Blue posts regarding roguesFollow

This list was begun on 02/05/09 and will be updated each time a new official post regarding rogues is found. My primary source on this is MMO-Champion.

02/09/09
Hunger for Blood (Assassination): Now increases damage 5% per stack, (up from 3%.)
Mind Numbing Poison now reduces cast time by 30%, down from 60%.
Mutilate damage will now do 20% increased damage against poisoned targets, down from 50%.
Slice and Dice: This ability now increases melee attack speed by 40%, up from 30%.

02/05/09
3.1.0 Killing Spree
Just imagine it is exactly like the current Killing Spree except that your dps goes up while Killing Spree is active. (Source)

3.1.0 Hunger for Blood
The idea with Hunger for Blood is you will probably have bleeds available from other classes in a raid setting (and even if you didn't you can add them yourself). But in PvP it will require an extra step to really benefit from HfB and thus tone down Assassination burst damage a little.

There are more related changes, some sooner and some in 3.1. We didn't want to list every single change, just a sampling. (EDIT: To prevent a lot more posts from saying the same thing, we know HfB is not popular in PvP now. We don't want to change that as a consequence of these other changes. (Source))

3.1.0 Hunger for Blood (Continued)
The idea with Hunger for Blood is you will probably have bleeds available from other classes in a raid setting (and even if you didn't you can add them yourself). We are making several changes to rogue talents and abilities. Some are coming before 3.1. Some of them are definitely with the intention of toning down PvP burst. If we buff HfB and change some other rogue abilities, there is a risk that HfB will end up getting used for PvP. The extra bleed requirement should help discourage that and thus still satisfy our goal to tone down Assassination burst damage a little. (Source)

Rogue burst damage
We are reducing it. These changes are not all of the changes. (Source)

Can we expect any more PvE Buffs?
These changes are not all of the changes. (Source)

Vanish
"Working as intended" gets used too broadly. With Vanish, the issue is more like: we think there are probably some bugs with it still somewhere, but whenever we sit down and try to replicate those bugs so we can get to the bottom of the problem, the dumb spell works perfectly. (Source)

02/05/09
Hunger for Blood – instead of a self-buff, this ability can only be used when there is a bleed effect on the target. However, it has no stacks and grants a 15% damage bonus.

Adrenaline Rush – the cooldown on this ability has been lowered.

Lightning Reflexes – reduced to 3 ranks. In addition to 2/4/6% dodge, this talent now also grants 4/7/10% passive melee haste.

Killing Spree – while this ability is active, the rogue does 20% additional damage.

Savage Combat – now causes 2/4% physical damage done.

Mace Specialization – this talent now grants haste in addition to armor penetration.

Edited, Feb 7th 2009 7:37pm by EonSprinter

Edited, Feb 7th 2009 7:48pm by EonSprinter

Edited, Feb 9th 2009 9:04am by EonSprinter

Not enough information at the moment - but it doesn't say anything about consuming rupture. I'm certain they wouldn't do that. I would love it if the new HfB, once applied, lasted until the mob was dead.

I think that our DPS on trash will be negatively affected.

I'm guessing combat rogues will now be dropping two points of improved sprint and one point of endurance and putting it in lightning reflex for the increased haste.

Wonder if we'll be able to make a Rupture/HfB macro?

Ugh. Buffing Combat, nerfing Mutilate.

Shoot me now.

Hmmm... unless HfB is an automatic playeraura, it could end up being a nerf compared to Combat post patch. But I imagine it'll be on auto as in "Whenever there is a bleed effect on target, player gains Hunger for Blood" or something like that. Also note that this change could make assassination just about as easy to apply a DPS cycle to as combat. Just need to match SnD refresh time to Rupture's uptime. Also note that getting Garrote in first rather than just running up to the target and hacking could make a difference. Could me more raid rogues actually needing to stealth =)

The change to Spree could push a lot of players back to combat... Great in combination with bloodlust and a haste pot.

Nicely organized thread, thanks Eon! Keep up the good works.

I think of it as a flat 6% dps increase over the old HfB, and, depending on how the new version works, there may be room to add eviscerate into the muti "rotation."

More damage for less energy. It's a buff in my opinion. Though how its numbers pan out versus combat is yet to be seen.

Edited, Feb 6th 2009 8:49am by EonSprinter

They're doing the same thing now that they did in BC. Herding everyone towards one particular spec in order to min/max. Well, the people with the gear for it at least, I still don't have a MH to use for combat yet.

All in all, I think it is complete crap. Eon, I think you missed one Blue quote in particular that caught my eye.



So they(as does anyone who raids) know our dps is low compared to other pure DPS classes, yet they're only buffing combat? Their big goal during raiding this expansion was removing the "raid composition requirement". It's bad enough that my guild doesn't have an enh shaman, losing out on a decent chunk of dps right there, but not having a consistent feral druid or dps warrior just plain blows.

As far as our burst damage in PvP...where the hell is the mage or hunter nerf?

Edited, Feb 6th 2009 12:40pm by Salwrathis

I think if HfB were to become something similar to Cut to the chase.
Once applied it is refreshed by rupture or other bleed effects and is removed when the bleed ends.

I would be nice at least, only having to worry about envemon and rupture. :3

Well, for one, I don't see it as a nerf since we don't lose DPS where it matters. And second, we still don't know how it works yet - maybe the idea is that you garotte a mob, pop the ability which then lasts 30 seconds, and then go about your trash 'rotation' as normal.

As Morbo would say: PERCENTAGES DO NOT WORK THAT WAY!

1.09 x 1 = 1.09
1.15 x 1 = 1.15
Difference = 0.06

Is 0.06 6 percent of 1.09? No, it bloody well isn't.

Ah, got it. My mistake. Apologies to the mathletes.

Edited, Feb 7th 2009 7:42pm by EonSprinter

Updated the OP.