weird, i know! but every time i spec unholy it just feels....weird to me, especially in pvp. i can make do with pve (its really not bad in pve) but in pvp i just feel like im all thumbs.
now, frost and blood on the other hand....no problems. playing both seems to come naturally to me. my preferred pvp spec is a 18/53 blood/frost, like so:
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=jfcMacZGMxphxbMGRAcsz
and it works well for me. good survivability (stay in frost presence mostly since my gear is pretty poopy), lots of utility via pestlinece+chilblains, HC, glyphed rune tap and the soon-to-be-removed frost aura, and good damage + kiting power, letting me take on better geared melee classes with impunity.
now, when i try to pvp as unholy, this is what ive specced (with some variations in a few points from time to time):
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=jbIMacZZfMGI0dkMeqRfku
and it just feels weird compared to frost or blood. ill admit im not a huge fan of pets, but i know the power of a well-timed ghoul stun plus the extra dps a ghoul can add. i know how hard SS can hit for and i like having plague strikes that dont tickle my opponent (as opposed to frost where i plague strike is almost exclusively an anti-hot attack for me). but after the, say, first 20 seconds of battle i just dont like how unholy works. the "stick-and-move" still of frost pvp that utilizes superior control is much more comfortable and much more my style i think.
but unholy is fun! so....any suggestions or general guidelines on how to get unholy to feel a bit less clunky?
- Forums
- World of Warcraft
- Class Discussion
- unholy is awkward for me
unholy is awkward for meFollow
Stop thinking Frost when you're playing Unholy. Be mobile and make use of your pet(s). You don't really lose control, you're just gaining it in different ways. You have so many mean and nasty things at your disposal - Death Coil being one of them - that allow you to deal damage regardless of the situation. In fact, it's entirely up to you whether you want it up close and personal or prefer a little more distance.
You can add significantly more damage to any kiting, and that I think is where Unholy truly shines and becomes far more interesting than the 2 other specs.
You can add significantly more damage to any kiting, and that I think is where Unholy truly shines and becomes far more interesting than the 2 other specs.
First, your unholy build can be better.
0/20/51 is the build that I play when I play unholy.
Essentially what it boils down to is this:
You use IT/PS almost exclusively on your FU runes. The damage done by them should be higher than SS.
As you get KM procs, your ITs will rape people.
You use your blood runes on Blood Boil mainly, with the glyph of Blood Boil to apply a 50% snare; you can use Pestilence to spread diseases if you want.
0/20/51 is the build that I play when I play unholy.
Essentially what it boils down to is this:
You use IT/PS almost exclusively on your FU runes. The damage done by them should be higher than SS.
As you get KM procs, your ITs will rape people.
You use your blood runes on Blood Boil mainly, with the glyph of Blood Boil to apply a 50% snare; you can use Pestilence to spread diseases if you want.
interesting. how is that build going to pan out come 3.1 theo? will SS have a place once plague and fever are in place?
Possibly, but people are getting like 5k PS crits on PTR, so...yeah.
With the 51 in unholy you'll basically get Garg instead of just blowing all your points lower in the tree.
With the 51 in unholy you'll basically get Garg instead of just blowing all your points lower in the tree.
It likely won't survive the patch, but that remains to be seen.
As far as a shdowfrost spec, go 0/21/50. There is no one point in Unholy that you get with 51 now that is better than Deathchill, period.
Other things can be moved around, but nothing is a major deal except for that.
As far as a shdowfrost spec, go 0/21/50. There is no one point in Unholy that you get with 51 now that is better than Deathchill, period.
Other things can be moved around, but nothing is a major deal except for that.
Zisikpus wrote:
It likely won't survive the patch, but that remains to be seen.
As far as a shdowfrost spec, go 0/21/50. There is no one point in Unholy that you get with 51 now that is better than Deathchill, period.
Other things can be moved around, but nothing is a major deal except for that.
As far as a shdowfrost spec, go 0/21/50. There is no one point in Unholy that you get with 51 now that is better than Deathchill, period.
Other things can be moved around, but nothing is a major deal except for that.
Which definitely explains why most of the top arena players don't have Deathchill, right?
Use your head for something other than a hat rack.
Edit: and thus far in the PTR, it hasn't changed much. We lose out on Glacier Rot, but that doesn't ***** up the whole build.
And you will need to be 0/20/51 after 3.1 for this build to work; Garg is too good (especially since it's damage is getting buffed) to not take.
