1st time poster, long time lurker.
So here's where im at. Switched from Feral tank to Moonkin Thursday of last week.
Been grinding heroics, getting gear...ect. The problem is my DPS fluctuates so much,
from 1500dps to 2.2k dps. In the easier instances, mobs die so fast I can only get
a few Wraths off or a single Hurricane.
If I reset Recount for a boss fight, I can put up 2.2k dps pretty easy unless there is
alot of movement involved. H-UP I sustain atleast 2k dps thoughout the instance.
Yesterday we ran 25 man OS..........I could only muster a measly 1.8k dps from start to
finish. I ended up 15th on the dps/damage meter. Not Good.
Ive used two of the recommended specs off of EJ, both with about the same results with
+/- 100 dps.
Trash rotation - MF, Wrath x2 (while tank gets aggro on all mobs), Hurricane.
Boss rotation - IS, MF, Wrath till SF Eclipse proc, SF till proc is over, Repeat.....
Boss rotation 2 - Same as above but SF till Wrath Eclipse. Usually ends with a drop in DPS.
I have zero mana issues.
Any advice in general or on spec, rotation, gear would be great as im at a loss.
Thanks
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I had the same issues that you are speaking about. One thing that I notice is that a FFB or fire speced mage in your raid is going to help your DPS a ton. This could be a factor in your low DPS values. You need to take a look at the raid composition.
I raided as a boomkin for about 4 weeks with an arcane mage that refused to respec to FFB for the good of the raid. After getting a pug mage that was FFB, my dps went crazy!!
I raided as a boomkin for about 4 weeks with an arcane mage that refused to respec to FFB for the good of the raid. After getting a pug mage that was FFB, my dps went crazy!!
Until you become rather well geared, your DPS will vary all the time, if only because Balance DPS is based on Eclipse procs and it might just happen that you get unlucky and can't manage to proc one for a while (Especially a Starfire Eclipse).
Also, trash is not a good way to measure your DPS. As you said, everything dies too fast. It's not like your trash DPS matters so much anyway. The run is faster when trash dies faster but it's really only bosses that should matter. (Btw you don't have to reset Recount on bosses, you can just choose to display "current fight" rather than "overall data")
Your first boss rotation seems good. If you've been reading the EJ forums you probably know all you need to about it, when to reapply DoT's and when not to. Very important not to clip Eclipses, etc.
Spec-wise it looks good. Perhaps a bit too heavy on mana-regen talents, especially if you say you have zero mana issues. (Can drop a few Dreamstate/Moonglow points for DPS talents) Get Imp FF if you don't raid regularly with a Shadow Priest specced for Misery, you'll want your Hit cap reached ASAP.
So in the same line of thoughts, you should focus on gemming/enchanting for Hit. You still need quite a bit of that. With BoP and ImpFF/Misery you need 263 Hit Rating, so still 68 rating to go. Those +SP enchants will be wasted if your spells can't hit your target. When gemming, don't be afraid to forfeit so-so useful bonuses to actually get the gems you need (bonuses like spirit, stam, even intellect if need be).
It's a shame you got 2 pieces of Resto T7.5, cause the 4-piece bonus of Balance is very very useful to your DPS. (And the 2-piece bonus is a decent addition too, especially when specced/glyphed for it)
I'm sure the veteran Moonkins will have more insight to add.
Also, trash is not a good way to measure your DPS. As you said, everything dies too fast. It's not like your trash DPS matters so much anyway. The run is faster when trash dies faster but it's really only bosses that should matter. (Btw you don't have to reset Recount on bosses, you can just choose to display "current fight" rather than "overall data")
Your first boss rotation seems good. If you've been reading the EJ forums you probably know all you need to about it, when to reapply DoT's and when not to. Very important not to clip Eclipses, etc.
Spec-wise it looks good. Perhaps a bit too heavy on mana-regen talents, especially if you say you have zero mana issues. (Can drop a few Dreamstate/Moonglow points for DPS talents) Get Imp FF if you don't raid regularly with a Shadow Priest specced for Misery, you'll want your Hit cap reached ASAP.
