Eyonix on the official warcraft fourms released some warrior changes expected to be in 3.1, this list however is subject to change and the list is not complelete, but this is a start.
WARRIOR
Changing stances now has a much reduced cost: you lose a maximum of 20 rage (10 with Tactical Mastery). For example, if you have 100 rage and change stances, you will have 80 rage remaining. If you have 10 rage and change stances, all of your rage is lost. In addition, we may change the penalties associated with some stances.
You now gain rage when damage done to you is absorbed, such as through a Power Word: Shield.
Blood Frenzy now causes 2/4% physical damage done.
Sunder Armor (and similar debuffs) now reduces armor by 4% per application, and is now a single rank. Creature armor has been globally reduced so that debuffed targets should take about the same damage from physical attacks that they did before this change. The net effect should be that this debuff is slightly less mandatory in PvE and is not disproportionately more powerful against cloth targets in PvP.
We are also adding increased damage to Arms, possibly through Overpower or Slam.
We are also looking at granting rage when the warrior blocks, dodges or parries.
overall i like the changes mentioned, esp. the gaining rage when damage is absorbed, now i love disc priests even more ;D anyway it should be noted that the rage gained from shielding is when a mob (or player) hits you, we still do not gain rage when we hit a shielded target.
thats my 2 cents, post yours! :)
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3.1 warrior changes, post your thoughts!Follow
Ignore this. Misread post.
Edited, Feb 5th 2009 5:15pm by KradortheDruid
Edited, Feb 5th 2009 5:15pm by KradortheDruid
There's nothing too terribly game breaking so far, though it's all positive changes in my opinion. Personally, I can't wait to see what they decide to do with the stance penalties. Zero sum logic behind them is retarded.
It continues to add two stacks of sunder? It's not saying that you only need to apply it once, it's saying that there is only one rank. Right now, there are multiple ranks of sunder armor that you get as you level up that you have to train, each granting a higher level of armor deduction as the rank gets higher and higher. If you've ever grouped with a higher level warrior, for example, and tried to sunder/devastate and gotten the 'A more powerful spell is active', this is what causes this. All this means is that you will train sunder one time, and then be done with it forever after that.
the rage change is interesting. it could turn out worse in some situations, but in most itll probably be a significant help. being at 60 rage in zerker and having to drop 35 of it because i need to go def stance sucks ***. dropping 10 instead is a lot nicer. im cautiously optimistic about that change.
the rage gain on shields change is exactly what warriors have wanted, just back asswards. we dont really care about rage on shields ON US. we care about hitting things with a damage shield on and getting rage. i suppose something is better than nothing, but the way its worded is almost comical, like some dev said "hey, warriors are asking for rage gain on damage shields, so lets give it to 'em! *snicker*!"
stance penalty removals....i can only hope. giving battle stance something aside from being a "neutral" stance would be great. getting rid of the ridiculous def/zerker stance penalties would be enough to satisfy me, albeit not make me "happy". i wont be "happy" with stances until theyre on par with DK presences (which will never happen thanks to skill limitations). but if they can do more than just remove the penalties thatd be great. it really is an outdated mechanic that, imo, needs to be not only removed but the old thinking that goes with it needs to be thrown out. my feeling given what ive seen blizz say about stances is that blizz needs to think about what they need to do to make stances "overpowered", then take it a step further, and implement that, and then we'd have a stance system on par with DK presences.
sunder armor change is....eh. 25% reduction in armor at 5 stacks. nice vs higher armor targets, if we can survive that long. we dont really need too much help vs low armor targets, so no biggie there i suppose (altho mages still suck *** to fight against).
the rage gain on shields change is exactly what warriors have wanted, just back asswards. we dont really care about rage on shields ON US. we care about hitting things with a damage shield on and getting rage. i suppose something is better than nothing, but the way its worded is almost comical, like some dev said "hey, warriors are asking for rage gain on damage shields, so lets give it to 'em! *snicker*!"
stance penalty removals....i can only hope. giving battle stance something aside from being a "neutral" stance would be great. getting rid of the ridiculous def/zerker stance penalties would be enough to satisfy me, albeit not make me "happy". i wont be "happy" with stances until theyre on par with DK presences (which will never happen thanks to skill limitations). but if they can do more than just remove the penalties thatd be great. it really is an outdated mechanic that, imo, needs to be not only removed but the old thinking that goes with it needs to be thrown out. my feeling given what ive seen blizz say about stances is that blizz needs to think about what they need to do to make stances "overpowered", then take it a step further, and implement that, and then we'd have a stance system on par with DK presences.
sunder armor change is....eh. 25% reduction in armor at 5 stacks. nice vs higher armor targets, if we can survive that long. we dont really need too much help vs low armor targets, so no biggie there i suppose (altho mages still suck *** to fight against).
