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#27 Jan 06 2009 at 3:45 PM Rating: Good
Eh, parry hasting has been more or less adjusted for boss encounters, you won't find parry gibbing on bosses where parry gibbing would actually matter like Patchwerk. It's been balanced for. There is a blue post stating that, if you want to dig through trackers.

That being said, the problem you'll run into is primarily threat generation as a DW Frost tank. I have ran with DW tanks in better gear than me (as 2h tanker), and the primary problem is threat not parry-hasting.

Right now, there is no reliable source of data, EJ included, for the definitive conclusion for DKs simply because we are under-documented for being a new class. What I can tell you is that the cookie cutter Frost builds you see will be better than the Unholy builds right now with the changes to BA and UA once the new patch hits live.
#28 Jan 07 2009 at 12:18 AM Rating: Decent
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A. I personally wouldn't use the Unbreakable Armor glyph. 25% of a DK's strength becomes parry rating as it is, so Unbreakable Armor increases your parry chance by more than 5% in its standard state. As your gear gets better, this goes up. You also get additional TpS this way. I also have a personal hatred of glyphs that give one bonus, but sacrifice another. I'd say UA in its standard form is 6-7% parry (does anyone know the converstion of parry rating to % at 80, and the current average for Str in tanking gear?).

B. Making abilities free is never something to frown upon. It just makes RP dumps better. Sure, there ARE other glyphs you can use. And, if they work better for you, use them. But these will be especially nice when you are in that 5-10 man without BoS.

C. I wouldn't scoff at making a taunt resist 8% less. I HATE resisted taunts with a fiery passion. Considering how DK threat generation goes, I would appreciate them not failing.


But, either way, I would never waste a spot on Improved Rune Tap as Frost tank. I rather not waste a glyph on an ability that takes a Blood Rune to generate no hate, when my party shouldn't be taking that much damage in the first place.

I am more of an Unholy tank at heart, which has much clearer glyph choices (in my opinion).

Glyph of DnD is always good for trash tanking. I don't know how it fares against bosses.

And I'll look at that build in the morning.
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#29 Jan 07 2009 at 8:36 AM Rating: Decent
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remember that parry gained from STR gets diminishing returns, but parry gained from pure parry abilities does not, thats why UA glyph will be better than STR.
#30 Jan 07 2009 at 1:26 PM Rating: Decent
On a side note, relating to all the glyph discussion, this is what seems to be the glyphs to be used:
  • Glyph of Icebound Fortitude

  • Glyph of Death and Decay
  • Glyph of Dark Command

  • The only minor glyph to really do anything after the patch fixing Horn of Winter would be Glyph of Death's Embrace to heal yourself while using Lichborn/ghoul and Glyph of Pestilence to help AoE tank.


    Edited, Jan 7th 2009 6:29pm by Lichbourne
    #31 Jan 07 2009 at 1:28 PM Rating: Decent
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    I wasn't saying that the 10% strength would be equal to the 10% parry otherwise, I was saying that I would prefer 6-7% Parry with a TpS buff than just a 10%.

    If my only interest was in parry, however, I would agree that the glyphed form was superior to the standard.

    And, Lichbourne, the second build looks good to me. If you REALLY want Rune Tap, drop Hungering Cold for it. Otherwise, you are good to go.


    [EDIT]

    And for those interested in Unholy Tanking, Glyph of Bone Shield will be your best friend.

    Edited, Jan 7th 2009 4:30pm by idiggory
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    #32 Jan 07 2009 at 3:47 PM Rating: Decent
    Ack, was just browsing my guild roster and found three 80 DKs who raid that have Imp. Icy Talon.I am sure there are several other DKs who are leveling that will take this up as well.Should I scrap the Talons on my build, causing some other points to be placed in other talents to keep most of the tree unlocked, or keep it?