Edited, Mar 7th 2009 11:25am by Theophany
Deathchill is, essentially, a free IT, HB or FS every 2 minutes (DK spell crits are double damage).
Gargoyle is a mobile unit that will continue to attack your target even if snared/CCed, and should do FAR more damage than any one of those three abilites except for HB if you have a LOT of targets (assuming they all have Frost Fever).
But, as an Unholy spec, you'll ONLY have Icy Touch. In a 6 minute period, you can Garg twice and DC 3 times. 3 IT < 2 Gargoyles.
[EDIT]
Are you talking about pre-3.1? Because your post was ambiguous. The only ability that requires 51 points in Unholy to have right NOW is Unholy Blight, which I would personally take instead of Deathchill when deep Unholy.
This is made more apparent if you have Endless Winter, because you won't always be using IT to apply your Frost Fever, but rather Chains of Ice when advantageous for the snare.
If I was Frost, I'd take Deathchill. If I had a free point, I'd take it. If I could sacrifice something average, I'd take it. A guaranteed crit every 2 minutes just isn't that good.
Edited, Mar 7th 2009 11:19pm by idiggory
Gargoyle is a mobile unit that will continue to attack your target even if snared/CCed, and should do FAR more damage than any one of those three abilites except for HB if you have a LOT of targets (assuming they all have Frost Fever).
But, as an Unholy spec, you'll ONLY have Icy Touch. In a 6 minute period, you can Garg twice and DC 3 times. 3 IT < 2 Gargoyles.
[EDIT]
Are you talking about pre-3.1? Because your post was ambiguous. The only ability that requires 51 points in Unholy to have right NOW is Unholy Blight, which I would personally take instead of Deathchill when deep Unholy.
This is made more apparent if you have Endless Winter, because you won't always be using IT to apply your Frost Fever, but rather Chains of Ice when advantageous for the snare.
If I was Frost, I'd take Deathchill. If I had a free point, I'd take it. If I could sacrifice something average, I'd take it. A guaranteed crit every 2 minutes just isn't that good.
Edited, Mar 7th 2009 11:19pm by idiggory
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people
lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
the main benefit that i see with deathchill is to force damage at low life to burst someone down. for someone whos undergeared like i am with my DK, being able to "proc" a crit so to speak whenever i want can be pretty clutch.
as my gear gets better, ill probably swap deathchill out for something else.
as my gear gets better, ill probably swap deathchill out for something else.
That's a good point I hadn't considered.
But I still don't think I'd be willing to sacrifice UB or Garg for it if I was already 50 points in Unholy though.
But I still don't think I'd be willing to sacrifice UB or Garg for it if I was already 50 points in Unholy though.
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people
lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
The main reason I don't take Deathchill is because of KM. It procs so ridiculously often that I've not seen a huge use for it yet in my testing.
I'd rather deal without it now and be used to not using it in 3.1 when we need the 51 points to get Garg.
I'd rather deal without it now and be used to not using it in 3.1 when we need the 51 points to get Garg.
Quote:
The main reason I don't take Deathchill is because of KM. It procs so ridiculously often that I've not seen a huge use for it yet in my testing.
I'd rather deal without it now and be used to not using it in 3.1 when we need the 51 points to get Garg.
I'd rather deal without it now and be used to not using it in 3.1 when we need the 51 points to get Garg.
Here's a question. I just respecced Blood, but when I had KM and DC, both would be absorbed by an ability (kinda wasting a crit), which was really annoying because I felt like EVERY time I activated it, an auto-attack would proc KM...
Kinda annoying. Was this a glitch or working as intended?
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people
lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
Not really sure. KM procs on IT, HB, or FS. The only thing I can think of is that you accidentally used IT with it up.
That annoyed the crap out of me as Frost, but as Shadowfrost I love my KM ITs.
That annoyed the crap out of me as Frost, but as Shadowfrost I love my KM ITs.
Killing Machine and Deathchill no longer both affect the same attack.
There's been times where I was so lucky with KM procs that Deathchill wore off before I used it for a crit.
But now I'm an Unholy tank, and have neither.
There's been times where I was so lucky with KM procs that Deathchill wore off before I used it for a crit.
But now I'm an Unholy tank, and have neither.
Okay, good.