So in the same line of thoughts, you should focus on gemming/enchanting for Hit. You still need quite a bit of that. With BoP and ImpFF/Misery you need 263 Hit Rating, so still 68 rating to go. Those +SP enchants will be wasted if your spells can't hit your target. When gemming, don't be afraid to forfeit so-so useful bonuses to actually get the gems you need (bonuses like spirit, stam, even intellect if need be).
It's a shame you got 2 pieces of Resto T7.5, cause the 4-piece bonus of Balance is very very useful to your DPS. (And the 2-piece bonus is a decent addition too, especially when specced/glyphed for it)
I'm sure the veteran Moonkins will have more insight to add.
7 posts
Thank you both for your input.
The 2 pieces of tier gear are from when I was going resto.....Ive been saving up
for a 3rd set for Moonkin.
Ive been working on hit rating, ill take your advice though and socket/enchant till
I get to cap.
Ill respect to pull some points out mana regen talents also then see where I stand.
Again, thx for the input.
The 2 pieces of tier gear are from when I was going resto.....Ive been saving up
for a 3rd set for Moonkin.
Ive been working on hit rating, ill take your advice though and socket/enchant till
I get to cap.
Ill respect to pull some points out mana regen talents also then see where I stand.
Again, thx for the input.
When I was looking to get Hit on my Feral DPS gear I used the Precision on gloves and Icewwalker on boot to add around +35 Hit
Aw, that somber melody... Yes you're listening to the OP play "The Plight of the Moonkin: The RNG just raped my face."
Boomkin dps is limited to a few things.
Clipping your Eclipse. If you've read the boomkin raiding thread on EJ you'll notice the recurring trend of people telling you not to clip your Eclipse short by refreshing your dots. This is best left to after your Eclipse runs its course.
Another thing is your dps is heavily related to your crit. Most boomkins in form and with talents are around 20-30% for crit. The higher your crit, without heavily nerfing hit and haste, you'll notice your eclipse procs come much faster, and if you're wrathing to proc your lunar eclipse not only are you subjecting yourself to your crit percentage, then after that you're being subjected to a 60% chance on crits to proc. It's kind of crappy but it's the way things work.
Luckily for boomkins everywhere. Blizzard on the PTR has buffed the amount of damage you recieve for wrath on solar eclipse procs up to 30% from the original 20%. Also owlkin frenzy now procs off all damages again. So the solar eclipse procs have been showing to be on par with dps from lunar eclipse procs.
Good news for me! I am now currently building up a crit set apart from my haste set. Now self buffed I'm at 25% crit, tossing in my set bonus I'm at 30% for wrath/sf.
But all in all, work your crit up to a reasonable rate and show me your armory I could give you some tips if I could see your gear when it comes to gemming/enchants and what not. I'm assuming you know what you're doing but, its always good to get a second opinion.
EDIT: Here is a link to my armory.
On average I generally do about 4k dps on a boss fight and through naxx between trash and bosses I'll sit around 3.5k to 3.8k dps.
If you have any questions ask em. I've been raiding boomkin for awhile and I don't think there isn't much I've not yet seen.
Edited, Mar 12th 2009 3:42pm by ArexLovesPie
Boomkin dps is limited to a few things.
Clipping your Eclipse. If you've read the boomkin raiding thread on EJ you'll notice the recurring trend of people telling you not to clip your Eclipse short by refreshing your dots. This is best left to after your Eclipse runs its course.
Another thing is your dps is heavily related to your crit. Most boomkins in form and with talents are around 20-30% for crit. The higher your crit, without heavily nerfing hit and haste, you'll notice your eclipse procs come much faster, and if you're wrathing to proc your lunar eclipse not only are you subjecting yourself to your crit percentage, then after that you're being subjected to a 60% chance on crits to proc. It's kind of crappy but it's the way things work.