    Edited, Jan 7th 2009 6:21pm by Lichbourne
    #33 Jan 08 2009 at 10:38 AM Rating: Decent
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    I'd get rid of it then, if you will be raiding with them. Are they DpS specced or Tank specced? Because that changes the likelihood of you being in the raid with them. But, if you do drop Icy Talons, I would recommend looking at what EJ does in that situation with this build.

    Killing Machine can be great or horrible, depending on your weapon speed and such (it is a nice boost for Dual Wielding DpS DKs, but a miniscule bonus for 1-handers).

    I WOULD, however, drop Hungering Cold. That would give you 7 extra points to work with.
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    #34 Jan 08 2009 at 1:30 PM Rating: Decent
    Thanks for the tip, the EJ build posted seems to work fine. I might monkey with it for grins, se what I can come up with.
    EDIT:Our main DK tank does have Icy Talons, so even more a reason to go with this build
    EDIT:What should I do about Frost Aura in this build? It has been said that it isnt great compared to to other resistance buffs,as it will not stack. The problem is, Icy Talons held the points that allowed for the later arms of the tree to be unlocked w/o this and other DPS talents. it seem to be a nessicary waste of points.



    Edited, Jan 8th 2009 3:42pm by Lichbourne
    #35 Jan 08 2009 at 3:58 PM Rating: Decent
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    If your main DK doesn't have Frost Aura, go for it. Otherwise, I'd say go for KM (at least just as a point dump to get to the later talents, putting others wherever you want them).
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    #36 Jan 08 2009 at 4:43 PM Rating: Decent
    Problem is, KM is alredy in the build. I found that Icy Reach does the job as well as Frost Aura for the point dump, but is it the right dump? Aclimation would work great for this purpose, acctualy adding some extra stackable resistance, but it is to deep to work it seems.
    EDIT: If I remember right, the tank DK doest have Frost Aura,might work as is then, the EJ build



    Edited, Jan 8th 2009 6:46pm by Lichbourne
    #37 Jan 08 2009 at 5:42 PM Rating: Decent
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    And, with the modern economy, respecs aren't really THAT expensive. Just keep working on it--you'll find a build that fits both you and the guild.
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    #38 Jan 09 2009 at 6:41 AM Rating: Good
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    Anyone know yet what kind of stats we need to achieve before heroics and raiding? I'm at 545 defense, but I'm wondering more about health and AP/strength.

    Thanks
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    #39 Jan 10 2009 at 6:01 AM Rating: Decent
    If you havnt heard yet but that wonderful 2h Blacksmith tanking weapon they were gonna add in the patch is no longer gonna be added. Bliz decided they didnt want to back DK's into a corner in having to get it and wanted them to be able to be more diverse. They are still adding the rune that increases your defense rating by a nice margin for 2h weapons but if you get a decent pair of 1h then you lose that advantage anyway. Sorry for those that were hoping for that weapon though, it would have made duel wielding tanks pointless...
    #40 Jan 10 2009 at 11:59 AM Rating: Decent
    I really hope this isn't true:\
    Quote:
    If you havnt heard yet but that wonderful 2h Blacksmith tanking weapon they were gonna add in the patch is no longer gonna be added. Bliz decided they didnt want to back DK's into a corner in having to get it and wanted them to be able to be more diverse


    All classses have been waiting for these weapons since they were announced. These would have been THE tanking weapon, easy to obtain, and more powerful than Nax/OS/Malygos items. Please Blizz, don't remove this uber wepon.
    #41 Jan 10 2009 at 9:00 PM Rating: Decent
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    There were TWO weapons they were adding. Are both out or just one?

    I have no clue what they intended source was though.
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    IDrownFish wrote:
    Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people

    lolgaxe wrote:
    Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
    #42 Jan 11 2009 at 3:35 PM Rating: Decent
    From what I hear,they are both on a 1G flashdrive in the Blizzard HQ, waiting for the choosen ones to arrive, as foretold by Saltsman in accounting
    (Kudos to anyone who can say where I got that from,just send a message to my account)

    Edited, Jan 11th 2009 5:36pm by Lichbourne
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