Now that I have tried each spec, I was very surprised to find I liked Frost the best. I thought I would like it the least. But, instead, Unholy is last for me (I thought it would be first). Not that I DISLIKE Unholy, I just don't like it as much as Frost.
I'm currently blood spec though. I want to make sure I try all of them enough to really know which I prefer. I've spent several hundred G on respecs leveling 55->77.
I must say, though, I'm amazed at how differently playing a DK feels depending on your spec. How you budget RP changes, your ability order can radically change, your death rune budgets, your procs, your AoE v Single target abilities, etc.
I don't think any non-hybrid (considering War and DK to be non-hybrids, in a way a Priest can heal/DpS but isn't a hybrid) changes play styles so much with one respec.
Note: I'm sure they do, but this is the first time I have ever tried so many specs in close proximity to each other. So I'm scewed towards feeling that way with DK.
Now that I have tried each spec, I was very surprised to find I liked Frost the best. I thought I would like it the least. But, instead, Unholy is last for me (I thought it would be first). Not that I DISLIKE Unholy, I just don't like it as much as Frost.
I'm currently blood spec though. I want to make sure I try all of them enough to really know which I prefer. I've spent several hundred G on respecs leveling 55->77.
I must say, though, I'm amazed at how differently playing a DK feels depending on your spec. How you budget RP changes, your ability order can radically change, your death rune budgets, your procs, your AoE v Single target abilities, etc.
I don't think any non-hybrid (considering War and DK to be non-hybrids, in a way a Priest can heal/DpS but isn't a hybrid) changes play styles so much with one respec.
Note: I'm sure they do, but this is the first time I have ever tried so many specs in close proximity to each other. So I'm scewed towards feeling that way with DK.
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people
lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
yeah, its a little ridiculous how hard IT and PS hit with that build you showed me theo. i eventually specced out just because the rotation was so damn boring (it/ps/bsx2/it/ps/spam it when death runes come up and ps as needed), but i was getting crits for 4400+ with reflection of torment up and on desecrated ground. i a little curious to see what rage of rivendare would do for the damage.
but i love frost too much. hungering cold has so much use when done right it just makes me giddy. also, being able to pretty reliably kill things under HoP is fun too.
but i love frost too much. hungering cold has so much use when done right it just makes me giddy. also, being able to pretty reliably kill things under HoP is fun too.
Quor wrote:
yeah, its a little ridiculous how hard IT and PS hit with that build you showed me theo. i eventually specced out just because the rotation was so damn boring (it/ps/bsx2/it/ps/spam it when death runes come up and ps as needed), but i was getting crits for 4400+ with reflection of torment up and on desecrated ground. i a little curious to see what rage of rivendare would do for the damage.
but i love frost too much. hungering cold has so much use when done right it just makes me giddy. also, being able to pretty reliably kill things under HoP is fun too.
but i love frost too much. hungering cold has so much use when done right it just makes me giddy. also, being able to pretty reliably kill things under HoP is fun too.
Heh, look at my armory, combine with my sigil, and imagine with a PS/IT/BB glyph combo.
I get so much RP that it's ridiculous, and my ITs crit for ~4k, PSs crit for ~1500, and I have complete **** for gear.
As of CURRENTLY, you will want to get Deathchill; in 3.1 it looks like it will change yes. I've followed arenajunkies pretty extensively, and from what I gather the reason some people do not have Deathchill is because one top ranked DK did it and people copied. Can you be a top ranked player without it? Of course...might an on demand crit after a KM crit drop your target before he gets healed? Definitely more useful than another point in RoR for 2% damage WHEN a disease is up (which is not always).
Zisikpus wrote:
As of CURRENTLY, you will want to get Deathchill; in 3.1 it looks like it will change yes. I've followed arenajunkies pretty extensively, and from what I gather the reason some people do not have Deathchill is because one top ranked DK did it and people copied. Can you be a top ranked player without it? Of course...might an on demand crit after a KM crit drop your target before he gets healed? Definitely more useful than another point in RoR for 2% damage WHEN a disease is up (which is not always).
Uh, you're spamming IT/PS on people. If diseases aren't always up, you're doing something horribly wrong.
Deathchill is a preference talent; you might win 1/1000 arena matches because of it.
I'd personally rather have expertise and 2% damage (~4% damage on crits).
Quote:
Uh, you're spamming IT/PS on people. If diseases aren't always up, you're doing something horribly wrong.
Deathchill is a preference talent; you might win 1/1000 arena matches because of it.