Luckily for boomkins everywhere. Blizzard on the PTR has buffed the amount of damage you recieve for wrath on solar eclipse procs up to 30% from the original 20%. Also owlkin frenzy now procs off all damages again. So the solar eclipse procs have been showing to be on par with dps from lunar eclipse procs.
Good news for me! I am now currently building up a crit set apart from my haste set. Now self buffed I'm at 25% crit, tossing in my set bonus I'm at 30% for wrath/sf.
But all in all, work your crit up to a reasonable rate and show me your armory I could give you some tips if I could see your gear when it comes to gemming/enchants and what not. I'm assuming you know what you're doing but, its always good to get a second opinion.
EDIT: Here is a link to my armory.
On average I generally do about 4k dps on a boss fight and through naxx between trash and bosses I'll sit around 3.5k to 3.8k dps.
If you have any questions ask em. I've been raiding boomkin for awhile and I don't think there isn't much I've not yet seen.
Edited, Mar 12th 2009 3:42pm by ArexLovesPie
7 posts
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Eredar&n=Blessit
Excellent, thanks alot Arex.
I did what the above posters recommended. My hit is at 267 now and with your
advice ill be working on crit next.
Ive respeced, but have not resocketed as of yet.
Talking about "Clipping your Eclipse". I havent been able to find anything on EJ
about this question....see if I can get it to come across right.
Say I wrath till eclipse procs, then switch to SF, lets say SF has a 2.5 second cast
time.
My proced eclipse has 2 seconds remaining. Does SF have to hit target before eclipse
fades or as long as I start the cast while still in eclipse it will get the 30% crit chance?
Hope I made that clear. If im under 2 seconds on eclipse and my SF takes 2.5 to cast, I wont
cast it, ill go back to wrath or use that time to refresh IS/MF/IFF, which ever one fell off.
Again, thx for the advice/recommendations everyone. Hopefully ill start to see more Boom from this toon.
Edited, Mar 13th 2009 9:01am by Blessit
Edited, Mar 13th 2009 9:02am by Blessit
Excellent, thanks alot Arex.
I did what the above posters recommended. My hit is at 267 now and with your
advice ill be working on crit next.
Ive respeced, but have not resocketed as of yet.
Talking about "Clipping your Eclipse". I havent been able to find anything on EJ
about this question....see if I can get it to come across right.
Say I wrath till eclipse procs, then switch to SF, lets say SF has a 2.5 second cast
time.
My proced eclipse has 2 seconds remaining. Does SF have to hit target before eclipse
fades or as long as I start the cast while still in eclipse it will get the 30% crit chance?
Hope I made that clear. If im under 2 seconds on eclipse and my SF takes 2.5 to cast, I wont
cast it, ill go back to wrath or use that time to refresh IS/MF/IFF, which ever one fell off.
Again, thx for the advice/recommendations everyone. Hopefully ill start to see more Boom from this toon.
Edited, Mar 13th 2009 9:01am by Blessit
Edited, Mar 13th 2009 9:02am by Blessit
Quote:
My proced eclipse has 2 seconds remaining. Does SF have to hit target before eclipse
fades or as long as I start the cast while still in eclipse it will get the 30% crit chance?
fades or as long as I start the cast while still in eclipse it will get the 30% crit chance?
Your spell has to finish casting before the Eclipse fades. It doesn't matter if you had the buff at the beginning of the spell cast.
Quote:
Hope I made that clear. If im under 2 seconds on eclipse and my SF takes 2.5 to cast, I wont
cast it, ill go back to wrath or use that time to refresh IS/MF/IFF, which ever one fell off.
cast it, ill go back to wrath or use that time to refresh IS/MF/IFF, which ever one fell off.
What Arex meant by "clipping Eclipse" is reapplying DoT's during an Eclipse. Say, Moonfire falls off in the middle of your Eclipse. Even if that takes away 3% crit, it's better to keep spamming Starfire for the rest of the duration in order to squeeze as many Starfires in any given Eclipse. Using a GCD to reapply MF may let you cast one less Starfire during the Eclipse duration, which is called "clipping".
