Hi everyone. I am sorry if a post similar to mine has already been made, I did spend some time trying to find another. If one has been, then please feel free to redirect me to it if you could be so kind.
Up until recently, I was performing very well with my holy paladin in 25-man raids. I was placing very high on meters (I don't necessarily care about this for any form of pride's sake - but to me, it is a reflection of how much I am contributing) and having a lot of fun simultaneously healing my tank(s) and my raid.
Now, I feel that I am almost useless. I do not place as well as any other healer. I've reverted to using flash of light because I can no longer catch anyone's HP below maximum any other way, and then only some times; someone else clips it off with an instant cast before I have the chance to. This includes the tank, which I've simply started spamming flash of light on.
I don't think I have suddenly become a lot worse, although I certainly don't discredit it as a possibility. My raid has started to take 6 healers along, most of which are Priests/Shaman/Druids. They spam group healing spells and then spam cast on the tanks.
I love my character very much, but this is no longer any fun for me. I am heavily considering rolling a priest so I can feel useful again, but I both don't want to redo the entire levelling/gearing/purchasing/professions/achievement process only to make a character I love obsolete, and would like to explore the possibility that I am simply doing something wrong in this new situation.
A brief summary of my approach:
I keep Judgement of Light on the raid's main target.
I beacon the tank I am supposed to be paying the most attention to (although this has become difficult lately, as I haven't been able to get many reliable heals off on others to heal the tank).
I try my best to raid heal with holy light, holy shock and flash of light while still keeping my tank alive.
I tend to favor holy light and holy shock more than flash of light, but will use flash of light merely for speed's sake if the raid damage isn't very heavy.
I attempt a lot of pre-emptive casting on the tank during raid damage downtime.
I use my various cooldowns to try to keep my mana available or to take advantage of a heavy raid damage situation (which has become increasingly difficult lately, given the aforementioned about group healing spells).
I have 2150 SP, 24.81% crit (I'm kings specced for my guild), 558 haste rating, and 1,279 intellect or 23.3k mana.
I also made what I feel is the mistake of gemming for spellpower and will probably change my gems to haste rating or crit, although many of them are also currently intellect.
If anyone could help me, I would appreciate it ever so much. Thank you for taking the time to read my post.
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I'm becoming discouraged with my holy paladin.Follow
I think that any toon's usefullness is directly related to the classes they have surrounding them. (The most basic example is that tanks are useless w/o healer, but your situation is obviously more complex.)
1. Are the other healers out gearing you? If so - wait your turn and you gear will drop too.
2. Are you bringing too many healers? If you have 6 heals and one is saying they feel a lack of workload - perhaps it's time to get another DPS or have someone spec as an off healer who really only heals on tough fights.
3. Is your group OP for the raid? (i.e. Does everyone know the fights so well they are avoiding the AOE damage, plus wearing the absolute best gear... Etc...) If so, you'll probably find that HoT and AOE heals are covering the damage.
I am not in 25 man content yet, but those questions came to mind when I read your post.
Maybe more info is needed - Armory?
1. Are the other healers out gearing you? If so - wait your turn and you gear will drop too.
2. Are you bringing too many healers? If you have 6 heals and one is saying they feel a lack of workload - perhaps it's time to get another DPS or have someone spec as an off healer who really only heals on tough fights.
3. Is your group OP for the raid? (i.e. Does everyone know the fights so well they are avoiding the AOE damage, plus wearing the absolute best gear... Etc...) If so, you'll probably find that HoT and AOE heals are covering the damage.
I am not in 25 man content yet, but those questions came to mind when I read your post.
Maybe more info is needed - Armory?
2 posts
The reason I didn't provide armory initially is because I wouldn't like my guildmates to find out that I'm discouraged - they are very kind and encouraging with me, and I wouldn't want to let them know I feel this way just yet. I prefer being cheery for them. I hope this doesn't sound too silly, I'm sorry.
I think my gear is pretty good. I am as well geared or slightly better geared than most of the other healers (with two exceptions). I have a lot of 25-man gear, which I try to gear towards spell power/crit/haste. I try to avoid MP5. My trinkets, necklace and rings are epics from heroics or the heroic vendor (one trinket is a blue), and only one of my armor slots still has an epic from heroics.
I like your questions, I really wonder about #2. I would feel bad asking them to bring less healers, though, just to make me feel better about my role. I don't want anyone to feel left out.
As for #3, I think the tanks are very well-geared but our fights some times take a very long time. Our DPS seems average overall, but I'm not too sure in that department - admittedly, I don't know very much about it.
Do you think #2 is the big problem? It's really the one I wonder about the most and don't know what to do about it (besides roll a class that functions in that setting) if it's true.
Thank you for your response, I really appreciate it.
I think my gear is pretty good. I am as well geared or slightly better geared than most of the other healers (with two exceptions). I have a lot of 25-man gear, which I try to gear towards spell power/crit/haste. I try to avoid MP5. My trinkets, necklace and rings are epics from heroics or the heroic vendor (one trinket is a blue), and only one of my armor slots still has an epic from heroics.
