I am Chinese, I may not express everything the way you guys do,
I came up with the idea that dodge is something more useful than hp when you are tanking. you can think of hp as a container filled with blood, the boss are taking it from the container while your healer are adding fresh blood by consuming their mana, as long as the healers don't go beyond your hp limit, the overall blood the boss can take is determined by how much blood your healers can totally provide. when compared to overall hp provided, your initial hp means nothing. but how you can make good use of the hp your healer provided is something can make you live longer. by, dodging more often or mitigating more damage dealt by boss.
but I am not a "professional" player, I just say things the way I feel. how you guys think about this? or why hp is important as it seems to be?
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I feel both overall HP and dodge are very important stats for a tank. For a druid, more so than other tanks giving that we it's our only damage avoidance stat besides armor mitigation. Though, it would be absurd to concentrate fully on either stat fully. A balance is needed to be a successful tank.
To accentuate my point, if you are fully relying on dodge in order to tank and have a comparatively low health pool magic bases attacks are going to sack your lunch. Likewise, if you are /flexing with a 40k hp pool and no dodge then you'll find your healers out of mana in long fights because you're going to be taking a constant stream of damage with little hope of an attack missing.
Those are drastic examples that I kind of just thought of but you get my point, eh?
To accentuate my point, if you are fully relying on dodge in order to tank and have a comparatively low health pool magic bases attacks are going to sack your lunch. Likewise, if you are /flexing with a 40k hp pool and no dodge then you'll find your healers out of mana in long fights because you're going to be taking a constant stream of damage with little hope of an attack missing.
Those are drastic examples that I kind of just thought of but you get my point, eh?
You need to take some damage in order to maintain threat. If you never got hit then you would never gain enough rage to do your threat gaining abilities often enough to maintain threat over the DPS. Druid tanks are blessed with a very large amount of HP for the reason that we cannot block or parry, we only have dodge and armor.
weeedoggy wrote:
If you never got hit then you would never gain enough rage
I gain rage when I dodge.
But any way Serevixx is correct and you need a balance of health, dodge and armor.
The elements must be aligned for a bear to function with proper harmony. The elements being dodge, health, talents, armor and skill.
Hellbanned
idiggory wrote:
Drinking at home. But I could probably stand to get laid.
I have 28,000 health. If/When I get Essence of the Gossamer I'll crack 30k.
Since I don't do much above 10-mans, I don't think I need more health. I can absorb a few boss hits if my healers are incapacitated. So I will be working on my dodge. It's at 38% and I want to get it to 40%. Every bear has to make his or her own calculations like this. After tanking for a while you will figure out where the balance lies for you.
Since I don't do much above 10-mans, I don't think I need more health. I can absorb a few boss hits if my healers are incapacitated. So I will be working on my dodge. It's at 38% and I want to get it to 40%. Every bear has to make his or her own calculations like this. After tanking for a while you will figure out where the balance lies for you.
One of our main tanks, they switch from MT to OT throughout bosses, is a feral druid with about 45k health raid buffed and has somewhere around 50% or higher dodge and honestly I think both are way too important to be stacking for one over the other.
Just keep them balanced like everyone else is saying its way too important than stacking the other higher.
Just keep them balanced like everyone else is saying its way too important than stacking the other higher.
I'm feeling that my health is pretty solid right now (42k raid buffed) so my main focus has been on avoiding damage now - putting in dodge or AGI gems to boost armor and dodge.
Your initial priority should be to get a big enough lifepool to be able to survive unlucky burst damage from bosses. For heroics & 10mans you are looking at around 30-35k health bufffed, for 25 mans aim for 35-40k buffed (higher for Patchwerk & >50k is best for Sartarion with 3 dragons up). After you reach that figure it becomes more important to reduce the overall damage taken through agi, dodge & defense to reduce the total healing you need. Bascially, survival is your first priority, then endurance (making sure your healers don't go OOM) is your next priority.
A side issue to these is picking up enough +hit & +expertise to help with threat and taunts.
A side issue to these is picking up enough +hit & +expertise to help with threat and taunts.
Quote:
35-40k buffed (higher for Patchwerk
After the slaughter we had last night, I'm wondering if perhaps lower health might be better for him as I kept getting double tapped by his big shot due to having so much more health then the other tanks in the raid. O_o
As a plus point, bears got the AC that they lost with the expansion back with this patch so I'm up to 32k AC again!
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Yeah, you addressed my concern very well, the question go to survival or endurance. much as you would apply adjustment strategy in F1 racing game for different tracks, you may want to go for one over the other according to the boss your team are against. for boss with tremendous hp but low damage. I guess endurance is a key factor for your team to get through the battle. while boss with less hp but high damage or something can make you down in a second, then look for survivability. agree?
Edited, Jan 20th 2009 8:22pm by baroquechou
Edited, Jan 20th 2009 8:23pm by baroquechou
Edited, Jan 20th 2009 8:22pm by baroquechou
Edited, Jan 20th 2009 8:23pm by baroquechou
The boss' health doesn't mean all that much to your tank set up - its how he hits and what he hits you with.
Say you've got a boss that does only a little physical damage but a high amount of spell damage - in that case then health and resist is more important then armor and dodge and you therefor may want to change gear a bit to compensate.
For most bosses though, its all about a good mix of health, armor and dodge.
Once you hit 80 and start raiding, make sure your health (unbuffed) is at around 30k, armor in the mid 20k average and dodge at least 30% - those are good, solid base numbers to get started.
Say you've got a boss that does only a little physical damage but a high amount of spell damage - in that case then health and resist is more important then armor and dodge and you therefor may want to change gear a bit to compensate.
For most bosses though, its all about a good mix of health, armor and dodge.
Once you hit 80 and start raiding, make sure your health (unbuffed) is at around 30k, armor in the mid 20k average and dodge at least 30% - those are good, solid base numbers to get started.
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