Scholar
18 posts
Quor wrote:
the rage change is interesting. it could turn out worse in some situations, but in most itll probably be a significant help. being at 60 rage in zerker and having to drop 35 of it because i need to go def stance sucks ***. dropping 10 instead is a lot nicer. im cautiously optimistic about that change.
The only downside I can see is that if you have 10 (or 20, untalented) rage, and you change stance, you're going to lose it all, whereas now, you are at least ensured that you aren't entirely rage depleted after the stance change. So, pros and cons, but I think a bigger pro than a con ... nothing feels more like a kick in the pants than dumping a full rage bar just to use a single ability.
Quor wrote:
the rage gain on shields change is exactly what warriors have wanted, just back asswards. we dont really care about rage on shields ON US. we care about hitting things with a damage shield on and getting rage. i suppose something is better than nothing, but the way its worded is almost comical, like some dev said "hey, warriors are asking for rage gain on damage shields, so lets give it to 'em! *snicker*!"
Heh, true, generating rage while hitting something with a shield on would be cool. But if you think about this change from a tanking perspective ... this allows those over-eager disc priests to slap a shield on you as much as they want, and you won't land up rage starved due to taking no damage. Also note the new spell that disc priests get which can shield the entire raid ... that would be a totally useless spell if this rage generation change didn't go in.
Quor wrote:
stance penalty removals....i can only hope. giving battle stance something aside from being a "neutral" stance would be great. getting rid of the ridiculous def/zerker stance penalties would be enough to satisfy me, albeit not make me "happy". i wont be "happy" with stances until theyre on par with DK presences (which will never happen thanks to skill limitations). but if they can do more than just remove the penalties thatd be great. it really is an outdated mechanic that, imo, needs to be not only removed but the old thinking that goes with it needs to be thrown out. my feeling given what ive seen blizz say about stances is that blizz needs to think about what they need to do to make stances "overpowered", then take it a step further, and implement that, and then we'd have a stance system on par with DK presences.
To be honest, I would be happy with the removal of the damage (in/out) penalties of zerk/def stances, and the addition of perhaps a haste or movement speed buff for battle. true, it would probably still not be totally on par with DK presences, but it would go an immensely long way to making it feel like we're not being overly penalised for play a warrior.
Quor wrote:
sunder armor change is....eh. 25% reduction in armor at 5 stacks. nice vs higher armor targets, if we can survive that long. we dont really need too much help vs low armor targets, so no biggie there i suppose (altho mages still suck *** to fight against).
Kinda meh, agreed - but hey, we can't have ALL the changes going our way in one list, now can we ? ;-)
Quote:
Changing stances now has a much reduced cost: you lose a maximum of 20 rage (10 with Tactical Mastery). For example, if you have 100 rage and change stances, you will have 80 rage remaining. If you have 10 rage and change stances, all of your rage is lost. In addition, we may change the penalties associated with some stances.
Nice one. It may actually be worth switching out of Berserker Stance for an Overpower when soloing, and I think this will be a pretty decent PVP buff. I'm curious to see what they end up trying with the penalties.
Quote:
You now gain rage when damage done to you is absorbed, such as through a Power Word: Shield.
Again a buff, but IMO this one is more aimed at helping out Disc Priests, as much of their "preventive" healing takes place through shields -- should reduce some of the current "cost" of having a Disc priest come along as your healer (or as a tank/off-tank healer in raids).
Quote:
Blood Frenzy now causes 2/4% physical damage done.
Buff to Arms, which needs it.
Quote:
We are also adding increased damage to Arms, possibly through Overpower or Slam.
