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Loving my new PriestessFollow

#1 Feb 04 2009 at 7:21 AM Rating: Good
18 posts
Hi folks.

A while back, I decided to level a healer, having leveled a warrior, rogue, mage and DK to 70 (the mage has gone to 75, and the warrior is on the brink on 80.) I play all 4 classes as DPS (well, I suppose that's all a rogue or mage can do), but have recently committed to respecing my warrior and building him as a tank.

I've been playing this game for 2 and a half years now, and have finally decided that I should start playing according to the Multiplayer rules that this game is based upon .. ie, playing with others ;-) Respeccing as tank was the first step ... rolling a healer is the second (seeing as none of my other toons can pass as a healer ... bandaging doesn't count ;->)

So I came here, my go-to resource for all things WoW, and read up a few things regarding all the healer classes available ... I settled on Priest purely because it's the class which (to me at least) embodies the essence of a healer (much the way the warrior embodies the essence of a tank).

I just came here to say thanks for all the wonderful advice you guys deal out. How I managed to get to level 8 (I'm 16 now) without a wand, I will never know ... as soon as my enchanter mage made a "lesser magic wand" and sent it off in the mail, things took a drastic turn for the good (who'd have thought a 12 dps wand would be a better stand-in than a 3 dps mace ... go figure). Using a wand for anything but stats never entered my head before I read it here.

Of course, spending the first 3 points in Spirit Tap turned out to be a mandatory move (something I wouldn't have done, putting my points in blackout instead) ... they should be allocated there by default as soon as you hit level 10, 11 and 12 ... such is the profound difference it made on the leveling experience. I went from (before acquiring the wand) using 75% of my mana pool per mob, and subsequently drinking after every fight to now pretty much not stopping at all (Wise use of the wand at relevant times helping out there amazingly).

Just point or 2 I've picked up while reading some of the recent threads here.

1) Someone mentioned casting SW:P before MB once you get to a certain level to make use of some talents at that level, specifically pointing out that this would change your earlier leveling rotations. I'm assuming the talent being referred to here is Misery. Now, the question is ... is the 15% extra damage to Mind Blast calculated when you start casting, or when the cast is finished. I ask this because if it is calculated at start of the cast, then sure, it makes perfect send to hit your SW:P button first. However, if (while using quartz or the equivalent) you start casting MB, then hit SW:P just before the cast bar finishes ... then SW:P is applied before MB, theoretically giving MB it's extra 15%.

2) Is blackout any good in a Shadow leveling spec ... a chance to stun sounds great, but if I wanted to get Mindflay at 20, I would need to skip either blackout or imp SW:P. I suppose I could always go back and pick those up, but with Mindflay applying a slow, is spending 5 points searching for a stun really worth it.

Thanks again folks, keep the good stuff coming.


Edited, Feb 4th 2009 10:26am by Calimo

Edited, Feb 4th 2009 10:27am by Calimo
#2 Feb 04 2009 at 7:32 AM Rating: Good
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4,684 posts
Quote:
Someone mentioned casting SW:P before MB once you get to a certain level to make use of some talents at that level, specifically pointing out that this would change your earlier leveling rotations. I'm assuming the talent being referred to here is Misery. Now, the question is ... is the 15% extra damage to Mind Blast calculated when you start casting, or when the cast is finished.


It's calculated once the cast is finished. It basically works the same way as with trinkets that temporarily add spellpower - if you start up a 3 second heal with 2 seconds left to go on the buff, the buff will expire before the heal lands and you lose it's benefit. That said, it is important to note that spells like Renew and Prayer of Mending are entirely based on the amount of spellpower the caster has at the moment the spell is cast. This means that if you have a +500 spellpower buff and you throw up a Renew and the buff is removed one second later, all remaining Renew ticks will act as if you still had that +500 spellpower. This is also what makes it a powerful technique to throw down a Prayer of Mending in the last tick of your spellpower buff.

Quote:
I ask this because if it is calculated at start of the cast, then sure, it makes perfect send to hit your SW:P button first. However, if (while using quartz or the equivalent) you start casting MB, then hit SW:P just before the cast bar finishes ... then SW:P is applied before MB, theoretically giving MB it's extra 15%.