I like your questions, I really wonder about #2. I would feel bad asking them to bring less healers, though, just to make me feel better about my role. I don't want anyone to feel left out.
As for #3, I think the tanks are very well-geared but our fights some times take a very long time. Our DPS seems average overall, but I'm not too sure in that department - admittedly, I don't know very much about it.
Do you think #2 is the big problem? It's really the one I wonder about the most and don't know what to do about it (besides roll a class that functions in that setting) if it's true.
Thank you for your response, I really appreciate it.
If they're not leaving you out on runs I don't think I would complain much. You're their for the 'in case' situations. If your groups are going through bosses without any problems then just be thankful that you have a spot, or if it bugs you give up your spot to a DPS. It sounds like you're grouped with a bunch of top-notched healers that know what they're doing. I did a 25 man OS last night and was the only pally healer, the rest were priest/druids. I barely healed at all. All of their HoTs combined kept everyone topped off.
You could try your hand at respecing. I started doing that and began building an offspec-tank set. I'm no where near close to being a tank, but it goes slowly, piece by piece. Right now though my services are in demand. I'm currently guildless and just advertise on LFG and Trade. I hopped on last night at about 7pm cst and by 11pm I had done 10/25 VoA, 10/25 OS; which is most of my raid calendar for the week. It might not be a lot to some people, but it works out great for my play style. This weekend I'll finish 10-man Naxx with the group that started on Wednesday, and then probably join a 25-man Naxx for Saturday night. It frees me up from having to make commitments for raid times, worrying about getting a spot, any other guild drama.
You could try your hand at respecing. I started doing that and began building an offspec-tank set. I'm no where near close to being a tank, but it goes slowly, piece by piece. Right now though my services are in demand. I'm currently guildless and just advertise on LFG and Trade. I hopped on last night at about 7pm cst and by 11pm I had done 10/25 VoA, 10/25 OS; which is most of my raid calendar for the week. It might not be a lot to some people, but it works out great for my play style. This weekend I'll finish 10-man Naxx with the group that started on Wednesday, and then probably join a 25-man Naxx for Saturday night. It frees me up from having to make commitments for raid times, worrying about getting a spot, any other guild drama.
what Zaetrum said and alot of it. you also have to look at what is there for healers. i know i run my main as feral but pick up resto for a friends guild runs i only run 1.5kish healing on my druid but in 10 mans i pawn they'er healers by keeping rolling hots up on tank and hitting wild regrowth when i see peeps getting hit. now are you running with a few druid/priest/shammies keeping hots up on the the tanks and tossing out aoe heals when on cooldown?? a buddy of mine can be in top 3 of healers in our guild as a pally but he is then top on over healing by alot. but he dont run out of mana doing it. so maybe you can be more preimptive (if that's hwo it's spelled) on the tanks and up your over healing with out messing up your mana. maybe try flashing more on dps and a holy on mt. from what i under stand becon only works on the 5 closest targets to the person when you cast it so if you cast it and have more than 5 melee you never know who you have to heal to get a heal to the tank also. i've yet to try my healing set on 25 man i'm still wanting to to see how it does but if you have alot of hots i think you will be pushed back some just for the fact they are cast and forget about untill almost up and if tank takes a spike you just cast a big fast heal ect..
over all if they aint leaveing you back dont worry about it but pick up off spec asyou can to help where you can.
over all if they aint leaveing you back dont worry about it but pick up off spec asyou can to help where you can.
Quote:
from what i under stand becon only works on the 5 closest targets to the person when you cast it so if you cast it and have more than 5 melee you never know who you have to heal to get a heal to the tank
I think you're refering to the Glyph of Holy Light, which gives 10% of the healing done to your main target to 5 friends within 20 yards when casting HL. Beacon of Light heals the beacon the same amount as you heal anyone else up to full health. So if you heal joe schmoe for 15k, the beacon target will receive 15k as well, assuming none if it is overkill.
I usually just throw beacon on MT or OT and do flash heals/holy shocks around the raid. Again, we're there for the "oh crap" moments. HoT are nice cause they keep everyone topped off, we're great for when the stuff hits the fans. Don't be turned away because you don't feel useful. Keeping the group alive is always priority one, if that's being done than everyone is doing a good job. If you want to top the meters then that's something you'll have to deal with on your own. It's the different styles that make up the group. If you wanna go pure numbers we can pump out quite a bit of healing when called upon....if it's done right we shouldn't have to heal much of anything IMO.
The main reason you're bored/discouraged is because you're bringing 6 healers which is honestly too many. It becomes much more fun when you're trimmed down to about 4 healers, theres more work for everyone, and you don't have 4 healers jumping to toss a heal on the guy who took 800 damage.
6 healers is just plain boring most of the time, and probably overkill in WoTLK.
6 healers is just plain boring most of the time, and probably overkill in WoTLK.
