses from dodge, parry, block and resil seems to actually be superior even after reaching uncritable.
I guess explaining it doesn't show properly what I mean... I'll just show numbers then...
25 defense skill = 1% dodge + 1% miss + 1% parry + 1% block + 1% less chance to be crit.
25 defense skill = 4.92*25 def rating = 125 def rating.
For sake of making things "more alike" I'll count miss as dodge. So to get that avoidance without def it's...
2% dodge = 78.7 dodge rating
1% parry = 49.18 parry rating
1% block = 16.39 block rating
1% of crit reduction = 82 resil
After you already get crits out your 125 def will still amount 127.88 rating points of dodge+parry, and you get the block rating bonus on top of that. So for avoidance purposes def still outperforms the others unless you don't count block at all and decide to compare it with pure dodge rating.
540 defense r = 4.4% miss/dodge/parry/block and crit reduction .
If you want to push your avoidance higher, why use anything other than more defense?
And when do you decide you have enough avoidance? If the only objective was uncritability it would be easier to reach with resil.
Defense outperforms parry, it's not quite as good as dodge. The reason you choose defense over resilience is that it's not hard to come across, and gives you the avoidance along with the reduction to your chances of being crit. Resilience would sometimes be used as a stopgap measure in resist sets, like I used it in my FR set for Illidan when I first built it to keep myself uncrittable, but there's no reason currently to just not get the free avoidance.
Dodge rating and Defense rating are both valuable stats to stack for avoidance.
They provide around the same return in the fashion of diminishing returns and avoidance to skill rating.
Dodge generally gives more straight avoidance, while also suffering from diminishing returns.
Defense gives overall avoidance (less total than dodge) and block %, while suffering less from diminishing returns.
They provide around the same return in the fashion of diminishing returns and avoidance to skill rating.
Dodge generally gives more straight avoidance, while also suffering from diminishing returns.
Defense gives overall avoidance (less total than dodge) and block %, while suffering less from diminishing returns.
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