Hmm, Selverin I was always under the impression that as long as you have the eclipse buff before the cast ends you recieve the buff. Guess I'll have to do a little research.
I checked out your armory. Here is what I've noticed.
Meta Gem - Go for the 21 crit 3% increased crit damage. Chaotic Skyflare Diamond
Trinket - Replace the Whetstone with the badge trinket. Sundial of the Exiled
Weapon - Go for a main hand off hand combo. Titan Steel Guardian is a good place to start.
Off hand - Ward of the Violet Citadel
To just get these you're gonna have to get the mats for the guardian, and grind 65 emblems of heroism out. Nothing too hard it just may cost a little bit of money and time, but you'll see an increase in your damage.
Your gems seem good though, you're going to lose a little hit if you get the main/off hand combo so you may have to gem a slot for pure hit.
Your spec, thought not to my specific liking, is fine. The only thing I would change is taking 2 points from Dreamstate and putting them into Celestial Focus for that extra 2% haste. It's an increase in dps for you while you raid.
Edit: Fixing links, apparently I'm terribad at forums.
Edited, Mar 13th 2009 10:36am by ArexLovesPie
I checked out your armory. Here is what I've noticed.
Meta Gem - Go for the 21 crit 3% increased crit damage. Chaotic Skyflare Diamond
Trinket - Replace the Whetstone with the badge trinket. Sundial of the Exiled
Weapon - Go for a main hand off hand combo. Titan Steel Guardian is a good place to start.
Off hand - Ward of the Violet Citadel
To just get these you're gonna have to get the mats for the guardian, and grind 65 emblems of heroism out. Nothing too hard it just may cost a little bit of money and time, but you'll see an increase in your damage.
Your gems seem good though, you're going to lose a little hit if you get the main/off hand combo so you may have to gem a slot for pure hit.
Your spec, thought not to my specific liking, is fine. The only thing I would change is taking 2 points from Dreamstate and putting them into Celestial Focus for that extra 2% haste. It's an increase in dps for you while you raid.
Edit: Fixing links, apparently I'm terribad at forums.
Edited, Mar 13th 2009 10:36am by ArexLovesPie
Quote:
Hmm, Selverin I was always under the impression that as long as you have the eclipse buff before the cast ends you recieve the buff. Guess I'll have to do a little research.
If you have a bit of time to spare, sure, that'd be great.
I was mostly saying that because most (every?) other buff mechanics work that way. Maybe it's not the case with Eclipse.
EDIT: Checked the Wowhead forums real quick. While not the most reliable source, it seems Eclipse must be up at the end of the casting for it to be taken into account. Like another dude said, it's fairly easy to test with a Wrath Eclipse rather than a Starfire Eclipse.
Edited, Mar 13th 2009 11:05am by Selverein
Ok, I've been reading throgh this and other Boomkin related posts and something that has been nagging at me. I keep seeing mention of different types of Eclipse's. I thought there was just the one Eclipe that you got through talent points. Would someone be kind enough to expand on this for a poor, old, stupid kitty? I would rather be a poor, old, smart kitty :)
7 posts
@ Lastar - If you fire SF it will proc after a Crit to give you a Solar Eclipse.
When that happens you start spamming wrath for the 20% increase in damage your wrath does.
Spamming Wrath till eclipse will give you a Lunar Eclipse, so you switch to SF and
spam it for the extra 30% Crit chance of SF.
As far as eclipse's then, im doing it right since I wont be able to get that SF in under
2.0. Thanks for clearing that up with the available info at hand.
Ill start working on those gear pieces, im back up to 33 badges now so I can
get one now and go snag that Meta Gem.
Thanks for all the help fellas, much appreciated.
When that happens you start spamming wrath for the 20% increase in damage your wrath does.
Spamming Wrath till eclipse will give you a Lunar Eclipse, so you switch to SF and
spam it for the extra 30% Crit chance of SF.
As far as eclipse's then, im doing it right since I wont be able to get that SF in under
2.0. Thanks for clearing that up with the available info at hand.
Ill start working on those gear pieces, im back up to 33 badges now so I can
get one now and go snag that Meta Gem.