Zaetrum wrote:
[I think you're refering to the Glyph of Holy Light, which gives 10% of the healing done to your main target to 5 friends within 20 yards when casting HL. Beacon of Light heals the beacon the same amount as you heal anyone else within 40 yards of the beacon up to full health. So if you heal joe schmoe for 15k, the beacon target will receive 15k as well, assuming none if it is overkill.
The bolded caveat I added to the quote is probably what the other guy was thinking of.
Hi!
Don't get discouraged. While all healing classes are extremely strong right now, paladins are performing extremely well and are a core part of healing in raids.
/tangent
Healing current content, regardless of class, is pretty lame right now. With itemization and mana regen being what it is, it is pretty easy to just mash buttons and never run out of mana. Which is why Blizzard is taking steps in 3.1 to nerf mana regen on healers, from Spirit on Priests and Druids, to removing Spiritual Attunment and increasing Divine Plea debuff on Paladins etc. There has even been talks of nerfing Replenishment or even core talents like Illumination as a last resort to deal with the problem. I can spam heals and top meters on a Paladin if I wish, or I can focus my target and make sure he lives. With current itemization the only fight I had to worry about mana on was 10 man 3 drakes, back when I still had 10 man gear on and was killing it for server first alliance.
Basically what I am saying is that topping healing meters with current content is not a matter of skill, but rather how fast you can mash buttons across a raid ui.
/tangent off
For gemming, never gem SP (1 slot to make meta work thats it) on a holy paladin, it is wasted stats and contributes to overhealing. Intellect is still probably the best way to go despite divine plea change. Crit is meh but I wouldn't chew someone out for doing it. DO NOT gem haste, at 558 haste with a elemental shaman, ret pally aura, and jotpure you are probably having 1.05 second fol casts and super short (say less than 1.18) Holy Lights. Gemming for it at this point is just unnecessary and wasted stats, more so than spellpower. Also, not that it needs mentioning but gemming Mp5 as any healing class right now is probably the absolutely worst choice you can make, just save the money and leave the gems unslotted it will help you just as much.
Don't get discouraged. While all healing classes are extremely strong right now, paladins are performing extremely well and are a core part of healing in raids.
/tangent
Healing current content, regardless of class, is pretty lame right now. With itemization and mana regen being what it is, it is pretty easy to just mash buttons and never run out of mana. Which is why Blizzard is taking steps in 3.1 to nerf mana regen on healers, from Spirit on Priests and Druids, to removing Spiritual Attunment and increasing Divine Plea debuff on Paladins etc. There has even been talks of nerfing Replenishment or even core talents like Illumination as a last resort to deal with the problem. I can spam heals and top meters on a Paladin if I wish, or I can focus my target and make sure he lives. With current itemization the only fight I had to worry about mana on was 10 man 3 drakes, back when I still had 10 man gear on and was killing it for server first alliance.
Basically what I am saying is that topping healing meters with current content is not a matter of skill, but rather how fast you can mash buttons across a raid ui.
/tangent off
For gemming, never gem SP (1 slot to make meta work thats it) on a holy paladin, it is wasted stats and contributes to overhealing. Intellect is still probably the best way to go despite divine plea change. Crit is meh but I wouldn't chew someone out for doing it. DO NOT gem haste, at 558 haste with a elemental shaman, ret pally aura, and jotpure you are probably having 1.05 second fol casts and super short (say less than 1.18) Holy Lights. Gemming for it at this point is just unnecessary and wasted stats, more so than spellpower. Also, not that it needs mentioning but gemming Mp5 as any healing class right now is probably the absolutely worst choice you can make, just save the money and leave the gems unslotted it will help you just as much.
Bode - 100 Holy Paladin - Lightbringer
As a little addition from a priest; don't think you'll be better off rerolling. Like has been pointed out, your group make-up and the ways your fellow healers play are the most influential factors here. As a disc priest in a guild with 4 healadins I often find myself being 'outhealed'.
Like Bod pointed out, it's currently very easy for most classes to spam abilities without going out of mana. In my case, it's actually me being constantly outhealed by those healadins in my guild - they just stand around spamming 1,5 sec cast time flashes of light on anybody who drops below 95%, where I need to use spells like Penance on targets below 70% to be mana effective. The end result is that I'll end up with a very low amount of healing done on the meters.
This is very much true. I'd say combine all given tips so far - wait for Ulduar and try running with less healers in a raid.
Like Bod pointed out, it's currently very easy for most classes to spam abilities without going out of mana. In my case, it's actually me being constantly outhealed by those healadins in my guild - they just stand around spamming 1,5 sec cast time flashes of light on anybody who drops below 95%, where I need to use spells like Penance on targets below 70% to be mana effective. The end result is that I'll end up with a very low amount of healing done on the meters.
Quote:
Basically what I am saying is that topping healing meters with current content is not a matter of skill, but rather how fast you can mash buttons across a raid ui.
This is very much true. I'd say combine all given tips so far - wait for Ulduar and try running with less healers in a raid.
I hearing your group is nicely geared towards the topside of the raid and could use more dps, maybe 1 less healer...and turn the meter off and enjoy the game. LOL
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