I'm not entirely sure, but I think this idea doesn't work. The thing is, the reason your Mind Blast hits before the cast bar finishes is lag. While I'm no total expert on the mechanics of the game and lag, I dare to say that the chance that you land your SW:P before your Mind Blast by using this technique is extremely small if it exists at all. I haven't tried it though, so I could be wrong - feel free to correct me.

Edit:
Quote:
2) Is blackout any good in a Shadow leveling spec ... a chance to stun sounds great, but if I wanted to get Mindflay at 20, I would need to skip either blackout or imp SW:P. I suppose I could always go back and pick those up, but with Mindflay applying a slow, is spending 5 points searching for a stun really worth it.


While we're on it; I don't think Blackout is included in the average leveling spec because most mobs should die before they even reach you. As far as I know it's primarily a PvP talent, but once again, proper spriests are free to correct me.

Edited, Feb 4th 2009 4:33pm by Mozared
#3 Feb 04 2009 at 7:42 AM Rating: Good
18 posts
Mozared wrote:

I'm not entirely sure, but I think this idea doesn't work. The thing is, the reason your Mind Blast hits before the cast bar finishes is lag. While I'm no total expert on the mechanics of the game and lag, I dare to say that the chance that you land your SW:P before your Mind Blast by using this technique is extremely small if it exists at all. I haven't tried it though, so I could be wrong - feel free to correct me.

Fair enough, makes sense actually ... the only reason you're actually able to cast SW:P "Before" MB is finished casting is because MB has actually already finished casting ... that little red section in quartz is actually indicating that the cast is finished.

So, once I start getting misery, I open with SW:P ... seems contrary to the basic rules when working with timed casts and instant casts from a GCD perspective ... but it makes perfect sense.

Mozared wrote:

While we're on it; I don't think Blackout is included in the average leveling spec because most mobs should die before they even reach you. As far as I know it's primarily a PvP talent, but once again, proper spriests are free to correct me.


That's pretty much what I figured .. I just need confirmation.

Thanks.
#4 Feb 04 2009 at 7:57 AM Rating: Excellent
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4,074 posts
First of all, welcome! Hang around a while. We haz c00kies.

My personal 2 cents on Blackout for PVE leveling is to skip it. It's a neat talent, but as a priest you don't need to kite much (I recall a similar mage talent in, I think, the frost tree (?) that's great for leveling due to the different playstyle) and there are too many other goodies in the Shadow tree to spend points there.
#5 Feb 04 2009 at 8:29 AM Rating: Good
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679 posts
I also say skip blackout. Its nice, but it just holds you up from getting the better talents further down the tree.
#6 Feb 04 2009 at 10:58 AM Rating: Excellent
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1,574 posts
Mind Blast isn’t like Fireball where there’s “air time” between when it is cast and when it hits its target. It’s like Scorch, where the instant it’s done, it takes effect. So you can’t land your SWP on your target before the MB hits the way a Warlock could land a Curse of the Elements while a Shadowbolt was on its way to the target.
#7 Feb 04 2009 at 11:00 AM Rating: Decent
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988 posts
Quote:
I also say skip blackout. Its nice, but it just holds you up from getting the better talents further down the tree.


Besides, IIRC, there were some blue posts recently about the desire/intention to remove those random stuns entirely.
#8 Feb 04 2009 at 11:30 AM Rating: Decent
Can someone please answer a question for me?

I have been playing my priest for awhile and she's 80 now, but when I look around different forums and occasionally shadowpriest.com, I see a lot of spell rotations that include SW Death in the middle.
Why is this? If you do Shadow Word Death in the middle of your spell roation doesn't that take a portion of your life away if it doesn't kill your target?
I'm baffled by this as I always use/used it as a finishing move.

What are everyone else's thoughts on this?

-Trist
#9 Feb 04 2009 at 11:55 AM Rating: Good
18 posts
teacake wrote:
First of all, welcome! Hang around a while. We haz c00kies.