How wonderful - just nebulous enough not to pin anything down, but enough to whet the appetite. :) I'm interested in seeing how they want to do this -- Overpower is one of those annoying abilities that seems to proc less often as your gear (specifically your Expertise) improves and you're getting dodged less often (though dmg per Overpower could increase). Depending on how they do it, they could introduce a whole buttload of RNG back into Arms -- then again, if I can see it hopefully Blizz can too. Maybe a % proc on hit or crit. Maybe a buff to Rend (whatever that talent is in Arms that can proc Overpower off of Rend ticks)?
im actually having second thoughts about the rage stancing change in pvp. rarely is a warrior in a "rage rich" situation in pvp; usually we're being kited and are generally using abilities as soon as we have the rage for them. this means under low-rage situations (25 and under) warriors will be hurting more from this change than they would be gaining from it. a great example is swapping to disarm or spell reflect while at 25 rage or less. without TM youll lack the rage to SR, and will have to rely on bloodrage for anything you need to do.
it also means quick stance changes at the beginning of combat (or really any time) are a bad thing. my charge > zerker macro isnt going to see as much use since ill charge, hamstring, hit once with each weapon then be at <10 rage thanks to the stance switch (whereas before id be at 20+). in short, its heavily discouraging rapid stance switches. think of it as enforcing a soft cap minimum of time that we have to spend in a certain stance before swapping, or else we risk being at 0 rage more often than not.
Edited, Feb 6th 2009 2:12pm by Quor
it also means quick stance changes at the beginning of combat (or really any time) are a bad thing. my charge > zerker macro isnt going to see as much use since ill charge, hamstring, hit once with each weapon then be at <10 rage thanks to the stance switch (whereas before id be at 20+). in short, its heavily discouraging rapid stance switches. think of it as enforcing a soft cap minimum of time that we have to spend in a certain stance before swapping, or else we risk being at 0 rage more often than not.
Edited, Feb 6th 2009 2:12pm by Quor
Scholar
30 posts
Finally we don't get our rage wiped out (but is TM now sorta mandatory if you stance-dance?), we're now similar to druids as their mana isn't wiped when shape-shifting (plus they don't have to generate mana from zero, not a dig a druid I assure you just a quick comparison). But we're still going to have BR on constant CD.
In addition, we may change the penalties associated with some stances.
Please do, 3% crit bonus isn't really enough incentive to be in constant zerker stance (I guess if you get Imp. zerker stance - 10% more AP and 10% less threat it's not so bad). But it's bad enough taking +10% more dmg. in zerker stance, but with abilities that increase dmg. recieved by an additional 5% (Death Wish) and 20% (Recklessness), it makes it rather painful as a Fury warrior (admittedly Recklessness is more of a finisher move, but when talented, it can be used more often).
More DPS in Arms = good. Just do not use Slam.
Generating rage when when block or parry has been a long time in coming, technically they hit us but no dmg is caused. So why didn't we have this from the start?? Obviously a miss doesn't touch us so I don't mind not generating rage from that.
When were we able to get close enough to a clothie to use sunder armour anyway? Let alone waste rage on it when an overpower or WW would be much more useful? Does this mean we still have to stack sunder armour on a target or do it once and then refresh it?
Edited, Feb 9th 2009 11:36am by Zyven
In addition, we may change the penalties associated with some stances.
Please do, 3% crit bonus isn't really enough incentive to be in constant zerker stance (I guess if you get Imp. zerker stance - 10% more AP and 10% less threat it's not so bad). But it's bad enough taking +10% more dmg. in zerker stance, but with abilities that increase dmg. recieved by an additional 5% (Death Wish) and 20% (Recklessness), it makes it rather painful as a Fury warrior (admittedly Recklessness is more of a finisher move, but when talented, it can be used more often).
More DPS in Arms = good. Just do not use Slam.
Generating rage when when block or parry has been a long time in coming, technically they hit us but no dmg is caused. So why didn't we have this from the start?? Obviously a miss doesn't touch us so I don't mind not generating rage from that.
When were we able to get close enough to a clothie to use sunder armour anyway? Let alone waste rage on it when an overpower or WW would be much more useful? Does this mean we still have to stack sunder armour on a target or do it once and then refresh it?
Edited, Feb 9th 2009 11:36am by Zyven
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