I'd personally rather have expertise and 2% damage (~4% damage on crits).
Deathchill is a preference talent; you might win 1/1000 arena matches because of it.
I'd personally rather have expertise and 2% damage (~4% damage on crits).
Plus, it is another button to click. I like to be a minimalist when PvPing.
No one will really judge for taking it. For 1 point, it is a fine talent. It's just not, in any way, the best talent in the tree or even "mandatory." Take it if you want it. But don't think it is a tree-defining ability.
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people
lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
idiggory wrote:
Quote:
Uh, you're spamming IT/PS on people. If diseases aren't always up, you're doing something horribly wrong.
Deathchill is a preference talent; you might win 1/1000 arena matches because of it.
I'd personally rather have expertise and 2% damage (~4% damage on crits).
Deathchill is a preference talent; you might win 1/1000 arena matches because of it.
I'd personally rather have expertise and 2% damage (~4% damage on crits).
Plus, it is another button to click. I like to be a minimalist when PvPing.
No one will really judge for taking it. For 1 point, it is a fine talent. It's just not, in any way, the best talent in the tree or even "mandatory." Take it if you want it. But don't think it is a tree-defining ability.
Correct. I get spammed with KM procs as it is already, so Deathchill is of limited used to me.
Plus, I have my unholy tree exactly how I like it.
Quor wrote:
yeah, its a little ridiculous how hard IT and PS hit with that build you showed me theo. i eventually specced out just because the rotation was so damn boring (it/ps/bsx2/it/ps/spam it when death runes come up and ps as needed), but i was getting crits for 4400+ with reflection of torment up and on desecrated ground. i a little curious to see what rage of rivendare would do for the damage.
but i love frost too much. hungering cold has so much use when done right it just makes me giddy. also, being able to pretty reliably kill things under HoP is fun too.
but i love frost too much. hungering cold has so much use when done right it just makes me giddy. also, being able to pretty reliably kill things under HoP is fun too.
I'm totally with you. I just recently noticed every top arena dk was unholy-frost and I was wondering why I have a newbie frost-blood build, but I never had any problem killing anyone except some blinking kiting mages with this build. I think it's survivability, maybe it's about having the capability to outlast anyone's initial burst of cooldowns and slam them with their cooldowns down.
Frost "feels" like you got a heavy kind of a terminator type that is so hard to take down that can take anyone down because almost nobody hits hard enough to down you before they're down. Face to face it outwarriors the warrior, with chains and deathgrip that also means ranged classes end up fighting it in melee range. As long as you're not fighting a healer it works.
For the discussion, Deathchill is less than amazing but has a few uses.
1. Walk into pack of tightly packed suckers.
2. Hungering Cold.
3. Death Chill.
4. Howling Blast.
5. That was like AoE grinding PvP wasn't it?.
I also sometimes use it when KM procs to get a crit+crit burst which can sometimes be nice to do. KM prevents your Deatchill charge from being consumed.
I like hungering cold a lot too, it works in so many ways...
I guess I'll go unholy since it's this season's imba winning spec, but I've been really liking frost. :P
Yeah, having played more with shadowfrost, Deathchill is required.
You can use the most retarded burst combo in the world with Deathchill.
1) Get 2 death runes.
2) Pop Garg on your target.
3) Use Gnaw on your target.
4) Use corpse explosion on your ghoul.
5) Spam 6x IT when your target gets low (use 2x PS before so you can get a KM proc, and use ERW after the 4th IT).
6) Deathchill on the second IT (so you get KM crit, Deathchill crit, then 2x IT).
7) Watch as your target takes ~30k+ damage in under 8 secs.
8) Laugh in a really sinister voice.
You can use the most retarded burst combo in the world with Deathchill.
1) Get 2 death runes.
2) Pop Garg on your target.
3) Use Gnaw on your target.
4) Use corpse explosion on your ghoul.
5) Spam 6x IT when your target gets low (use 2x PS before so you can get a KM proc, and use ERW after the 4th IT).
6) Deathchill on the second IT (so you get KM crit, Deathchill crit, then 2x IT).
7) Watch as your target takes ~30k+ damage in under 8 secs.
8) Laugh in a really sinister voice.
Recent Visitors: 25
All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (25)
- Forums
- World of Warcraft
- Class Discussion
- unholy is awkward for me
© 2024 Fanbyte LLC