My personal 2 cents on Blackout for PVE leveling is to skip it. It's a neat talent, but as a priest you don't need to kite much (I recall a similar mage talent in, I think, the frost tree (?) that's great for leveling due to the different playstyle) and there are too many other goodies in the Shadow tree to spend points there.


Thanks Tea, I sure will stick around, I'm really enjoying the priest (it's my 3rd attempt at one, I wish someone had told me about the importance of wands and spirit tap before ;->).

Yup, the frost talent is Frostbite, and there's an equivalent one in the fire tree called impact. Impact is a 50/50 talent, as in 50% of people will tell you that you need it for leveling, the other 50% will say it's useless. I leveled fire and never speced intto impact, and I can't say I missed it, specifically for the reason Moz pointed out ... things die way before they get to you even if a stun isn't around to stop them for 3 seconds.

Frostbite's another issue though - it's useful not because of the mechanic that allows it to stop your target in it's advance, but rather for the synergy with the talent "Shatter", which drastically increases your crit chance against frozen targets, which targets are considered under frostbite. And yes, it's helluva helpful for kiting.

Heh, yup - the other goodies in the shadow tree are what really got me thinking about the necessity of blackout ... it all looks awesome, and I can't wait to dip further into it ;-)

emmitsvenson wrote:

Mind Blast isn’t like Fireball where there’s “air time” between when it is cast and when it hits its target. It’s like Scorch, where the instant it’s done, it takes effect. So you can’t land your SWP on your target before the MB hits the way a Warlock could land a Curse of the Elements while a Shadowbolt was on its way to the target.

Of course (D'oh) ... that makes perfect sense, never even thought about that .. thanks.


Edited, Feb 4th 2009 3:07pm by Calimo
#10 Feb 04 2009 at 11:59 AM Rating: Good
As a Shadow Priest, you'll be on DPS duty. DPS means doing as much damage as you possibly can, and SW:D is part of that. It's a quite big dps spell, when used whenever it's off cooldown. In a raid, you'll be receiving raidheals all over the place, and if the tank knows what he's doing you'll be using VE as well. The damage you sustain from SW:D is not enough to kill you with all the incoming heals and the damage caused is worth it.

In soloing, the damage caused by SW:D is easily negated by using your Shield. The same goes for five mans, where the healer shouldn't have to spend too much time on the dps. There you'll be using SW:D on bosses and you'll Shield most of the damage away. In Raids however, you shouldn't be wasting a GCD or Mana on a Shield and should just eat the incoming damage knowing that you'll be healed right back up again.

Here's a tip: Go find the level 80 target dummy, and blast all you can at it. Use SW:D every time it's up, using Shield when that's up. You'll find that you can survive for quite some time even with the SW:D damage incoming. Now imagine that you're in a raid where the other healers are throwing HoTs at you, and VE helps them out.

Edit: This was for Tomatosauce, not the post above.

Edited, Feb 4th 2009 3:00pm by NorthAI
#11 Feb 04 2009 at 12:35 PM Rating: Decent
I don't usually use my shield unless I absolutley need it. I just put up VE.
So are you saying that I should try and use SW:D every time the cooldown is up, or just once on a mob?
#12 Feb 04 2009 at 12:52 PM Rating: Good
In a dps situation (bossfights and so on) you want to use it every time it's off cooldown. While soloing, it's entirely up to you. Want to take the mob down fast, SW:D. Want a slightly slower killrate, but much steadier progress, don't. In a five man situation, or on trash, it's hardly necessary to use SW:D unless it needs to go down fast for some reason.

All bosses, SW:D at all times. Trash, up to you. Soloing, same.
#13 Feb 04 2009 at 1:01 PM Rating: Good
Quote:
In a dps situation (bossfights and so on) you want to use it every time it's off cooldown. While soloing, it's entirely up to you. Want to take the mob down fast, SW:D. Want a slightly slower killrate, but much steadier progress, don't. In a five man situation, or on trash, it's hardly necessary to use SW:D unless it needs to go down fast for some reason.

All bosses, SW:D at all times. Trash, up to you. Soloing, same.



I got it.
I will practice that tonight.

Thanks for your help.
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