Thanks for all the help fellas, much appreciated.
Quote:
As far as eclipse's then, im doing it right since I wont be able to get that SF in under
2.0. Thanks for clearing that up with the available info at hand.
2.0. Thanks for clearing that up with the available info at hand.
Only one little thing to keep in mind.
Because of latency and whatnot, it may still be wise to finish casting that last Starfire even if you think the remaining duration of Eclipse will not be sufficient, especially if it's a matter of a fraction of a second. For example, if you have 2.0s left on Eclipse and Starfire takes 2.5s to cast, just go ahead and cast another one, just in case.
Keep in mind that even though your DoT's will be up for most of the fight, the biggest chunk of your damage will come from your direct damage spells (at least it did for me), and even though you lost the +30% crit bonus, that doesn't prevent the spell from naturally criting, resulting in your best damage/mana ratio spell.
Edited, Mar 13th 2009 1:28pm by Selverein
Quote:
I keep seeing mention of different types of Eclipse's. I thought there was just the one Eclipe that you got through talent points
Lunar Eclipse is when you proc with Wrath, and you should spam Starfire.
Solar is when you proc with Starfire, and you should spam Wrath.
Selverein wrote:
Quote:
As far as eclipse's then, im doing it right since I wont be able to get that SF in under
2.0. Thanks for clearing that up with the available info at hand.
2.0. Thanks for clearing that up with the available info at hand.
Only one little thing to keep in mind.
Because of latency and whatnot, it may still be wise to finish casting that last Starfire even if you think the remaining duration of Eclipse will not be sufficient, especially if it's a matter of a fraction of a second. For example, if you have 2.0s left on Eclipse and Starfire takes 2.5s to cast, just go ahead and cast another one, just in case.
Keep in mind that even though your DoT's will be up for most of the fight, the biggest chunk of your damage will come from your direct damage spells (at least it did for me), and even though you lost the +30% crit bonus, that doesn't prevent the spell from naturally criting, resulting in your best damage/mana ratio spell.
Edited, Mar 13th 2009 1:28pm by Selverein
Agreed, especially if you keep casting SF after the eclipse is over until the internal eclipse cooldown is over. From what I've read on EJ, the general concensus is, that this rotation leads to the most dps. And that's why Idol of the Shooting Star is the recommended idol to wear. Because, although you try to proc lunar eclipse by casting wrath, overall you will be casting SF more often, if you keep casting it when eclipse is over and on it's CD.
A really nifty addon to track both the duration of the eclipses, and the internet CD is SquawkAndAwe. It's a modification of a Shaman addon, done by one of the leading boomkin posters at EJs.
question: is solar eclipse and lunar eclipse on the same proc timer? For example if I have a lunar eclipse (where I spam SF), should I continue to spam SF after the lunar eclipse ends to proc an earlier solar eclipse or would solar start at the same time as lunar if I had went back to spamming wrath to see another lunar??
The two Eclipses share the same CD. That's why most people stick to a single type of Eclipse.
SquawkAndAwe is great for that, as it tracks the general CD of Eclipse, regardless of its type. So you don't end up proc'ing the wrong one after the CD is over.
SquawkAndAwe is great for that, as it tracks the general CD of Eclipse, regardless of its type. So you don't end up proc'ing the wrong one after the CD is over.
Selverein wrote:
The two Eclipses share the same CD. That's why most people stick to a single type of Eclipse.
SquawkAndAwe is great for that, as it tracks the general CD of Eclipse, regardless of its type. So you don't end up proc'ing the wrong one after the CD is over.
SquawkAndAwe is great for that, as it tracks the general CD of Eclipse, regardless of its type. So you don't end up proc'ing the wrong one after the CD is over.
This.
Regardless of that, you can still keep casting SF after Lunar Eclipse is on CD, if it yields more dps because of the trinket, as long as you stop just before the CD is over, which SquawkAndAwe is great for :D
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